How does the political scale actually work?

[Phon]

Like, how do people decide where someone is located politically?

Like this,

I think LGBT marriage should be legal and anyone refusing to perform it should be removed from their position.

I support universal healthcare

I think we should have severe sanctions against Russia, Saudi Arabia, North Korea and China.

I think we should have very harsh prison sentences for violent, drugs and sexual crimes up to and including death penalty in the most severe cases.

I think we should have mandatory 18 years of education.

I think further education beyond high school level of education should be free for the individual and paid for with taxes.

I think we should harsher penalize companies who do not abide by regulations surrounding workers safety and wellbeing.

I think we should have strong unions that can put pressure on companies to pay a fair wage for the work people do.

I think there should be no subsidizing for religious institutions in any form at all, if they can't get money from their members then tough luck for them.

I think immigration should be restricted to only bringing family, such as a couple bringing over their partner or families bringing over other biological or adopted family members and companies looking to fill positions they would have a hard time finding people for and people who have such amount of money that they don't need to work and just want a change of scenery. If they cannot sustain themselves, they need to leave the country.

I think we should stop supporting Israel. Let them deal with all the trouble themselves.

I think the authorities should be allowed to detain people indefinitely if they suspect an individual is planning to commit a terror attack or is in contact with terrorists.

I think we should force companies producing media such as movies to make it available at a reasonable cost on internet the moment it releases. No more prosecuting people for wanting to watch a movie at home in peace and quiet. Watching it at a movie theater should not be the only option when it just releases.

I think anyone that sympathizes with violent ideologies based on racial supremacy, religious supremacy or otherwise any sort of supremacy that targets groups should be locked up indefinitely or until they have been deemed to have forsaken the ideology.

I think the state should penalize companies that provide rented housing to the population if they want too much in rent for normal people to afford them. No more paying more than half or more of your montly income to rent.

I think companies that mislead or otherwise misrepresent the populace in a country about their products or services should be held responsible, with the worst possible outcome being total asset seizure and imprisonment for the people running the company.

I think nepotism should be harshly punished, with the possibility of imprisoning the offender and the one they favored for up towards 10 years. If it's done within politics, it should be possible with up towards 30 years.

I think we should get rid of the royal family, stop supporting them.

I think the constitution should be reformed as such that it requires a vote from the populace in a country on changes to the constitution to prevent politicians from changing it as they see fit.

The populace should be able to call for a new election during a ruling period if the ruling party/parties are betraying their stated ideology or promises.

Accepting bribes as a person in a position of authority in exchange of favors to another party, be it a company or a private individual, should have a penalty of up towards 30 years in prison. In very extreme cases, even death.

Neglecting the environmental impact of an event such as oil leaking or otherwise harmful material, be it intentional or an accident, should be penalized by up towards 30 years in prison and total asset seizure.

Unauthorized severe destruction of property, such as setting fire to a forest, house or otherwise any property that is worth a lot to a company or an individual without permission by either the company/individual or the authorities should be penalized by up towards 20 years in prison and total asset seizure.

All guns should be banned outside of those for hunting or sports or law enforcement or military. Ammo should be personally produced so they can be tracked to the specific individual that obtained it.

Just based on these things, where would I be on the political scale?

[Elegiac]

The political spectrum is a function of fundamental beliefs on the nature of human hierarchy and quality. What you've listed are proximate political issues that don't have clear left/right distinction and have become entrenched more as a function of partisanism than genuine philosophical disagreement.

[Adam Jensen]

I support universal healthcare

That makes you a socialist pinko commie, you Marxist bastard. - every Republican and American conservative.

[NED funded]

Its kinda nonsensical. The two axis doesn't do itself any favors and so far I think its kinda biased towards putting you at least centerleft if you believe in anything resembling a functional government.

[Adam Jensen]

Its kinda nonsensical. The two axis doesn't do itself any favors and so far I think its kinda of biased towards putting you at least centerleft if you believe in anything resembling a functional government.

According to the American Right, that's all it takes to be a full blown communist.

[JohnBrown1917]

Its kinda nonsensical. The two axis doesn't do itself any favors and so far I think its kinda biased towards putting you at least centerleft if you believe in anything resembling a functional government.

Yet you're one of the more right-wing posters here, funny how that works.

[Ghostpanther]

It's easy to determine you would identify with the far left Democrats in the US. Overall. Some of your points do not apply to the US. We do not have royal families.

[JohnBrown1917]

It's easy to determine you would identify with the far left Democrats in the US. Overall. Some of your points do not apply to the US. We do not have royal families.

Far left is anarchism. Not that anybody would expect you to know that. No dem is anything close to far left lol

[Felya]

Its kinda nonsensical. The two axis doesn't do itself any favors and so far I think its kinda biased towards putting you at least centerleft if you believe in anything resembling a functional government.

The scale isn’t biased, it’s the individual who believes they are towards the middle. You can see that in all the projecting that happens.

It’s also not ‘nonsensical’, but becomes as such, when you start hearing there is a US and EU versions of the scale. That’s not a problem with the scale it self, but the individual needing to justify their actions as unbiased or center. The scale doesn’t change between EU and US, those who assert it are just disingenuous. Measuring distance or weight would seem nonsensical too, if a kilometer was a different distance in US and EU.

[Adam Jensen]

It's easy to determine you would identify with the far left Democrats in the US. Overall. Some of your points do not apply to the US. We do not have royal families.

Thanks for proving my point Ghostpanther.

[Felya]

It's easy to determine you would identify with the far left Democrats in the US. Overall. Some of your points do not apply to the US. We do not have royal families.

An example of what I was just saying. Imagine taking a 10 pound rock from US to England. When you land in England, the rock becomes 1 pound or 3 pounds or what ever the guy holding the rock tells you it is. Funny thing is, that actually does happen, but it’s on two different scales... it’s metric vs imperial, resulting in conversion math. As in, two different scales with two different units of measurement.

The reason there is confusion in US, is because two parties running on which is the more conservative, has a side effect of one inherently being closer to center than another. It’s why the need to define democrats as extreme liberals. If politicians were not just being demagogue, the real argument would be, which of the two conservatives parties are closer to center.

The problem, is people confuse or convolute the economic scale, with a political one. Socialism is a liberal economic policy, the way you implement it, is political policy. If you implement socialism, through a singular government head, without public majority... You are a right wing authoritarian, that is implementing left wing liberal economic policy. If you implement capitalism, through a public democratic majority... you are a liberal politically, but an economic conservative. What modern times don’t seem to understand, that for an average ass hole like most of us, the economic policy doesn’t fucking mater. You will get your same allotment either way, it is far more important what authority you have over said allotment. I assure you, under socialism or capitalism, your morsel will be indistinguishable. What you need to protect is your ability to do what ever you want with said morsel. It’s why authoritarianism is abhorrent, regardless if it’s coupled with socialism or capitalism.

TLDR: Football Sunday... woot! Go hawks!

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Thanks for proving my point Ghostpanther.

Where would you put a singular government decree for people to stop using coal, to switch to clean energy?

I think this is the sort of thing that confuses people. Because that’s both... the government decree is right wing, but it’s to implement left wing economically.

[Sunseeker]

I think this is the sort of thing that confuses people. Because that’s both... the government decree is right wing, but it’s to implement left wing economically.

Because, in brief, the alignment system, I mean political system, has both an X and a Y axis. Things aren't linear from Communism to Fascism.

[Endus]

Its kinda nonsensical. The two axis doesn't do itself any favors and so far I think its kinda biased towards putting you at least centerleft if you believe in anything resembling a functional government.

This doesn't make any sense. The left-right scale is based, fundamentally, on your approach to hierachy. If you see hierarchical systems, like social classes or racial segregations, as "right", "natural", "good", or "unavoidable", and your system is meant to allow them to continue relatively unchecked if not deliberately create/foster them, you're right-wing. If you see such systems and want to mitigate or reduce their impact on society/people, you're left-wing.

Honestly, thinking this is "biased" suggests your perspective is what's off.

It’s also not ‘nonsensical’, but becomes as such, when you start hearing there is a US and EU versions of the scale. That’s not a problem with the scale it self, but the individual needing to justify their actions as unbiased or center. The scale doesn’t change between EU and US, those who assert it are just disingenuous. Measuring distance or weight would seem nonsensical too, if a kilometer was a different distance in US and EU.

Right, there's a lot of pressure in the USA to ignore context and insist that their center-right "center" is actually centrist, not center-right. To pretend that the Democrats are strongly left-wing, when they're mostly center to center-right (Pelosi and Biden, for instance, are center-right), with a few slightly left-wing standouts like Warren.

If you transplanted them into any other Western system that uses the left/right axis, they'd be comfortably labelled as such. Except in the USA. Because there's been a lot of effort put into twisting their Overton Window into a funhouse mirror.

Where would you put a singular government decree for people to stop using coal, to switch to clean energy?

I think this is the sort of thing that confuses people. Because that’s both... the government decree is right wing, but it’s to implement left wing economically.

Really, it's more useful to separate the authoritarian-anarchism axis from the left-right axis. Authoritarian rule can be used to implement left- or right-wing policies.

Authoritarianism tends towards right-wing views, broadly, because "who gets to make the rules" creates a hierarchical structure; Stalin's creation of the Party, for instance, did much to break down the old aristocratic hierarchy, but only to establish his new ideological hierarchy. But it's not inherently right-wing, it's just very much open to that kind of approach.

Note that these two axes aren't even the only possible axes to use to measure this stuff.

[Ghostpanther]

Thanks for proving my point Ghostpanther.

You are welcome. Explains why overall at this point, I hope Biden wins the Democrat nomination. Some of his proposals will never become reality, but he is still not as radical as the other main contestants.

[Endus]

You are welcome. Explains why overall at this point, I hope Biden wins the Democrat nomination. Some of his proposals will never become reality, but he is still not as radical as the other main contestants.

There isn't a Democratic candidate who's "radical". You prefer Biden because he's the most right-wing of a fairly centrist group of candidates, and you yourself are right-wing.

[NED funded]

The scale isn’t biased, it’s the individual who believes they are towards the middle. You can see that in all the projecting that happens.

It’s also not ‘nonsensical’, but becomes as such, when you start hearing there is a US and EU versions of the scale. That’s not a problem with the scale it self, but the individual needing to justify their actions as unbiased or center. The scale doesn’t change between EU and US, those who assert it are just disingenuous. Measuring distance or weight would seem nonsensical too, if a kilometer was a different distance in US and EU.

Measuring political ideology is v different than grabbing a ruler and measuring distance. Also I'm not fond of cross countries comparisons because of the many differences between them. Trump is running on anti-immigration campaign and that is considered right wing here but it tends to be a lefty position in other countries that have openly socialist governments because it undermines labour or to protect sovereignty against imperialists

[Endus]

Measuring political ideology is v different than grabbing a ruler and measuring distance. Also I'm not fond of cross countries comparisons because of the many differences between them.

The left-right axis is an objective scale, not a subjective one.

You're making an argument akin to "you can't use an English ruler in America!"

Trump is running on anti-immigration campaign and that is considered right wing here but it tends to be a lefty position in other countries that have openly socialist governments because it undermines labour or to protect sovereignty against imperialists

This really has no connection to reality at all.

[Slant]

Because, in brief, the alignment system, I mean political system, has both an X and a Y axis. Things aren't linear from Communism to Fascism.

Where's that graphic from? Because as far as I can tell, some forum goer went wild with photoshop and tried to win the "use as many buzzphrases as possible in one picture" challenge.

Social Democratism and Democratic Socialism next to each other? That doesn't even make sense outside of madly pedantic forum discussions. And someone thinking socialism is a political stream instead of an economical idea is clearly lost on what he's trying to accomplish.

Personal favourite? Anarcho-Collectivist. I've really just seen that from nutcases on here that are fascinated by obscure and mostly paradoxical ideas. Not anything you'd take seriously for a political discussion.

[Kraenen]

There isn't a Democratic candidate who's "radical". You prefer Biden because he's the most right-wing of a fairly centrist group of candidates, and you yourself are right-wing.

This is on it's face, wrong, for obvious reasons.

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This really has no connection to reality at all.

It's probably easy to find a few examples - I'd expect some in Africa in particular. Anti-Chinese (or anti-western) sentiment for example can be semantically tied with nativist/workers empowerment.

Random example from Denmark said by Mette Frederiksen:

“For me, it is becoming increasingly clear that the price of unregulated globalisation, mass immigration and the free movement of labour is paid for by the lower classes,” she said in a recent biography.

[Sunseeker]

Where's that graphic from? Because as far as I can tell, some forum goer went wild with photoshop and tried to win the "use as many buzzphrases as possible in one picture" challenge.

Social Democratism and Democratic Socialism next to each other? That doesn't even make sense outside of madly pedantic forum discussions. And someone thinking socialism is a political stream instead of an economical idea is clearly lost on what he's trying to accomplish.

Personal favourite? Anarcho-Collectivist. I've really just seen that from nutcases on here that are fascinated by obscure and mostly paradoxical ideas. Not anything you'd take seriously for a political discussion.

Speaking as a political scientist, it's pretty accurate. Yes, it covers a lot of obscure socio-political-economic that most people don't talk about much less understand but reductivism is the bane of political discourse.