1. #1

    When first 20 men Onyxia and Rag kill?

    Raids in Classic seem to be slightly undertuned :P, so - since we dont want any changes to the game, the only way to make raiding "achievements" more interesting - is to kill bosses with as little amount of players as possible.

    that s the valid way to decide which Guild is the best.

    10 men Onyxia and Rag kill possible? how about 5?

  2. #2
    The Lightbringer Hottage's Avatar
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    Raids are not undertuned, they are exactly the way they were in patch 1.12.

    Patch 1.12 balance along with 15 years of perfecting strategies and class mechanics as well as abusing consumables will make probably everything up to Nefarian a cakewalk.

    Nefarian will only be a roadblock as you need to farm enough Onxyia scales to craft cloaks for a good percentage of the raid.

    Onyxia was already 4 or 5 manned back in vanilla, so that's not really a new achievement.
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  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Freezzie View Post
    Raids in Classic were actually very easy :P
    Fixed

    10chars

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Hottage View Post
    Raids are not undertuned, they are exactly the way they were in patch 1.12.

    Patch 1.12 balance along with 15 years of perfecting strategies and class mechanics as well as abusing consumables will make probably everything up to Nefarian a cakewalk.

    Nefarian will only be a roadblock as you need to farm enough Onxyia scales to craft cloaks for a good percentage of the raid.

    Onyxia was already 4 or 5 manned back in vanilla, so that's not really a new achievement.
    People said the same thing about people needing fire resist gear. I’m not sure what nef cloaks do, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s by-passed by some clever cookies.

    I thought Raggy wouldn’t be a week 1 kill, but I was wrong.

  5. #5
    What did people expect? Its the final Vanilla patch made for naxx/prepare for tbc while everything before is nerfed and catchup mechanics made available (1.10 items/stats rework).
    Its like this in every single WoW Expansion and has nothing to do with Vanilla itself.

    It will be the same with TBC 2.4.3 or WOTLK 3.3.5 Server when they will come.

    People remember now Ulduar as the superhard megaraid with Mimiron Firefighter/Light in the Darkness. I cant wait to see the outrageous crying when this will be done first ID on release in the future because WOTLK will be released in 3.3.5 Values when it comes.

    or when you 5man Kara in 2hours in blues

    but of course it must be bad pserver scripts and so on

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Freezzie View Post
    10 men Onyxia and Rag kill possible? how about 5?
    I think Onyxia was 3-manned back in Vanilla. There should be a youtube video for it somewhere if you want to watch half an hour of hitting internet dragon with a sword.

  7. #7
    You know, this post made me recall what they did on a certain private server.

    They introduced a glory of the molten raider , essentially glory of the raider achis for classic. It was a fun little addition and it did take the guilds who got it a fair while to get them done.

    I guess blizzard could potentially add something like that but only do it so you reap the rewards in retail not classic. Keeps it line with no changes, but on the flip side of that it would be a kick in the bollocks to the classic only players.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Hottage View Post
    Raids are not undertuned, they are exactly the way they were in patch 1.12.

    Patch 1.12 balance along with 15 years of perfecting strategies and class mechanics as well as abusing consumables will make probably everything up to Nefarian a cakewalk.

    Nefarian will only be a roadblock as you need to farm enough Onxyia scales to craft cloaks for a good percentage of the raid.

    Onyxia was already 4 or 5 manned back in vanilla, so that's not really a new achievement.
    the cloak is only needed for the MT +1healer

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Freezzie View Post
    Raids in Classic seem to be slightly undertuned :P,
    They aren't undertuned. They are exactly the way they were in Classic. Difference is we aren't as dumb as we were then. We have better machines and internet so we area constantly lagging / playing at ~5-15 fps. Which makes a huge difference.

    The only raids that were really overtuned were those that had mathematical issues like C'Thun at one point.

    You also have to take into account this is Patch 1.12 where classes have undergone various changes from when the raids were originally launched.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by jiih View Post
    What did people expect? Its the final Vanilla patch made for naxx/prepare for tbc while everything before is nerfed and catchup mechanics made available (1.10 items/stats rework).
    Its like this in every single WoW Expansion and has nothing to do with Vanilla itself.

    It will be the same with TBC 2.4.3 or WOTLK 3.3.5 Server when they will come.

    People remember now Ulduar as the superhard megaraid with Mimiron Firefighter/Light in the Darkness. I cant wait to see the outrageous crying when this will be done first ID on release in the future because WOTLK will be released in 3.3.5 Values when it comes.

    or when you 5man Kara in 2hours in blues

    but of course it must be bad pserver scripts and so on
    Idk what groups you've had in timewalking recently, but I still get wipe fests on people doing the normal fight on yogg let alone when they've tried alone in the dark xD

    But speaking of TBC and Wrath, blizzard had their shit togeather a bit more when it comes to itemisation, balances atleast to a certain degree (bar the original release DK) I don't see why we couldn't start from scratch on any of those

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Hottage View Post
    Raids are not undertuned, they are exactly the way they were in patch 1.12.

    Patch 1.12 balance along with 15 years of perfecting strategies and class mechanics as well as abusing consumables will make probably everything up to Nefarian a cakewalk.

    Nefarian will only be a roadblock as you need to farm enough Onxyia scales to craft cloaks for a good percentage of the raid.

    Onyxia was already 4 or 5 manned back in vanilla, so that's not really a new achievement.

    Wasn't there a LOS spot behind the nefarian throne that you could use to dodge breath? Which means only a couple people actually have to have the cloak as main tank and heals. Was that fixed? Been about 13 years I guess when I last did that raid at 60

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Soikona View Post
    People said the same thing about people needing fire resist gear. I’m not sure what nef cloaks do, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s by-passed by some clever cookies.

    I thought Raggy wouldn’t be a week 1 kill, but I was wrong.
    Shadowflame is an ability Nef uses when he lands. It deals like ~3k up front damage and leaves a dot on you that ticks for ~2k every second for some stupid amount of time. Like 30 seconds. You can't realistically heal through it. The cloak makes it so you cannot get the dot.

    There is a couple of ways to circumvent it. For a time you could los the cast by hiding behind the throne. I don't know if this is or will be fixed. You can stack level 20 locks outside the instance and soulstone the raid, or at least those who don't have cloaks. Though that will mean you have 30min between attempts.
    Unreason and anti-intellectualism abominate thought. Thinking implies disagreement; and disagreement implies nonconformity; and nonconformity implies heresy; and heresy implies disloyalty — so, obviously, thinking must be stopped. But shouting is not a substitute for thinking and reason is not the subversion but the salvation of freedom. - Adlai Stevenson

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