"No changes/QOL" = in denial.

[SirCowdog]

Classic having a better community than live/progression/current WoW is a bit of a joke. It has a sugar sweetened version but you still have the assholes - heck, even vanilla had the assholes, just worse now.

It hasn't even had time to form any kind of real community yet. It's literally just a mishmash of players with completely disparate views on the game.

The BfA community mostly has a convenience oriented outlook on everything and tends towards efficiency-based meta play.
Returning oldschoolders who haven't played in upwards of a decade, and have no real concept of what more modern players expect or are willing to accept.
Private Server crew who are operating off their own personalized playstyle of what they wrong through Vanilla was as filtered through nostalgia.

Nobody has claim to what the Classic community "should be". Even Blizzard has changed the fundamental nature of the game, via layering and other technical and mechanical updates, away from Vanilla's dynamic.

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Seeing the entire classic community split between 4 different games would be...stoopid imo.

I think this is an irrational fear. Modern wow is already catering to M+ players, raiders, PVPers, Pet Battles, Xmog chasers, casuals, hardcores, etc, etc, etc.

Having more game modes isn't a problem here, especially when those game modes appeal to different groups of the playerbase who might not otherwise be interested in WOW at all. This is proven by how many players returned to the game specifically for Classic.

[Lochton]

It hasn't even had time to form any kind of real community yet. It's literally just a mishmash of players with completely disparate views on the game.

I know but to point out what people state, hence the comment.

[SirCowdog]

If a hybrid in a DPS roll can't do as well as "pure" DPS, then they weren't brought to raids. This is what happened. No one brought them for "spot healing" or whatever. Maybe you had that one shadow priest for Cthun for a certain role, but that was about it.

Moreover, back in Vanilla many players simply didn't know any better, so there was more tolerance for these kind of non-optimal specs. But now? In today's modern environment of easy access to infomation and super-optimal meta standards, if you're not playing a "good" spec, your chances of getting a group are going to be even lower than back in vanilla.

However, I will be interested to see if someone comes up for a way that these traditionally bad specs to contribute to the group in clever ways. Either through some kind of bizarre "clever use of game mechanics" like the Reck-bomb, or through combinations of abilities and lesser-known gear.

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I know but to point out what people state, hence the comment.

Sorry, yeah. I'm mostly agreeing with you.

[Big Thanks]

I think this is an irrational fear. Modern wow is already catering to M+ players, raiders, PVPers, Pet Battles, Xmog chasers, casuals, hardcores, etc, etc, etc.

Having more game modes isn't a problem here, especially when those game modes appeal to different groups of the playerbase who might not otherwise be interested in WOW at all This is proven by how many players returned to the game specifically for Classic.

Modern wow is one game.
All those things are inside the same game.

Splitting community into 4 different games, when, im pretty sure, one person with a life can only play 1 of the games...2 max.

I find it incredibly disruptive to the Classic community. But thats just my opinion.

[SirCowdog]

Modern wow is one game.
All those things are inside the same game.

Splitting community into 4 different games, when, im pretty sure, one person with a life can only play 1 of the games...2 max.

I find it incredibly disruptive to the Classic community. But thats just my opinion.

I think you're assuming that the "Classic Community" is more cohesive than it is. In the same post that you quoted I explained the illusion of "Classic Community" to Gehco.

I really think you're worrying about a problem that doesn't actually exists.

[Big Thanks]

I think you're assuming that the "Classic Community" is more cohesive than it is. In the same post that you quoted I explained the illusion of "Classic Community" to Gehco.

I really think you're worrying about a problem that doesn't actually exists.

What does the "type" of community we have in Classic have anything to do with splitting the population across 4 different games.
My worry is having Classic dead, TBC dead, Wrath dead, BfA dead.

Or replace "dead" with "somewhat mildly populated"

[Maudib]

@no changes simply means the playerbase does not trust Blizzard to making any changes as it may strongly impact the experience.

Case in point.. Layering exploiting.

Of course there are things people WOULD change if hey knew it would have no adverse effect on the overall experience. But Blizzard cannot be trusted with this.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

@no changes simply means the playerbase does not trust Blizzard to making any changes as it may strongly impact the experience.

Case in point.. Layering exploiting.

Of course there are things people WOULD change if hey knew it would have no adverse effect on the overall experience. But Blizzard cannot be trusted with this.

Blizzard said its a minor issue, do you have any verifiable proof its some massive issue?

[Doctor Funkenstein]

Um no, hybrids were programmed to be weaker then their counterparts, it had nothing to do with the player skill and skill IS NOT a factor in classic/vanilla, you hit 2 maybe 3 buttons, check the logs. Now if hybrids could even do as well as the other classes then there obviously wouldn't be a issue about what guilds would take to raids as all would be viable.

Jesus Christ, learn to read before replying to something.

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Ideally, you would be correct. But you'd be ignorant to act like that is in any way reality, in classic or vanilla.

It was reality. Unfortunately, the game is chock-full of ignorant people like yourself who regurgitate whatever they read or hear from elitist douchebags, and consider it fact.

You'll have to forgive me if I don't put a single solitary fuck into anything people like you have to say on, well, just about any topic relating to the game.

Infracted: Flaming {MoanaLisa}

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No one brought prot pallies for tanking.
No one brought feral druids for DPS
Ret paladins were a joke.

1.) See above.

2.) You don't speak for everyone. When you do, all you're actually doing is painting yourself as an ignorant fool.

3.) Classes in vanilla didn't come in "specs." A paladin was a paladin was a paladin. Yes, their talents modified their abilities to one extent or another, but all classes had access to nearly all non-talented skills, which included all the fundamental abilities for any role they could perform. A druid could simultaneously heal, tank, and DPS, as could any other so-called hybrid class to one extent or another. Yes, they could improve one or more aspects to focus on, but they could still use all their other skills AS NEEDED during a fight. And that's where their strength was.

But people like you, all you look at are worthless fucking DPS meters and ignore EVERYTHING else. Hell, ten bucks says you're one of those people who think the only way to win a BG is by getting the most killing blows because that puts you at the top of the scorecard. LOL! So fucking worthless.

[Inci]

Not knowing how to play a hybrid class isn't a fault of the class or it's design, it's your insistent that you have to be the best at everything you do and top the meters (which aren't native to the game in the first place).

The role of the hybrid classes are to be exactly that; doing more than one thing at once. You in a DPS role? Fine, it won't be as awesome as the single focus classes you're with, but they also can't do any spot healing or hold a stray couple of mobs that get lose and start eating the healer's face that the tank can't pick up.

It wasn't until the morons at Blizzard decided that they wanted to make the game sound like it had tons of classes and thus reclassified specs as separate classes that things went downhill for them. Now, today, the "hybrid classes" are all the power players in the game, in that they can do all of their roles just as well if not better than the "pure" classes. And THAT, my friend, is what's truly bullshit.

Translation: Stop worrying about fucking asinine damage meters and learn to play your class the way it's meant to be played. You don't want to be able to do a lot of things well but just one thing great? Then PLAY A CLASS THAT DOES IT and leave the hybrids to the players who not only get how they're intended to be played, but enjoy it as well.

Entitled fucks, I tell you...

I'm a fan of your post.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

snip

I'm sorry that you don't know shit about the game. /golfclap

[SirCowdog]

What does the "type" of community we have in Classic have anything to do with splitting the population across 4 different games.
My worry is having Classic dead, TBC dead, Wrath dead, BfA dead.

Or replace "dead" with "somewhat mildly populated"

You said that you thought it be disruptive to the Classic community. My point was that you have this idea that the "classic community" is some kind of cohesive group that's going to be broken up or diminished if there's additional ways to play the game. That's not true.

People are going to play what they enjoy. If Classic doesn't offer what people want, too bad. That doesn't mean that it's the fault of other games or options. It means that individuals like different things. And there's more than enough people(both currently playing wow and not playing wow) to cover all different types of games(Classic, TBC, WotLK, etc)

[javierdsv]

Not knowing how to play a hybrid class isn't a fault of the class or it's design, it's your insistent that you have to be the best at everything you do and top the meters (which aren't native to the game in the first place).

The role of the hybrid classes are to be exactly that; doing more than one thing at once. You in a DPS role? Fine, it won't be as awesome as the single focus classes you're with, but they also can't do any spot healing or hold a stray couple of mobs that get lose and start eating the healer's face that the tank can't pick up.

It wasn't until the morons at Blizzard decided that they wanted to make the game sound like it had tons of classes and thus reclassified specs as separate classes that things went downhill for them. Now, today, the "hybrid classes" are all the power players in the game, in that they can do all of their roles just as well if not better than the "pure" classes. And THAT, my friend, is what's truly bullshit.

Translation: Stop worrying about fucking asinine damage meters and learn to play your class the way it's meant to be played. You don't want to be able to do a lot of things well but just one thing great? Then PLAY A CLASS THAT DOES IT and leave the hybrids to the players who not only get how they're intended to be played, but enjoy it as well.

Entitled fucks, I tell you...

That would work in a world of infinite friends, but not when people have a life and want to deal with efficiency over fun.

You can know how to play your hybrid class, but if people is not letting you in anywhere because of numbers then yeah... it's bad class design.

[Itisamuh]

Not knowing how to play a hybrid class isn't a fault of the class or it's design, it's your insistent that you have to be the best at everything you do and top the meters (which aren't native to the game in the first place).

The role of the hybrid classes are to be exactly that; doing more than one thing at once. You in a DPS role? Fine, it won't be as awesome as the single focus classes you're with, but they also can't do any spot healing or hold a stray couple of mobs that get lose and start eating the healer's face that the tank can't pick up.

It wasn't until the morons at Blizzard decided that they wanted to make the game sound like it had tons of classes and thus reclassified specs as separate classes that things went downhill for them. Now, today, the "hybrid classes" are all the power players in the game, in that they can do all of their roles just as well if not better than the "pure" classes. And THAT, my friend, is what's truly bullshit.

Translation: Stop worrying about fucking asinine damage meters and learn to play your class the way it's meant to be played. You don't want to be able to do a lot of things well but just one thing great? Then PLAY A CLASS THAT DOES IT and leave the hybrids to the players who not only get how they're intended to be played, but enjoy it as well.

Entitled fucks, I tell you...

This. All that needs to be said in my book.

[Adam Jensen]

Jesus Christ, learn to read before replying to something.

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It was reality. Unfortunately, the game is chock-full of ignorant people like yourself who regurgitate whatever they read or hear from elitist douchebags, and consider it fact.

You'll have to forgive me if I don't put a single solitary fuck into anything people like you have to say on, well, just about any topic relating to the game.

Infracted: Flaming {MoanaLisa}

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1.) See above.

2.) You don't speak for everyone. When you do, all you're actually doing is painting yourself as an ignorant fool.

3.) Classes in vanilla didn't come in "specs." A paladin was a paladin was a paladin. Yes, their talents modified their abilities to one extent or another, but all classes had access to nearly all non-talented skills, which included all the fundamental abilities for any role they could perform. A druid could simultaneously heal, tank, and DPS, as could any other so-called hybrid class to one extent or another. Yes, they could improve one or more aspects to focus on, but they could still use all their other skills AS NEEDED during a fight. And that's where their strength was.

Oh cool, ad hominem.

We had these arguments 10 years ago. Hybrid classes didn't work. A paladin was a paladin was a paladin . . . who specced Holy or stayed home. Your theories didn't work in practice.

But people like you, all you look at are worthless fucking DPS meters and ignore EVERYTHING else. Hell, ten bucks says you're one of those people who think the only way to win a BG is by getting the most killing blows because that puts you at the top of the scorecard. LOL! So fucking worthless.

You don't know me.

And if you can't have an argument without being civil then go kindly piss off.

[Maudib]

Blizzard said its a minor issue, do you have any verifiable proof its some massive issue?

I didn't say it was "some massive issue". And although Blizzard said it was minor... the went ahead and developed a way to minimize abuse. Why, pray tell, would they waste their time on such a "minor issue"?

[Tyze]

Buffing classes is not QoL changes...

Giving more spirit healers, talking to NPCs while in a form as Druid, instantly mail in mailboxes..


These would be QoL changes.

[MoanaLisa]

Oh cool, ad hominem.

We had these arguments 10 years ago. Hybrid classes didn't work. A paladin was a paladin was a paladin . . . who specced Holy or stayed home. Your theories didn't work in practice.



You don't know me.

And if you can't have an argument without being civil then go kindly piss off.

Mod note: There's no reason to pile on after account is infracted and banned. Move on. Thanks {ML}

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I didn't say it was "some massive issue". And although Blizzard said it was minor... the went ahead and developed a way to minimize abuse. Why, pray tell, would they waste their time on such a "minor issue"?

Because a minor issue right now which can be easily addressed is better than a less minor or major issue later on. That's why. Problems are easier to fix when they're smaller. Surely, this cannot be a new idea.

[Adam Jensen]

Mod note: There's no reason to pile on after account is infracted and banned. Move on. Thanks {ML}

Sorry, he wasn't banned or infracted when I wrote my response.

[Selah]

OP isn't wrong in his initial statement about people wanting QoL changes. That's all we ever heard about on the forums. He's just missing the point of Classic. The whole reason we have Classic is because people want to play the original WoW experience with all of it's strengths and weaknesses. It's fundamentally a different game once you begin to make changes to it. What I think OP would enjoy is the fabled "Classic+" that people are talking about. Though, that would have to be done on an entirely different server. Classic servers need to stay as they are now and not touched.