Why am I freezing?

[OhBoyKittens]

I built a new computer a few months back and thought I finally got it fixed because it hasn't frozen in like 2 months. The RGB lights freeze so I assume it's an overclocked CPU issue vs overclocked GPU issue. (overclocked EVGA 2080 hybrid)

I just increased the volts to 1.355 running 5ghz on I7-9700K. LLC set to extreme on gigabyte. avx to -4 I believe. (This doesn't happen in wow but in apex legends.)

Could it be the power supply? It's the old supply unit from my old rig. It's a EVGA supernova G3 850 watt.

[c0rnel]

I built a new computer a few months back and thought I finally got it fixed because it hasn't frozen in like 2 months. The RGB lights freeze so I assume it's an overclocked CPU issue vs overclocked GPU issue. (overclocked EVGA 2080 hybrid)

I just increased the volts to 1.355 running 5ghz on I7-9700K. LLC set to extreme on gigabyte. avx to -4 I believe. (This doesn't happen in wow but in apex legends.)

Could it be the power supply? It's the old supply unit from my old rig. It's a EVGA supernova G3 850 watt.

Start by running stock speeds and then test. If it doesn't happen then set your CPU overclock and test again. Instead of 1.355v 5Ghz try 1.28 - 1.3 at 4.5Ghz. For GPU use stock speeds and you can mess with overclocking later.

I'm very sure it's not the psu.

[Hoofey]

I'm very sure it's not the psu.

Much to learn you still have, my young padawan...




I'm not saying its the psu in this case, but its not something you should rule out like that.

Psu issues can manifest itself in the weirdest way possible. Gpu issues, CPU issues, weird bluescreens etc. A bad PSU can pretty much make every component of a pc act weird and unstable.

[DeltrusDisc]

Much to learn you still have, my young padawan...




I'm not saying its the psu in this case, but its not something you should rule out like that.

Psu issues can manifest itself in the weirdest way possible. Gpu issues, CPU issues, weird bluescreens etc. A bad PSU can pretty much make every component of a pc act weird and unstable.

True... but an eVGA Supernova 850 watt? Really? Doubt it.

[Shakari]

Start by running stock speeds and then test. If it doesn't happen then set your CPU overclock and test again. Instead of 1.355v 5Ghz try 1.28 - 1.3 at 4.5Ghz. For GPU use stock speeds and you can mess with overclocking later.

I'm very sure it's not the psu.

Yup pretty much start at stock speeds and voltage and increase in small increments until it becomes unstable then dial it back a few points.

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Much to learn you still have, my young padawan...




I'm not saying its the psu in this case, but its not something you should rule out like that.

Psu issues can manifest itself in the weirdest way possible. Gpu issues, CPU issues, weird bluescreens etc. A bad PSU can pretty much make every component of a pc act weird and unstable.

Yes your right, however its MUCH more likley to be CPU issues if its being overclocked. in 30 years I have had ONE PSU give issues due to a fault with the voltages (not including age and under performance), its not a very common problem.
It being to low power for the application is a more common cause of these issue but even then, its better to reset to default clocking and voltage and increase gradually. If it doesn't work at default speeds in a stable manner then yes I would suggest the PSU is to old and is not providing enough power due to aging of the components.

[OhBoyKittens]

]

I started my overclock at 5gigahertz and 1.3 volts with LLC on turbo. I followed the gigabyte guide. I went up in voltage until it could run all of the benchmark tests I clouding prime 95. I kept intermittently having issues so I set LLC to extreme like gigabyte said. Turned the volts back to 1.3 and increased it u til it could run stress tests. With LLC on turbo I think I was all the way up to 1.37 and extreme is 1.355 as of today. That's why I didn't know if it could be the psu with extreme vs turbo making that big a difference. I played a bunch today and didn't have any issues after 1.355 it definitely is sporadic and seems to be no reason for the crash.Like I said I think I went two full months without a freeze. It does happen even with the GPU at stock speed.

[Hoofey]

True... but an eVGA Supernova 850 watt? Really? Doubt it.

Just because its a good psu doesnt mean its infallible. Even platinum Seasonic PSUs die every now and then, sometimes slowly, making it frustratingly hard to figure out whats wrong.

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Yes your right, however its MUCH more likley to be CPU issues if its being overclocked. in 30 years I have had ONE PSU give issues due to a fault with the voltages (not including age and under performance), its not a very common problem.
It being to low power for the application is a more common cause of these issue but even then, its better to reset to default clocking and voltage and increase gradually.

I agree, its best to start with the obvious and easy stuff. But you also need to follow the process of elimination and not just instantly say that a component isnt at fault.

You'd be surprised at how many issues a PSU can cause. A bad psu can create instability in a system that would otherwise be attributed to a different component, like in Kagthul's recent case where pretty much everyone thought it was the GPU going bad. One guy even called me out for mentioning the psu, because "it was almost guaranteed that it wasnt a psu issue". And guess what, it was actually the PSU messing with his GPU.

Who knows, replacing his GPU could have fixed the problem as well. Some components handle unstable current better than others, so sometimes it would seem like you did the right thing by replacing the cpu\gpu or w/e, but it could very well have been the psu messing up those components.

If it doesn't work at default speeds in a stable manner then yes I would suggest the PSU is to old and is not providing enough power due to aging of the components.

But he just completely ruled out the PSU, so he probably wouldnt suggest that.
And its not always about the PSU not providing enough power. It can be unstable power delivery aka ripple thats causing instability.
For example, a psu with high ripple can lower your OC potential, or just make a seemingly stable OC unstable over time. To counter that you need to increase the voltage to a level where the ripple wont affect stability, and thats usually a bad thing. Can also affect your components longevity.

So to sum this up, a bad psu can really mess up your system in ways you wouldnt think possible, because most of the time its pretty damn good at hiding its flaws.

Edit; Again, this doesnt mean that PSU's wreck pc's left and right. Most of the time its fine. Its just that people tend to ignore the PSUs too often, either because its a supposedly good brand and "those PSUs lasts forever", or they just havent had the pleasure of troubleshooting pc's with bad/unstable PSUs in it.

- - - Updated - - -

]

I started my overclock at 5gigahertz and 1.3 volts with LLC on turbo. I followed the gigabyte guide. I went up in voltage until it could run all of the benchmark tests I clouding prime 95. I kept intermittently having issues so I set LLC to extreme like gigabyte said. Turned the volts back to 1.3 and increased it u til it could run stress tests. With LLC on turbo I think I was all the way up to 1.37 and extreme is 1.355 as of today. That's why I didn't know if it could be the psu with extreme vs turbo making that big a difference. I played a bunch today and didn't have any issues after 1.355 it definitely is sporadic and seems to be no reason for the crash.Like I said I think I went two full months without a freeze. It does happen even with the GPU at stock speed.

Try some stresstests for your GPU as well.
You said it doesnt happen in WoW, which is fairly light on the GPU loads, but it does happen in Apex, a more GPU focused game. (Depending on settings ofc)

Issues with unstable CPU overclocks usually leads to a bsod, while GPU issues tends to either crash or freeze games\programs.

[Manakuski]

Usually if a PSU is bad, the whole computer just shuts down. Those freezes sound like a bad overclock or a faulty component.

[OhBoyKittens]

I've used Heaven to benchmark many many times to get the overclock for the GPU with the stock 100% power level on MSI Afterburner. Never had an issue. Just did it again with normal tesselation and high quality and again no issues. I feel like I remember putting the GPU back to stock and I still had the freezing.

It took me absolutely forever to get intel XTU benchmark to run. I would click it and the computer would immediately freeze. Like, It would be my last benchmark to see if it was stable and I would stare at the RGB to see if they froze so I could shut it down quickly. Intel XTU still runs fine (even 5 seconds ago) So I honestly have no idea why I have these intermittent freezes. I used to have one a night, maybe a few a night, weeks between, months between like I said. It's so random but it is when I'm playing Apex. So maybe PSU or AVX is the issue bc I can't think of anything else.

[c0rnel]

Since I have the same CPU myself, I know hitting stable 5Ghz isn't easy (I'm running mine at 4.5Ghz and around 1.28 volts for now). There are a bunch more BIOS settings involved than just LLC and cpu voltage. Since I don't have your motherboard I would recommend you look for a youtube video of your motherboard and that cpu or do a google search and see what settings others use for a similar setup. I doubt running 5Ghz vs 4.5 gives you a performance boost in wow. The reason I'm sure about your psu not being bad is because it's at least gold rated and it's a solid psu, and I expect those things to last.

Also, are your 4 and/or 8 pins and 24pin power cables properly plugged into your mb? Can you post your temps for cpu idle and cpu stress? Is this on air cooling or water?

[OhBoyKittens]

https://imgur.com/5jbbLF7
https://imgur.com/a/2umsb2c

Could not for the life of me get it to upload a pic so it's on imgur.

That's after running apex for a while, wow for half an hour, and OCCT for 3 minutes, stats using HWMonitor

[Hoofey]

https://imgur.com/5jbbLF7
https://imgur.com/a/2umsb2c

Could not for the life of me get it to upload a pic so it's on imgur.

Press windowskey+shift+S to mark an area of your screen, go to imgur and Ctrl+v when in the new post page. Snipping tool (included with windows) does the same thing if you like that one better. They both just copy the marked area to the clipboard so you can paste (Ctrl+v) the screenshot anywhere you want. Can even paste the screenshot straight into Discord as well.

That's after running apex for a while, wow for half an hour, and OCCT for 3 minutes, stats using HWMonitor

Temps are fine, but looks like LLC is playing tricks with your vcore as it has spiked up to 1.4v some time during your testing. I'd try to figure out when that happens, maybe you can find your instability there, as it would suggest an intense load on your CPU if that 1.4v persists over an extended amount of time.

I would try to lower the OC to 4.9 and reduce the AVX offset a bit as well. AVX offsets over 3 can cause some weird behavior in games that take advantage of AVX.

Since I have the same CPU myself, I know hitting stable 5Ghz isn't easy (I'm running mine at 4.5Ghz and around 1.28 volts for now).

5ghz on a 9700k should be fairly obtainable for most people(not all ofc), sounds like you got yourself a lemon CPU if you have to run it at 1.28v at 4.5ghz. 1.28v is what some people run their 4.9-5ghz OC's on. (With avx offsets)

Also, isnt the all-core turbo for a stock 9700k 4.6ghz? Surely it can handle more than that without any instability. I would at least try to run it at 4.8ghz, as you've basically underclocked your CPU right now.

The reason I'm sure about your psu not being bad is because it's at least gold rated and it's a solid psu, and I expect those things to last.

While the Supernova stuff from EVGA is generally good, the gold/platinum rating doesnt always mean that a PSU is good. It just means that its efficient. Granted, you usually need good components to make it efficient, but even the most luxurious, high-end stuff ends up with a certain % of RMA's.

- "A higher 80 PLUS rating correlates to better quality." Incorrect. Certain components in a PSU do need to be of a certain quality to achieve higher efficiency, however, quality of soldering, capacitors, etc, can be forgone in achieving an exemplary 80 PLUS rating. Electrical performance can be ditched as well. I like to use the EVGA G1 as an example of this. It's made of above average componentry, performs lackingly, and achieves gold efficiency. Then there's the EVGA B2, which is constructed about as well, performs better electrically, and advertises 80 PLUS Bronze efficiency (it actually achieves 80 PLUS Silver efficiency but that standard has been given up by and large). The EVGA B2 is a better PSU than the G1, yet it wastes slightly more electricity. This will correlate to a marginally more expensive power bill (pennies on the dollar for most home users) but ensures you a better power supply for your money. If, however, you plan to run a very power-hungry system for several hours on end then a more efficient power supply can save a more noticeable amount of money, especially if used heavily during hours of the day where electricity is more expensive.

[Yunru]

It could also be dust. If you had no issues before. Worst case scenario is that you overclocked something and needs to be replaced.

Try to run some program and see what your computer temperature is inside. (frezzing usualy happens when something overheats)

You should also check your pc for few things:
Driver Corruption
Computer Viruses
Software Errors (high possibility -- do you use some flash when pc frezzes)

[Lollis]

Regarding the PSU: How are you powering your graphics card? Are you using a split cable for both sockets or are you using two separate cables?

I had issues with my PC when I had a single split cable powering my GPU. I tried everything I could think of, I even bought a new PSU before I had the idea to simply add a 2nd cable connection, the problem was fixed immediately.

[Hoofey]

Regarding the PSU: How are you powering your graphics card? Are you using a split cable for both sockets or are you using two separate cables?

I had issues with my PC when I had a single split cable powering my GPU. I tried everything I could think of, I even bought a new PSU before I had the idea to simply add a 2nd cable connection, the problem was fixed immediately.

This has been my experience as well. My GPU was able to get a slightly better graphics score using 2x cables instead of 1x pigtail cable without any mhz change, and I was able to get a better overclock with 2x cables. (Pretty much the same as Jayz)

I went back and forth between the cables to make sure it wasnt just a fluke as well, was pretty consistent. The max 2xcable overclock suddenly became unstable with 1x pigtail cable, so it does have some impact. At least with powerhungry GPU's.

[Maell]

Do you play anything else that is GPU intensive? (WoW uses mostly CPU and bad at it)
Have you ruled out any software problems? (Drivers and OS)
Whith what frequency does the freezes occur? Everytime you are playing after x time? Sometimes you've been playing 5 minutes and other times after a couple hours? It appears to be completely random?

As many have said it can be a number of things that are causing your problem so you must choose a starting point for your test (usually go full stock/fresh install) and then increment/iterate your settings till you can replicate the problem, then dial back to where it doesn't appear anymore.

If you go full stock and still have the issue then most likely you'd need spare parts to try to rule out hardware failure.

I had issues with my PC when I had a single split cable powering my GPU. I tried everything I could think of, I even bought a new PSU before I had the idea to simply add a 2nd cable connection, the problem was fixed immediately.

And I would give this a try.

[c0rnel]

Hoofey,

Yes, the all-core turbo for a stock 9700k is about 4.6Ghz but I'm running mine at 4.5Ghz as is with manual settings because I don't want to invest time into overclocking and I don't play games atm. I don't think I have a lemon, but I do know that getting it past 4.9Ghz will require at least 1.3x volts and I will need to run more tests.

In any case, I don't want to turn this discussion to be about me or my setup. The goal is to help resolve the original issue the OP is having.

As always, I advise not spending money or replacing parts unless you are confident that it will resolve the issue or have isolated the problem.

Posted temps look good.

[pansertjald]

https://imgur.com/5jbbLF7
https://imgur.com/a/2umsb2c

Could not for the life of me get it to upload a pic so it's on imgur.

That's after running apex for a while, wow for half an hour, and OCCT for 3 minutes, stats using HWMonitor

Something is wrong with your Vcore. It should NOT hop all the way up to 1.404 from 1.368.

Im running my 5.0GHz oc on a Gigabyte z390 Master at 1.260Vcore on LLC turbo and it NEVER goes over the 1.260Vcore. It some times goes lower then 1.260, but NEVER over. So something is done wrong on your settings.

Have you updated to the latest BIOS?. Also i don't run with AVX because it's a pain in the ass to get stable and there is no more then 5 games that run with AVX and i don't see the point in running with AVX.

This is my Vcore while running wow.

[Hoofey]

Hoofey,

Yes, the all-core turbo for a stock 9700k is about 4.6Ghz but I'm running mine at 4.5Ghz as is with manual settings because I don't want to invest time into overclocking and I don't play games atm. I don't think I have a lemon, but I do know that getting it past 4.9Ghz will require at least 1.3x volts and I will need to run more tests.

In any case, I don't want to turn this discussion to be about me or my setup. The goal is to help resolve the original issue the OP is having.

Fair enough, but you're the one who dragged your anecdotal CPU experience into all this. Gotta expect to get some comments on it, especially when you recommend trying said unconventional clocks with extremely high voltages (for 4.5ghz that is) to the OP in your first post. You're basically force-feeding the CPU at that point, creating unnessecary heat.

As always, I advise not spending money or replacing parts unless you are confident that it will resolve the issue or have isolated the problem.

This is good advice. We just need to wait for OP to tweak his OC and see if that changes his situation.

[OhBoyKittens]

I think I may have found the problem but i'm also grabbing at anything. I set the power limits from auto to the max number, 4096 I believe. I'm going to change the LLC back to turbo bc apparently gigabyte is notorious for overvolting. The CPU internal AC/DC load line is still set to auto. None of the stuff I've read has even mentioned it.

So, lets assume that somehow the magical 0.005 extra volts is what it needed to not freeze. Since my temps are fine, is the core ok to run at 1.355 continuously? I couldn't find an option in the bios to have 1.355 be the under load volts and drop it when it's not needed. Or does it have to stay at 1.355 forever because it's overclocked?

https://pcpartpicker.com/b/2sNQzy