I'm pretty sure I was at 60 %+ on TBC, and TBC had a higher yellow damage proportion.
There is not a lot of poison damage in Vanilla (as poisons don't scale with AP and many bosses are immune to them) and evisc was a very small part of damage, as most CP were used to keep S'n'D up.
Ya maybe im thinking of combat swords, only reason i was confused is i saw a guy on private servers today using a lower DPS dagger in his mainhand and i assumed he did the calculations that it won out on backstab damage compared to having the 65 dps weapon in mainhand. Then again its a PS and who knows what kind of wonky stuff goes down there lol.
Does not computeHow much of a DPS increase are human weapon specializations?
- - - Updated - - -
You cant backstab with swords. The backstab spec is significantly higher yellow damage then combat/swords is.
The reason for this is that you have more points in the sin tree, and that backstab has a much higher chance to crit meaning you often get more combo points meaning higher yellow damage.
So either its the combat/swords white damage build or its the sin/dagger/backstab build. The backstab build does need more gear but its competitively viable in later tiers.
Last edited by ClassicPeon; 2019-08-22 at 09:59 AM.
Yes, I am going to play classic so I can constantly watch dps meter and feel the amazing vibe of this beautiful game of being among the top. Maybe it's time to get rid of this obsession, cause that's exactly what it is.
How so, seems obvious.
Humans have weapon racial which is nearly entirely for PvE.
Dwarves have stoneform which is nearly entirely for PvP.
What's not to compute ?
He was speaking of combat dagger spec, which has about identical yellow damage as combat sword. You're speaking of the assa spec, which is slightly lower DPS overall but more of it is yellow.You cant backstab with swords. The backstab spec is significantly higher yellow damage then combat/swords is.
The reason for this is that you have more points in the sin tree, and that backstab has a much higher chance to crit meaning you often get more combo points meaning higher yellow damage.
I thought the deal with glancing blows and weapon skill was not that it reduced the chance of them happening but that it increased their damage (or decreased the damage penalty, whichever way you prefer to look at it) meaning that with sufficiently high weapon skill it is in fact possible to make glancing blows hit for more than non glancing...
Which is why you sometimes hit lowbie mobs for huge numbers...
Is that just "Jesus christ what are you smoking??" or is there any resemblence to what happens in there somewhere?
From the Wowpedia someone linked earlier...
I know rogues in the pirate server guild I was in was using it as reason to not cap weapon skill making the sword from .. gonna say "Vael" - the one with +4 swords skill, was still of massive use to them despite already having the +5 swords from spec or racial or w/e.Glancing Blow damage reduction
The damage reduction is:
(Target’s Defense skill – Your Weapon skill - 5) * 3%.
This gives a level 60 player, with fully trained but otherwise unbuffed weapon skill, a 15% damage reduction with all Glancing Blows against level 62 mobs, and a 30% damage reduction with all Glancing Blows against level 63 mobs.
Unlike the chances of getting a glancing blow, the player's weapon skill is not capped at level * 5 in the damage reduction formula. With +5 weapon skill, a level 60 player attacking a level 63 NPC will see the same amount of glancing blows (40%), but only 15% damage reduction. With +10 weapon skill, the damage reduction becomes negligible.
I dont mean to lecture you but thats not how it is
1. the op asked a question, the guy i quoted answered a different question. That would be an exception or a does not compute error. Compute? :P
2. Combat dagger and combat swords do not do identical damage. And combat sword scales much better. Combat dagger spec is really rare because you cant get Seal of fate/daggerspec and Oppertunity. So instead they forgo the 5% crit from dagger spec, take seal of fate and oppertunity and wait for later tiers where more crit is available. Seal of Fate/backstab is actually close to/better than combat/sword in later tiers.
Also pretty sure(allthough noone really plays it so i dont know) that combat dagger(lol) has more yellow damage since it uses the multipliers from backstab to simply deal more damage with its yellow attack ,but uses daggers and not sword spec so it deals less white damage. Like thats actually just makes sense
Its abt 4%. I think its significant enough. Also dont forget the hit is nice, but you shld really go for 308 skill for the glancing penalty. This allows human rogues to put 1/2 pts in the expertise talent instead of 2/2. So you save 3% hit, reduce your glancing penalty, and get 1 extra talent pt, usually put into 5% more evis dmg.
- - - Updated - - -
You are correct. At 15 weapon skill to defense difference, it's a 35% dmg penalty on glances. When u get to 308, so a 7 skill difference, its dropped to a 5% penalty. This is why humans are so good.
Obsession or not, you bring 3-4% more damage for the group/raid. Whether you are minmaxing or not caring, it is something more, like having the ability to put another flask.
I know it is not much, and that is the reason I want to play Dwarf like I did in Vanilla, but it still feels like I am slightly crippling myself.
Ah, yeah, I get it now
Combat dagger was not rare, it was actually one of the three standard spec (the others being, well, combat sword and seal fate). It was actually the highest damage spec in early tier (can't say about late tiers, don't remember).2. Combat dagger and combat swords do not do identical damage. And combat sword scales much better. Combat dagger spec is really rare because you cant get Seal of fate/daggerspec and Oppertunity. So instead they forgo the 5% crit from dagger spec, take seal of fate and oppertunity and wait for later tiers where more crit is available. Seal of Fate/backstab is actually close to/better than combat/sword in later tiers.
You can't forgo dagger spec and still be "combat spec", because that would make it rather a "seal fate spec"
The core of a combat spec was 15/28/5, with the last three points being either put in Combat to get AdreRush (but with 2 points spent in substandard DPS talents, like 2 points in Agression or Improved Sprint) or into Assa to get Ruthlessness or a bit of poison.
Combat Dagger spec has not noticeably more yellow damage. It hits harder per hit, but it gives less CP (60 energy per CP instead of 40 for swords) so you basically never eviscerate, and sword spec has more talent increasing poison damage.Also pretty sure(allthough noone really plays it so i dont know) that combat dagger(lol) has more yellow damage since it uses the multipliers from backstab to simply deal more damage with its yellow attack ,but uses daggers and not sword spec so it deals less white damage. Like thats actually just makes sense
Basically, white damage is the same amount in all cases, so if one spec had a noticeably higher yellow damage, it would be plain superior, and both are somewhat comparable.
I know that feeling, and it's so fucking dumb, especially when it's going to be classic. It's going to be steamrolled by most guilds in a decent timeframe for everyone. I just feel that retail is better for, if dps is that important.
Picking a race in terms of pvp is actually something that can have an impact. F.ex UD priests have it's own spell even, cannibalize is pretty sick, and wotf is just op at times, as is orcs hardiness (rogues just hate that yellow text of *resist*).
Iirc, I think dwarfs has pretty good racial when it comes to pvp, and sorry if you rolled on a pve server
So, if you're going to be raiding there's something to be said about what the other rogues are playing.
In the guild I'm in there are 5 rogues, 4 are human and I'm the dwarf.
All the Human rogues are after swords and all the daggers get fed to the dwarf.
If you're planning on doing pvp, dwarf is far superior to human.
I do disagree that it was better then swords early on, unless you didnt go for hit gear or something, then idk.
You actually go sorta deep into combat as the Seal of Fate spec.
Combat swords(which is the most mainstream and best combat spec for vanilla) didnt put any points into sub.
Combat swords was 19/32/0 and had like 8 points in combat that where kinda useless for raiding in most scenarios.
For what it's worth, the only moderately challenging gear checks will be in AQ40 and Naxx, and even then it won't be nearly as challenging as it was in 2006 due to all the advantages we have now. Also, there should be less glory in being high on damage meters and logs than on live, because 1. except arguably hunters every class has an extremely simple 'rotation' requiring little to no skill, 2. playing a lot in the sense of getting a lot of consumables and getting more gear than other people will be a huge factor (time is way more important than skill) and 3. a bigger factor than your personal effort is your guild's kill speed. Unless you're in a hardcore guild that gets all world buffs and insane consumable stacking, you won't be getting anywhere on logs no matter how good you are since the top guilds will kill bosses in half the time or less of more relaxed guilds.
As such... if you really prefer a race for aesthetics rather than racials its not a huge deal. The PvE is easily doable if you have the time to invest in the game, and a dedicated guild.