Necromancer vs Tinker: Which class would be better for the game?

[Stardrift]

Soul Reaper is considered Soul Magic.Also if DKs dont use ranged magic, what is Howling Blast, Death Coil, Death's Caress, or Clawing Shadows?

You can't be serious lol. Counting those as ranged classified things.

Not only are those abilities belonging to a melee class, they also have shorter range than most other ranged class abilities.

Not to mention a necromancer would be purely ranged with staves and cloth clothing instead of heavy weaponry and metal armour.

Soul reaper is an ability. Not a specialization. DKs in fact do not specialize in soul magic.


Please spend more time understanding how Warcraft and its lore and world works before saying something should or shouldn't be.

Lemme just repeat this: You have no argument against necromancers other than "lul DK". Don't lie, you just don't like the idea because it's popular and often asked for. You're annoyed by it. But you'll remain silent when it's eventually put into the game.

[TheRevenantHero]

You can't be serious lol. Counting those as ranged classified things.

Not only are those abilities belonging to a melee class, they also have shorter range than most other ranged class abilities.

Not to mention a necromancer would be purely ranged with staves and cloth clothing instead of heavy weaponry and metal armour.

Soul reaper is an ability. Not a specialization. DKs in fact do not specialize in soul magic.


Please spend more time understanding how Warcraft and its lore and world works before saying something should or shouldn't be.

Lemme just repeat this: You have no argument against necromancers other than "lul DK". Don't lie, you just don't like the idea because it's popular and often asked for. You're annoyed by it. But you'll remain silent when it's eventually put into the game.

Necromancers, in lore, are wildly illegal. The Kirin Tor outlawed the fuck out of necromancy. Death knights aren't true necromancers, using runic magic. So there is heavy duty lore reasons to never allow necromancers to do a thing. Hell, everyone's biggest issue with Sylvanas is her use of necromancy. So if Blizzard introduced necromancer, it would only be to introduce something edgy and would shit all over the lore.

[TriHard]

I've read some creative stuff. I'm sure Blizzard could take the suggestions out there and make it way better.

https://eu.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...ept-long/33494

I wish, if they had taken suggestions then player housing wouldn't have been so terrible :L
Garrisons btw

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No...by my logic Blizzard had a pattern, then they broke it. I'm saying they could break more patterns...not everything has to be the same old system every single time.

But then we might not see a new class after all, cuz you know, breaking patterns and all!

[Teriz]

You can't be serious lol. Counting those as ranged classified things.

Any ability beyond 5yds is considered ranged.

Not only are those abilities belonging to a melee class, they also have shorter range than most other ranged class abilities.

But that wasn't your argument. Your argument was that DKs dont have ranged abilities, which is a false statement.

Not to mention a necromancer would be purely ranged with staves and cloth clothing instead of heavy weaponry and metal armour.

That's rather irrelevant when you consider that in the end you're looking at a Necromancer class with DK-like abilities and Warlock gameplay. Is that worth putting in the game? I dont think so.

Soul reaper is an ability. Not a specialization. DKs in fact do not specialize in soul magic.

You're moving goal posts. You said abilities, not specs. Also Soul Magic tends to go to Warlocks, so even that wouldn't be unique for this potential class.

Please spend more time understanding how Warcraft and its lore and world works before saying something should or shouldn't be.

Considering you've been wrong in your entire post, you should take your own advice.

Lemme just repeat this: You have no argument against necromancers other than "lul DK". Don't lie, you just don't like the idea because it's popular and often asked for. You're annoyed by it. But you'll remain silent when it's eventually put into the game.

Nah, I'm annoyed by people who dont know what they're talking about, but they act like they do. Case in point.

[Kithelle]

I wish, if they had taken suggestions then player housing wouldn't have been so terrible :L
Garrisons btw

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But then we might not see a new class after all, cuz you know, breaking patterns and all!

Maybe.....who knows, only time and Blizzard will tell. All we know for a fact is that in this community there is definitely a preference of Tinker over Necromancer.

[Teriz]

Maybe.....who knows, only time and Blizzard will tell. All we know for a fact is that in this community there is definitely a preference of Tinker over Necromancer.

Yeah, and the preference isn't even close.

I think players (at least in this community) want a class that offers something new and different and not just a rehash of what already exists within the class lineup.

I also think that people are wary of the possibility that a Necromancer could cause the removal of abilities in existing classes.

[KoolKidKaos]

Both sound trash to me

[tehdef]

Both sound trash to me

You sure are a positive presence.

[TigTone]

This thread should be allowed to live until blizzcon and see what is shown.

For me necromancer and tinker are two classes I really want in WoW.

I just have a feeling that blizz is going to throw a curve ball and it’s going to be something else entirely.

[Cathululock]

Necromancers exist in game. Called an unholy DK. Tinkers could be cool

that's like saying warlock exists as a demon hunter.

I want to be a caster necromancer.

[TriHard]

Maybe.....who knows, only time and Blizzard will tell. All we know for a fact is that in this community there is definitely a preference of Tinker over Necromancer.

On MMO champ, yeah, not in WoW in general though. Necromancer has constantly throughout player polls been top requested followed by Tinker, etc.
The game could use Tinker the most but for some reason, I don't see us getting a class this expansion, it'll probably just be to fix all the current ones

[Kanadei]

On MMO champ, yeah, not in WoW in general though. Necromancer has constantly throughout player polls been top requested followed by Tinker, etc.
The game could use Tinker the most but for some reason, I don't see us getting a class this expansion, it'll probably just be to fix all the current ones

Tinker is good in that it fills a slot for a ranged mail dps but other than that it doesn't fit very well. Classes normally are in theme with the expansion, not sure what kind of expansion would justify a tinker class. Additionally they are conceptually suited to Gnome and Goblin, who aren't very popular as races.

I honestly just don't see it.

[TriHard]

Tinker is good in that it fills a slot for a ranged mail dps but other than that it doesn't fit very well. Classes normally are in theme with the expansion, not sure what kind of expansion would justify a tinker class. Additionally they are conceptually suited to Gnome and Goblin, who aren't very popular as races.

I honestly just don't see it.

Yeah, that's what I mean, it fills all the right spots but it just doesn't fit in with any lore except Mechagon but that's current content and not next expac content.
I'd honestly love to see two classes being released at the same time the way FF14 does it but I don't see that happening.

Would be cool to see 1-60 dungeons full of Necromancer and Tinkers, I think that would make for a very unique feeling.

[Kanadei]

Yeah, that's what I mean, it fills all the right spots but it just doesn't fit in with any lore except Mechagon but that's current content and not next expac content.
I'd honestly love to see two classes being released at the same time the way FF14 does it but I don't see that happening.

Would be cool to see 1-60 dungeons full of Necromancer and Tinkers, I think that would make for a very unique feeling.

Yeah would be interesting for sure.

I also agree with the point others have raised that personal loot solves any issues regarding missing slots for gear, we don't need any more mail because loot isn't evenly distributed like it was in the past. It drops depending on the class, so we could have 9 clothies for all the game cares and it won't hurt anything.

[Kaleredar]

Tinkers are the only ones that make sense and don't actively steal class fantasy away from an existing class.

[Magical Mudcrab]

Necromancers, in lore, are wildly illegal. The Kirin Tor outlawed the fuck out of necromancy.

Which is kind of ironic, seeing how the outlawing of Necromancy led to the banishment of Kel'thuzad, which in turn led to the Cult of the Damned and the spread of the Plague of Undeath over Lordaeron. The outlawing of Necromancy led to the spreading of undeath and the ascension of Kel'thuzad from being an Archmage and member of the Council of Six of the Kirin Tor to being the most powerful necromancer (bar the Lich King, obviously) on Azeroth.

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I also think that people are wary of the possibility that a Necromancer could cause the removal of abilities in existing classes.

To be fair, the concern of the Necromancer causing the loss of some other classes abilities is as valid as the concern that Tinkers will cause Engineering to be removed due to a perceived redundancy.

[Teriz]

To be fair, the concern of the Necromancer causing the loss of some other classes abilities is as valid as the concern that Tinkers will cause Engineering to be removed due to a perceived redundancy.

Well not really since DKs are a class and Engineering is a profession.

Classes compete with one another. Professions do not compete with classes, and a character could be a Tinker class and of the Engineering profession at the same time.

[Stardrift]

Any ability beyond 5yds is considered ranged.



But that wasn't your argument. Your argument was that DKs dont have ranged abilities, which is a false statement.



That's rather irrelevant when you consider that in the end you're looking at a Necromancer class with DK-like abilities and Warlock gameplay. Is that worth putting in the game? I dont think so.



You're moving goal posts. You said abilities, not specs. Also Soul Magic tends to go to Warlocks, so even that wouldn't be unique for this potential class.



Considering you've been wrong in your entire post, you should take your own advice.



Nah, I'm annoyed by people who dont know what they're talking about, but they act like they do. Case in point.

You're nitpicking at nothing lol.

A couple ranged abilities does not surmount to a ranged class's arsenal of ranged abilities. Imagine being so butthurt about necromancers you use a deliberate over-look of a couple mid-ranged abilities as a point as if it proves anything. "SEE, DKs ARE RANGED CLASS". That's like saying a priest can't be a class because paladins are the same things because they have a small handful of ranged abilities.

My argument is DKs are different enough from necromancers. Try again.

It's more relevant than you've ever been to anything, if at all ever. A ranged class of the same theme as a melee class would have abilities reflecting that difference. Again, as you've seen with priests, paladins, DHs and warlocks.

I'm not talking "specs", I'm talking the definition of specialization. DKs do not in fact specialize in soul magic. By your logic, priests/paladins and warlocks/DHs don't make sense because they share the same type of magic. How do you not feel insulted by yourself?

I've been right in my entire post. I and other necromancer fans have never been wrong about anything about this topic because we've done our research and are constantly pestered by people (that have only started paying attention to the lore in Legion thanks to how more intense it's gotten, at least that's what you make yourself seem like anyways) attempting to challenge us about said topic.

I mean, I'm talking to someone who's got a fucking Dragonsworn class concept. I don't know why I've taken this argument even half as seriously as I am right now.


Case in point.

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Necromancers, in lore, are wildly illegal. The Kirin Tor outlawed the fuck out of necromancy. Death knights aren't true necromancers, using runic magic. So there is heavy duty lore reasons to never allow necromancers to do a thing. Hell, everyone's biggest issue with Sylvanas is her use of necromancy. So if Blizzard introduced necromancer, it would only be to introduce something edgy and would shit all over the lore.

I do doubt Blizzard's writing skills, yea. But I still would dig the hell out of a necromancer class. But say they do come up with a reason why necromancers were no longer outlawed. Problem solved.

Now, how that would be executed on Blizzard's end is a whole other problem not even worth discussing here. But regardless, there would be a reason to it.

[TheRevenantHero]

Which is kind of ironic, seeing how the outlawing of Necromancy led to the banishment of Kel'thuzad, which in turn led to the Cult of the Damned and the spread of the Plague of Undeath over Lordaeron. The outlawing of Necromancy led to the spreading of undeath and the ascension of Kel'thuzad from being an Archmage and member of the Council of Six of the Kirin Tor to being the most powerful necromancer (bar the Lich King, obviously) on Azeroth.

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To be fair, the concern of the Necromancer causing the loss of some other classes abilities is as valid as the concern that Tinkers will cause Engineering to be removed due to a perceived redundancy.

And Kel'thuzad was mcmurdered as a further deterrant against anyone wanting to go down the necromancy rabbit hole. Sure it caused Kel'thuzad to rise to power but he was also struck down pretty violently. Had it not been made illegal, it would have emboldened more spellcasters to fuck with necromancy and likely have led to many more problems. Risking ONE Kel'thuzad is better than allowing DOZENS.

[Teriz]

You're nitpicking at nothing lol.

A couple ranged abilities does not surmount to a ranged class's arsenal of ranged abilities. Imagine being so butthurt about necromancers you use a deliberate over-look of a couple mid-ranged abilities as a point as if it proves anything. "SEE, DKs ARE RANGED CLASS". That's like saying a priest can't be a class because paladins are the same things because they have a small handful of ranged abilities.

Look over their ability list. They have way more than just a "couple" of ranged abilities.

My argument is DKs are different enough from necromancers. Try again.

Yes, and its a bad argument because the Necromancer was actually merged into the DK class by Blizzard.

It's more relevant than you've ever been to anything, if at all ever. A ranged class of the same theme as a melee class would have abilities reflecting that difference. Again, as you've seen with priests, paladins, DHs and warlocks.

Except Priests don't have the same theme as Paladins, and DHs don't have the same theme as Warlocks.

You're wrong again.

I'm not talking "specs", I'm talking the definition of specialization. DKs do not in fact specialize in soul magic. By your logic, priests/paladins and warlocks/DHs don't make sense because they share the same type of magic. How do you not feel insulted by yourself?

Priests and Paladins only share Holy magic. In case you didn't know, Priests also use Shadow magic. I'll give you Demon Hunters and Warlocks having a similar theme, but Demon Hunters focus on turning into Demons and Warlocks focus on controlling demons. I have yet to see a Necromancer proposal showing a level of separation on that level.

I've been right in my entire post. I and other necromancer fans have never been wrong about anything about this topic because we've done our research and are constantly pestered by people (that have only started paying attention to the lore in Legion thanks to how more intense it's gotten, at least that's what you make yourself seem like anyways) attempting to challenge us about said topic.

Ah, so you're delusional as well.

Gotcha.