Blizzard: "you don't want private servers". Where have I heard this before?

[Queendom]

Many don't realize this, because they never played it, but this exact scenario happened with Jagex/Runescape.

For those of you who don't know, Runescape was/is a game that started up in 2001. Fast forward to 2007, there are millions of players, and it's the top MMORPG after WoW.

[...] they finally announced a poll for people to vote in: "Would you like to play a version of the game from 2007?" Millions voted, with something like 96% (i think?) voting yes, and Jagex eventually released "Old School" servers.

How is this an exact scenario? If they released a 2001 version then okay, but not with the 2007 version. The exact replication of your post would be making WotLK servers, not Classic.

[Relapses]

While also gaining subscribers from those who want to PLAY classic.

Except that isn't going to happen. Hello? Is this on?

[Vrinara]

Except that isn't going to happen. Hello? Is this on?

Um it kinda already has. I have friends who quit back in 8.1 who have just resubbed to play Classic, aswell as check out 8.2. I really have a hard time seeing classic as NOT a cash grab. "Let's bring back an old thing everyone loved. Make it free if they are subbed. We will get old players back, and even new players."

[LionSinMaikeru]

Except that isn't going to happen. Hello? Is this on?

*raises hand*

I unsubscribed months ago and am now planning on resubscribing solely to play Classic.

Maybe don't try speaking for everyone?

[agentsi]

I've played EQ1 and some other MMOs on private servers. Even the larger ones, there is so much going on that prevents it from being an even playing field. The folks who run them, always have rules set in place that cater to them, EQP1999/P2002 comes to mind. Starting your own server costs a fair bit, so not just anyone can do it. In my opinion, blizzard is correct. Can you imagine spending a year playing on a private server, only for the folks to throw in the towel and you lose everything?

[Tumile]

Lmao come on, at least make your bullshit less obvious.

You think brand new players are looking at a re-release of an MMO from fifteen years ago and going "wow you know what, I never once considered playing WoW when it was new, or in TBC when celebrities were doing prime-time TV commercials for it, or in Wrath when 12 or 13 million other people were playing it, or in Cataclysm where they re-did the entire thing, or in Mists of Pandaria when there were cute pandas, or in Warlords where nothing good happened, or in Legion when the game had a resurgence and had decent streamer numbers, or in BFA when the whole internet is complaining about it, but my god do I want to play this re-release of the fifteen year old version of the game"?

I know you can't really believe that, so why bother making a thread about it?

personally have 8 friends who never played wow before, and I have told them not to start, for 2 reasons, 1: how new player unfriendly retail is. 2: How shit BFA is. but they are all excited to play Classic as they missed the chance back in the day, and when they asked, I said this is probably the best time to start playing wow, its super new player friendly, you don't have to rush anything, it's catered towards casual players and hardcore players alike, and I will be able to help and play with you a lot more than I would on retail due to the huge skill gap. So i think it's fair to say it is drawing a lot of attention from players quit many expansions ago, as well as completely new players. this is ofcourse 100% anecdotal, but I've heard similar stories from my retail buddies and the numbers are piling up to a point where there is merit to the point.

[Deficineiron]

I don't think you have a firm grasp on reality at all. Classic WoW will be a moderate success, but stable numbers will probably only be around 10-20k active players at any given time. Enough to justify its existence, but wake the fuck up and stop deluding yourself with this power fantasy of Vanilla WoW being way more popular than the main game. It didn't happen with OSRS and it's not happening now.

this poster is a good example of someone who does not manipulate numbers with lots of zeros well.

number of wow accounts created ever - > >100,000,000
(postulated) number of active western retail accounts - 3,000,000
realstegblob's classic active player guess - 20,000 or in other words a fraction of peak concurrent users for OSRS!!

[HitRefresh]

WoW Classic on the other hand, will have both NEW players, re-subscribing players, AND it will peel off many of the retail players.

I think the important part here is that everyone is starting classic on the same footing. Even though you're technically on the same playing level as everyone else starting WoW today with a level boost on expansion release day, it's not the same as everyone starting a new character on day 1.

[Tharkkun]

Bit harsh but if so was true, sorry for your loss.

Oops. Didn't mean to come across that way. Was being more comical that no matter how successful Classic is, they will always be 1 short.

[therealstegblob]

this poster is a good example of someone who does not manipulate numbers with lots of zeros well.

number of wow accounts created ever - > >100,000,000
(postulated) number of active western retail accounts - 3,000,000
realstegblob's classic active player guess - 20,000 or in other words a fraction of peak concurrent users for OSRS!!

...What?

I have absolutely no fucking idea what your point is supposed to be. Do you seriously think that because there's been 100 milion WoW accounts ever created and that because 3 million are currently subbed to the game, that the players in Classic WoW will somehow be the same amount relative to the current subbed accounts?

What the actual fuck are you talking about dude.

[kenn9530]

Many don't realize this, because they never played it, but this exact scenario happened with Jagex/Runescape.

For those of you who don't know, Runescape was/is a game that started up in 2001. Fast forward to 2007, there are millions of players, and it's the top MMORPG after WoW. Then, they made some major changes to the game, re-writing PVP, trading, and combat.

In 2013, their numbers dipped severely low, and after a 3rd party poll that had been pleading with Jagex to make a "legacy" version of the game, they finally announced a poll for people to vote in: "Would you like to play a version of the game from 2007?" Millions voted, with something like 96% (i think?) voting yes, and Jagex eventually released "Old School" servers. They dedicated a dev team to JUST those servers, and low & behold, the game now has MORE subscribers than their main "retail" version of the game, and their number have climbed up quite a bit once again.

I don't think people realize just how big Classic WoW will be. On top of the fact that Blizzard/Activision is a money hungry company, I am telling you now, that you will eventually see TBC, WOTLK servers as well in the future. Blizzard has no reason to not do this once the success of Classic WoW will be so popular.

Think about it. Retail WoW only has it's CURRENT subscriber base. I doubt the number of "new" players starting the game now, in 2019 is any, if at all. It can only go down, besides when new expansions come out. WoW Classic on the other hand, will have both NEW players, re-subscribing players, AND it will peel off many of the retail players.

I can't say the success will last as long as Oldschool Runescape, but I'm betting now that WoW will see record numbers once again by the end of 2019, for a minimum of 2-4 years.

Classic is not going to be this big thing that brings back millions of players, some may come back and some new people will try it but for many classic wont be able to hold players, after several months it may have a few hundred thousand between all servers at most, players in retail are not going to want to stop playing that char they have put so much time into so they can start over in a simple version of WoW.

It was a good experience in vanilla since it was all new but your bringing current players with the same attitude into classic and your doing content that you have already done for many years, for a few months it may be fun and once you have a geared character then the raids will be no challenge at all.

Just like all MMOs these days WoW is getting on in the years and it doesnt really have anything interesting left, attachment to a players char and acheivements is a main reason people still play.

[Treesap7]

I don't think you have a firm grasp on reality at all. Classic WoW will be a moderate success, but stable numbers will probably only be around 10-20k active players at any given time. Enough to justify its existence, but wake the fuck up and stop deluding yourself with this power fantasy of Vanilla WoW being way more popular than the main game. It didn't happen with OSRS and it's not happening now.

Lolol ok, check back in 6 months and eat your words. You don't seem to have any more of a grip on reality than the guy you just bashed on.

Yeah, okay.

Where are you at now bro? What do you have to say about the raging success that classic has been?

[apples]

Where are you at now bro? What do you have to say about the raging success that classic has been?

raging success? it was exactly as he said, a moderate success with 20k stable players.

[Whistl3r]

- - - Updated - - -

raging success? it was exactly as he said, a moderate success with 20k stable players.

There are 3.5k players whos logged raid data on my medium pop server alone. Most players dont even raid, let alone log raids.

[WowIsDead64]

Many don't realize this, because they never played it, but this exact scenario happened with Jagex/Runescape.

For those of you who don't know, Runescape was/is a game that started up in 2001. Fast forward to 2007, there are millions of players, and it's the top MMORPG after WoW. Then, they made some major changes to the game, re-writing PVP, trading, and combat.

In 2013, their numbers dipped severely low, and after a 3rd party poll that had been pleading with Jagex to make a "legacy" version of the game, they finally announced a poll for people to vote in: "Would you like to play a version of the game from 2007?" Millions voted, with something like 96% (i think?) voting yes, and Jagex eventually released "Old School" servers. They dedicated a dev team to JUST those servers, and low & behold, the game now has MORE subscribers than their main "retail" version of the game, and their number have climbed up quite a bit once again.

I don't think people realize just how big Classic WoW will be. On top of the fact that Blizzard/Activision is a money hungry company, I am telling you now, that you will eventually see TBC, WOTLK servers as well in the future. Blizzard has no reason to not do this once the success of Classic WoW will be so popular.

Think about it. Retail WoW only has it's CURRENT subscriber base. I doubt the number of "new" players starting the game now, in 2019 is any, if at all. It can only go down, besides when new expansions come out. WoW Classic on the other hand, will have both NEW players, re-subscribing players, AND it will peel off many of the retail players.

I can't say the success will last as long as Oldschool Runescape, but I'm betting now that WoW will see record numbers once again by the end of 2019, for a minimum of 2-4 years.

MAUs have doubled due to release of Classic. But when I looked at definition of MAU, I realized, that it's not number of accounts - it's counted for every game and every platform separately. I'm not sure, if Retail and Classic treated as separate games, but I guess, they do. So, what doubled MAUs mean? They mean, that all retail players tried Classic. That's it. No increase in actual sub numbers. May be increase of activity.

[Kithelle]

Where are you at now bro? What do you have to say about the raging success that classic has been?

It came in with a boom, yes...but it isn't a raging success, it hasn't overtaken live like the OP claimed

[chronia]

MAUs have doubled due to release of Classic. But when I looked at definition of MAU, I realized, that it's not number of accounts - it's counted for every game and every platform separately. I'm not sure, if Retail and Classic treated as separate games, but I guess, they do. So, what doubled MAUs mean? They mean, that all retail players tried Classic. That's it. No increase in actual sub numbers. May be increase of activity.

WoW and WoW Classic are counted as one game since its on the same Sub. You could have easily found that in their earnings releases, see for example this one from Q4: https://investor.activision.com/news...2019-financial

Relevent sections:

Blizzard

Blizzard had 32 million MAUs.
World of Warcraft® exited 2019 with an active player community3 more than twice the size of its Q2-ending level.
Hearthstone® launched the Descent of DragonsTM expansion and rolled out the new Battlegrounds game mode in the fourth quarter, which drove sequential growth in engagement. Net bookingsB also grew sequentially for the franchise.
Overwatch®launched on the Nintendo Switch, further expanding a community that has surpassed 50 million players globally since launch.
In February, the Overwatch LeagueTM will return with 20 established teams from around the world competing in a homestand format with matches broadcast live on YouTube.

And then the definition for "3"i made italic.

1 Per the NPD Group, GfK, GSD and internal estimates, based on dollar sales of front-line games.
2 Per App Annie Intelligence and internal estimates for respective regions, app stores, and periods.
3 Defined as players with monthly or longer-term subscriptions.
4 Per App Annie Intelligence for respective regions, app stores, and periods.

So yes, Q4 sub numbers were more than double that of Q2, since nothing released for retail in Q3 and Q4, most of that increase will have been driven by Classic.
In Q1 both 8.3 have released and BWL will release in Classic, so if Q1 also provdes a increase in Sub numbers both Retail and Classic will be driving that increase probably.

It came in with a boom, yes...but it isn't a raging success, it hasn't overtaken live like the OP claimed

It doesn't have to overtake live though to be a "raging success", and even then, who says they didn't (temporarily) have overtaken retail. Data from Blizzard themselves doesn't count that out, with them actually saying that subscriptions more than doubled between Q2 and Q4 with nothing releasing for retail in that period.

Classic is definately a success, which is good for WoW overall.

[Aphrel]

For the most part classic has turned out almost exactly the way i anticipated except in two ways.

That layer hoping would be so easy came as a suprise to me. After the fiasko of shardhopping that was Wod i expected that blizz had learned something... i was wrong.

The other thing i did not anticipate was that blizzard servers would be even worse than private servers at handling large scale pvp.
Infact the classic wow servers are even worse than the vanilla servers we had 15years ago.

But other than that it has for the most part played out like most private server releases. With extremly big participation in the early stage and now evening out. I expect we will se another bump further ahead when ab and zg releases.

[Tekkommo]

raging success? it was exactly as he said, a moderate success with 20k stable players per server.

Fixed for you.

[Domixux]

The downfall of classic is the community. Every content patch we had until now did come with any form of exploit, content-rush, forum rants and whatsoever because of the min-max mentality of the community. It started with people rushing pre raid bis gear in a couple of days and then complaining about having nothing to do after their weekly mc/ony raid. Right now its the pvp meta, which completly went nuts because of premades and wpvp ganking. At least from my memory back in vanilla people were more chill about the gear and content mentality or at least we weren't that organised with premades, bis lists and so on. Blizzards surely can be made responsible for some parts (for example underestimating the impact of wpvp without bgs), but many problems are just community made. I guess thats what you get for playing a video game which came out 15 years ago, where everything is already figured out and fully documented. In my opionion classic lost a lot of its former charme because of this constantly content-rush (just look at the upcoming bwl release and everyone already planning to clear bwl in 2-3 hours).

For myself I have to say I'm still enjoying classic alot. I mean I had to burry my rank 10 dream which isn't achievable with a full time job right now, but the game really brought back good memories from my childhood.