I really enjoyed BFA

[vashe9]

It's the first expansion in a while that I've not left after x.1.5.
The only things I DONT like are :
1) Azerite gear, totally stupid idea, not farmable and based on RNG... Most pieces are crap and only one or two have good traits...
2) Benthic gear/sockets ... holy shit, another RNG grind, 425 gear better than any 445 from mythic raids, it's a stupid idea
I'm BM hunter and I have 4 BiS that are benthic... even socket 445 are worse...
3) Island expeditions suck but it's just 30min/week, I don't really care
4) Infinite AP grind

But I really enjoy doing raids and mm+, that's the core of the game after all.

Sockets should NOT be RNG but farmable like Diablo, you loot a rare item, you can add a slot to your loot... it's pretty simple, no ?

[Ardreth]

Not as good as Legion. I put BFA on par with WoD. I do hope the next expansion goes back to the Legion style. They should have never got rid of the artifacts & order halls just yet. Should have lasted several expansions.

[Lurker1]

Not as good as Legion. I put BFA on par with WoD. I do hope the next expansion goes back to the Legion style. They should have never got rid of the artifacts & order halls just yet. Should have lasted several expansions.

it will probably be artifacts again but this time more void based theme for sure.

[niztheundead87]

tbh the azerite trait system needs a big overhaul , right now as it is you either get the best trait or something really bad , which is bad design .and then you have the reforge system which kinda prohibits playing other specs.

the way i see it
a) azerite traits should be like talent s we should be able to swap then like talents in any city , reforging is terrible.
b) we should have traits available only to the current spec and when we swap specs the traits change , like tier sets behaved.
c) they need to adjust traits so they are all good.

as for essences , they need to make it that somehow we can unlocked them for alts

[Zyky]

And yet every time I inquire about the "terrible raid design" that you millennials scream about the reply is always something about RNG/gear, and not the actual raid bosses and encounters.

So is the problem raids (for you) or is the problem RNG?

And no matter how much you millenials scream about RNG, fact is that it took MONTHS to max out your gear in BC, and no one complained back then about gearing. I had tier 5 pieces for nearly a year!

"you millennials" I've been playing for 14 years, raiding the entire time at the highest end. You're the person who quit when the raiding got too hard.

The problem with raid design now is when they tune encounters for the top .001% of guilds then take far too long adjust them for the guilds that don't raid 5-7 days a week so it causes burnout and hatred for raiding. When Mythic fights hit live servers and are literally unkillable without without several nerfs before even the top guild in the world can kill it, that's bad design. This has happened several times in the last 2 expansions(Kil'jaeden, Argus, Fetid Devourer, Jaina, and Azshara), and this isn't even counting the stealth nerfs they did for other encounters that weren't in notes that happened while they were pulling the bosses(like Gul'dan, Fallen Avatar, Aggramar, and G'huun). The problem Mythic raiders have is with encounter design and horrible tuning, both of these things cause burnout and an increasing hatred for raids. It literally has nothing to do with gear, the people who complain about gear are players who never clear content while it's current.

And lets not even get into horrible Class Design, because that also plays a part of hating raids. If you're not enjoying the classes in the game, you aren't going to enjoy raiding with them.

[Shalaator]

"you millennials" I've been playing for 14 years, raiding the entire time at the highest end. You're the person who quit when the raiding got too hard.

The problem with raid design now is when they tune encounters for the top .001% of guilds then take far too long adjust them for the guilds that don't raid 5-7 days a week so it causes burnout and hatred for raiding. When Mythic fights hit live servers and are literally unkillable without without several nerfs before even the top guild in the world can kill it, that's bad design. This has happened several times in the last 2 expansions(Kil'jaeden, Argus, Fetid Devourer, Jaina, and Azshara), and this isn't even counting the stealth nerfs they did for other encounters that weren't in notes that happened while they were pulling the bosses(like Gul'dan, Fallen Avatar, Aggramar, and G'huun). The problem Mythic raiders have is with encounter design and horrible tuning, both of these things cause burnout and an increasing hatred for raids. It literally has nothing to do with gear, the people who complain about gear are players who never clear content while it's current.

And lets not even get into horrible Class Design, because that also plays a part of hating raids. If you're not enjoying the classes in the game, you aren't going to enjoy raiding with them.

Raiding didn't get harder than Alaglon and Mimiron Firefighter. I didn't full clear Sunwell in TBC when it was current, but Muru was a bitch. Btw 2100+ attempts on Archimonde in Hyjal.

Don't tell me that "raiding wasn't hard." I've never heard of anyone going over 1k attempts in recent wow history. I was so proud to get my tier 6 headpiece that I wore it until late Naxx25 in WotLK (I wore 2set tier 6 in paritcular for the 10% mana buff, very useful on Saphiron). So I wore tier 5 headpiece for 11 months while trying to take down Archimonde.

BC raiding was hard. I'd love to see you do RoS or BB (Black temple) when it was current.

And if what you're saying is true about current Mythics, I actually want to do them then. Sounds like high end raiding if difficult again.

You're confusing bad gearing (yes RNG sucks) with bad raid design (mechanics/encounters).

[sephrinx]

Because:

- Island expeditions are terrible
- Warfronts are terrible
- The story is godawful
- The Azerite armor system is bland and not compelling
- Zone design was lackluster for most zones
- Specs were gutted and play terribly
- Gated grinds are the new normal
- There just isn't anything exciting happening in game

Pretty much this.

There's nothing to do, everything is a spoon full at a time.
Nothing to grind towards and achieve without being time gated, thus furthering the "spoon full at a time" mentality of the game.
PvP is pretty bad. Demon Hunters make me want to rip my balls off and throw them in a river, as I spend 80% of my time in PvP under crowd control.
Whereas Legion had Class Order halls and Artifact weapons, appearances, and legendaries, BFA has nothing to "grab you" so to speak.
Also, all of the dungeons are stupid and not enjoyable. When the focus of the game is mostly set on Mythic+, and the dungeons aren't cool and interesting and the classes/specs all suck, the entire game falls to shreds.

BFA is just a bad expansion. Especially bad after how good Legion was.

[schwank05]

I have steadily unsubbed earlier and earlier in expansions since MOP which was the first time I didn't sub 6 months at a crack since the game was released. I think the game has gone down the shitter since CATA ended I miss activated hardmodes, and also miss the fun fights of BC-CATA. I miss Blood DK DPS, I miss COmbat Rogue and basically Armor penn rating in general, I miss old Warrior Tank, I miss Cata Ret Paladin, In general I miss the game Legion I made it 3 months before I unsubbed and I only made it 3 weeks in this shit show of an expansion. I resubbed for a month about 2 months ago and just cant stand this xpac the zones such the classes play like shit, and I want to fly without having to do rep grind. I am patiently awaiting the 27th.

[Lurker1]

I have steadily unsubbed earlier and earlier in expansions since MOP which was the first time I didn't sub 6 months at a crack since the game was released. I think the game has gone down the shitter since CATA ended I miss activated hardmodes, and also miss the fun fights of BC-CATA. I miss Blood DK DPS, I miss COmbat Rogue and basically Armor penn rating in general, I miss old Warrior Tank, I miss Cata Ret Paladin, In general I miss the game Legion I made it 3 months before I unsubbed and I only made it 3 weeks in this shit show of an expansion. I resubbed for a month about 2 months ago and just cant stand this xpac the zones such the classes play like shit, and I want to fly without having to do rep grind. I am patiently awaiting the 27th.

Even if your not playing retail wow anymore thank you for still support WoW in general sir!

[quite an expert in wow]

Mythics are good.

Jaina fight and BoD was fun. Eternal Palace was good. Still havent full cleared heroic.

WPvP was great pre-flight; WPvP still fun if you deepcoral pod (only way to survive divebombs).

Story is fun.

Rated Bgs are fun and competitive at 2k+.

Why so much hate for this expansion. Legion and BFA have been a blast.

i enjoy it too

[durenas]

I just can't get past the basic premise of the horde and the alliance immediately going back to war after it was clearly established in Legion that the Broken Shore alone gutted the alliance and horde armies badly. They need at least a generation to repopulate.

[Zyky]

Raiding didn't get harder than Alaglon and Mimiron Firefighter. I didn't full clear Sunwell in TBC when it was current, but Muru was a bitch. Btw 2100+ attempts on Archimonde in Hyjal.

LOL coming from someone who hasn't done the new raids on Mythic. Raiding has gotten significantly harder than Algalon and Firefighter and you don't have to take my word for it, Method has said it in several interviews(and Method has been top world clearing since BC).

Also if your guild had 2100 pulls on Hyjal Archimonde, your guild was either really REALLY bad and you were stupid enough to stay with them. Or you're grossly exaggerating the amount of pulls you did.

Don't tell me that "raiding wasn't hard." I've never heard of anyone going over 1k attempts in recent wow history. I was so proud to get my tier 6 headpiece that I wore it until late Naxx25 in WotLK (I wore 2set tier 6 in paritcular for the 10% mana buff, very useful on Saphiron). So I wore tier 5 headpiece for 11 months while trying to take down Archimonde.

Raiding was not as hard as it is today, there was significantly less mechanics in Vanilla, BC, and Wrath raids then there are in current raids. This is just a fact.

BC raiding was hard. I'd love to see you do RoS or BB (Black temple) when it was current.

I did multiple times, RoS was all about people not being trash with interrupts and BB was all about stacking up then groups of 5 people rotating out for a debuff. These weren't difficult encounters, M'uru was only difficult because his adds were overtuned and were crushing tanks, which Blizzard fixed after a couple weeks. After that he was a fairly easy encounter.

And if what you're saying is true about current Mythics, I actually want to do them then. Sounds like high end raiding if difficult again.

Then go do it, because I guarantee that you don't have what it takes to be successful in Mythic based on the nonsense you've been spouting.

You're confusing bad gearing (yes RNG sucks) with bad raid design (mechanics/encounters).

Not once did I confuse anything. I clearly stated that the problem with raids is bad design and intentional overtuning, you're the one claiming gear and RNG.

[Shalaator]

LOL coming from someone who hasn't done the new raids on Mythic. Raiding has gotten significantly harder than Algalon and Firefighter and you don't have to take my word for it, Method has said it in several interviews(and Method has been top world clearing since BC).

Also if your guild had 2100 pulls on Hyjal Archimonde, your guild was either really REALLY bad and you were stupid enough to stay with them. Or you're grossly exaggerating the amount of pulls you did.



Raiding was not as hard as it is today, there was significantly less mechanics in Vanilla, BC, and Wrath raids then there are in current raids. This is just a fact.



I did multiple times, RoS was all about people not being trash with interrupts and BB was all about stacking up then groups of 5 people rotating out for a debuff. These weren't difficult encounters, M'uru was only difficult because his adds were overtuned and were crushing tanks, which Blizzard fixed after a couple weeks. After that he was a fairly easy encounter.



Then go do it, because I guarantee that you don't have what it takes to be successful in Mythic based on the nonsense you've been spouting.



Not once did I confuse anything. I clearly stated that the problem with raids is bad design and intentional overtuning, you're the one claiming gear and RNG.

YOu didn't touch BC. Because you obviously don't know how difficult Archimonde was. You're a liar. Btw 2k attempts for Archimonde wasn't that far off for most guilds that actually killed him.

https://www.engadget.com/2007/06/19/..._y0lp-hLemhsWU

You will see me dying in our Archimonde movie (when it's out). This fight is a lot of fun, just because of how it focuses on everyone's performance. If one person messes up (i.e dies) then the fight instantly gets a lot harder. It's also a race and avoidance fight; you need to avoid the fire on the ground because it's very lethal. However, the fire is very unpredictable-- it's hard to avoid it, it tend to have its own life and chase after you.. oops. Also, there's another awesome element to this fight which is called "Air Burst" (or something similar) which knocks a couple of your raid members up into the air (very very far up) and you get an item from Tyrande Whisperwind that gives you safe fall. The catch is, though, you must use it when you're close to the ground, because it has a very short duration. It's hilarious watching when people fail at timing this and die from the fall damage... hehe. I love using that item and it's one of the major reasons I enjoy the Archimonde fight. Overall, it's a very hard fight that requires everyone to be on their very A-game or it's over very very soon.

You're talking points on BB/RoS sound like you googled the fight and did minimal research and then spit out some talking points. You never did those fights either.

Stop lying.

Good bye.

And Muru was still a pain post-nerf.

Stop lying.

You weren't there.

[Aphrel]

3) Island expeditions suck but it's just 30min/week, I don't really care
4) Infinite AP grind

I find these two statements conflicting. If you are grinding AP then surely you are spending more than 30min per week doing islands?!

[RobertMugabe]

Mythics are good.

Jaina fight and BoD was fun. Eternal Palace was good. Still havent full cleared heroic.

WPvP was great pre-flight; WPvP still fun if you deepcoral pod (only way to survive divebombs).

Story is fun.

Rated Bgs are fun and competitive at 2k+.

Why so much hate for this expansion. Legion and BFA have been a blast.

I like all of the as well. However the gearing/azerite is pretty bad and the new features honestly suck.

[kaminaris]

I find these two statements conflicting. If you are grinding AP then surely you are spending more than 30min per week doing islands?!

There is no point in actively farming azerite anymore. It's not legion where having 1 level more gave you 0.5% dps increase, neck is weak as it should be (roughly 0.05% dps increas per level). Also 15 minutes is enough for week, once rabbit charms vendor comes, stockpile 300 of them.

[Ludvig]

Everything aside from the story point is subjective. I honestly think BfA's only massive and glaring flaw is the story direction. But that's what happens when you hire Christie Golden.

Well of course one's opinion of an expansion and its systems would be subjective. Either you like the systems or you don't. Also, there's probably some people out there who like the story, but I agree with you on that point.

Anyway, I despise what they've done to classes since legion and bfa is even worse. Azerite armor doesn't do its job of "filling the holes" of the specs like blizzard have said (tbh neither did artifacts/legendaries but they did a better attempt). They should just make classes fun to begin with. And make a class a class, not a placeholder that is three different specs. It's sort of like an empty shell that you "fill" with a spec. The shell should already be half full before you consider specs. Give all shaman specs shocks, give mages spells from all schools regardless of spec etc.

The content in before 8.2 wasn't really great, the best part was the dungeons and they're way inferior to the legion dungeons anyway imo. Islands are pretty boring and warfronts are just horrendous. I don't even bother doing them anymore, even with the rewards. Speaking of which, the rewards for doing trivial stuff is too great even without the potential titanforging. Warforging and titanforging is also killing the game; a piece which would be BiS is just a piece of scrap if it's not TF'd. I want PvE and PvP vendors back so much.

Story is super cringe. I never really cared that much about wow's story but Jesus, this time it's so bad it's painful and very hard to ignore.

The power creep throughout the expansion is way too big, at the beginning we had about 80k hp when newly dinged, now it's over 300k if you're geared. And we're in the second patch. Every new patch also just makes the old one irrelevant immediately. This has been an issue for a while though.

[TheRevenantHero]

Wouldnt go that far mate lol.

pretty sure 90+% of the playerbase would agree with the description 'terrible' for islands and warfronts, as well as almost all of those points.

Except A LOT of people actually enjoy Islands and Warfronts. I'm one of those people.

[Jamie081]

You ENJOYED BFA? It's not over for at least another year lmfao

[Explosivo]

I also am 100% not affiliated with Blizzard and like this expansion because it was very different from any previous expansion with unique experiences!