View Poll Results: 10 days left, what'll it be?

Voters
92. This poll is closed
  • Hard Brexit (crash out)

    45 48.91%
  • No Brexit (Remain by revoking A50)

    24 26.09%
  • Withdrawal Agreement (after a new session is called)

    0 0%
  • Extension + Withdrawal Agreement

    3 3.26%
  • Extension + Crashout

    9 9.78%
  • Extension + Remain

    11 11.96%
  1. #21221
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Dribbles View Post
    Now there's a thought, I wonder if Cummings paid the UK expat remainer agitators to be there. The EU keep falling into his traps if so...
    With more than twice your gdp per capita, Luxembourg's angry-mob-for-hire is probably too expensive for Cummings ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by mvaliz View Post
    EDIT: I haven't the foggiest in how that happened!?! I literally thought I was just quoting Dribbles... I didn't copy/paste anything! o_O
    Oh you've been doing Gin-pong with LeGin again. That's how.

  2. #21222
    Quote Originally Posted by Demolitia View Post
    Oh you've been doing Gin-pong with LeGin again. That's how.
    ...I have no idea what that means, but if that translates to "Drinking too much homebrewed Mead." Than yeah, you got me pegged to rights! ;P

  3. #21223
    Quote Originally Posted by mvaliz View Post
    ...I have no idea what that means, but if that translates to "Drinking too much homebrewed Mead." Than yeah, you got me pegged to rights! ;P
    Not many of us would be here sober or in their right mind
    edit: now let's derail this thread for science and show us your brewing setup :P

  4. #21224
    Quote Originally Posted by mvaliz View Post
    ...I have no idea what that means, but if that translates to "Drinking too much homebrewed Mead." Than yeah, you got me pegged to rights! ;P
    In fairness some have suggested that Dribbles and I are one and the same...

  5. #21225
    Quote Originally Posted by Pann View Post
    In fairness some have suggested that Dribbles and I are one and the same...
    You are. Dribs only goes on holidays when you take your meds again XD

  6. #21226
    Quote Originally Posted by Demolitia View Post
    You are. Dribs only goes on holidays when you take your meds again XD
    That's supposed to be our little secret!

  7. #21227
    Quote Originally Posted by Slant View Post


    Press conference starts at 1:32h.

    I'd like to point out a few things:

    Whoever is running around here fantasizing about the EU giving out extensions like candy... watch this video. And once you have realised that the PM of LUXEMBOURG has just scolded the UK and put an ultimatum on them, realise how the future of the UK is going to look like. A state that is smaller than some UK cities is in a position to dictate terms now.

    Good job, Dribs... totally taking back control, I see.
    Now if the reports are true, that's a bit of a dick move to do this after the UK requested to have the press conference elsewhere because of the protests, even if that meant they couldn't fit all the press.
    That being said, it is telling that Bettel can simply do this, be so blunt and get away with it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pann View Post
    That's supposed to be our little secret!
    Golum ... Golum ...

    - - - Updated - - -

    I can't watch itv news here, and I won't read the book. Was there anything worthwhile in Cameron's interview? Or is it just his book promo tour and a half disguised attempt to pave his return into politics in 5/10 years?

  8. #21228
    Quote Originally Posted by Demolitia View Post
    I can't watch itv news here, and I won't read the book. Was there anything worthwhile in Cameron's interview? Or is it just his book promo tour and a half disguised attempt to pave his return into politics in 5/10 years?
    I haven't watched it yet but News at 10 aired some of it and I must admit I was expecting a lot of the usual politician non-apology apologies but he did seem genuinely sorry for everything that has happened with Brexit. He's still a twat though!

  9. #21229
    Quote Originally Posted by Pann View Post
    I haven't watched it yet but News at 10 aired some of it and I must admit I was expecting a lot of the usual politician non-apology apologies but he did seem genuinely sorry for everything that has happened with Brexit. He's still a twat though!
    I saw clips of that bit. It's mildly refreshing indeed. A nice change from "delivering on the wish of the British people" and "an ambitious program". I was just wondering whether coming clean was only part of the book tour and unloading it for the sake of it. Could he make a comeback in politics or is he tainted forever?

  10. #21230
    Quote Originally Posted by Demolitia View Post
    I saw clips of that bit. It's mildly refreshing indeed. A nice change from "delivering on the wish of the British people" and "an ambitious program". I was just wondering whether coming clean was only part of the book tour and unloading it for the sake of it. Could he make a comeback in politics or is he tainted forever?
    I believe that most (all?) of the profits from his book are going to charity and he has chosen to stay out of the limelight since resigning so I doubt that is his motivation.

    I don't think that there is anyway back from him into politics but I don't think that it is something he would want in any case.

  11. #21231
    Quote Originally Posted by Demolitia View Post
    Now if the reports are true, that's a bit of a dick move to do this after the UK requested to have the press conference elsewhere because of the protests, even if that meant they couldn't fit all the press.
    That being said, it is telling that Bettel can simply do this, be so blunt and get away with it.
    Of course it's a dick move. That was the entire point. Luxembourg can get away with it and the only purpose was to demonstrate it to everyone. I've never seen this kind of disrespectfulness in any diplomatic situation ever. This is a move to assert dominance. And BoJo ran into the knife like the idiot that he is. If he had stayed for the press conference, the protesters would a) have made the conference impossible and b) demonstrated conviction. But he chose to ran. And that's what he and his ill-fitted gang of criminals will do once they've shattered the UK into utter insignificance. With a couple hundred million more on the bank, too.
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  12. #21232
    Quote Originally Posted by Pann View Post
    I believe that most (all?) of the profits from his book are going to charity and he has chosen to stay out of the limelight since resigning so I doubt that is his motivation.

    I don't think that there is anyway back from him into politics but I don't think that it is something he would want in any case.
    It's likely he is just trying to make amends then. I heard he donated the 800k (wtf!) he got for writing the book to charity, but that doesn't mean he doesn't have to promote the book.
    I don't know that he can come back from this but your politics keep surprising us everyday.

  13. #21233
    Quote Originally Posted by Demolitia View Post
    It's likely he is just trying to make amends then. I heard he donated the 800k (wtf!) he got for writing the book to charity, but that doesn't mean he doesn't have to promote the book.
    I don't know that he can come back from this but your politics keep surprising us everyday.
    I'm not saying he doesn't have to promote the book but my initial feeling (this might change) from the clips on the news is that it is not an exercise in self-promotion.

  14. #21234
    Quote Originally Posted by Slant View Post
    Of course it's a dick move. That was the entire point. Luxembourg can get away with it and the only purpose was to demonstrate it to everyone. I've never seen this kind of disrespectfulness in any diplomatic situation ever. This is a move to assert dominance. And BoJo ran into the knife like the idiot that he is. If he had stayed for the press conference, the protesters would a) have made the conference impossible and b) demonstrated conviction. But he chose to ran. And that's what he and his ill-fitted gang of criminals will do once they've shattered the UK into utter insignificance. With a couple hundred million more on the bank, too.
    Easy there. The EU and its leaders could have acted this way from day one and deliberately chose not too. While it's fun in a way to hear him vent his frustration, everybody else manage to keep their shit together. It's nice to show that patience is running thin, but Bettel just took the easy opportunity to belittle BoJo in a way Merkel and Macron never would have, although they easily could have. He could very easily have compromised to respect his guest, and instead chose to humiliate him as a PR stunt. His dick move will not change a thing. Luxembourg is not nearly that influential in this case.
    edit: And yes, Bojo could have decided to take his chance and stand next to Bettel at the conference, but if Bettel was as much of a dick during lunch as he was during the conference, I can understand Why BoJo thought better of it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Pann View Post
    I'm not saying he doesn't have to promote the book but my initial feeling (this might change) from the clips on the news is that it is not an exercise in self-promotion.
    Fair enough. I got the same feeling from watching him.
    Last edited by Demolitia; 2019-09-16 at 10:45 PM.

  15. #21235
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pann View Post
    There is absolutely nothing to support what you are saying regarding a Con/LD coalition - it's little more than a conspiracy theory. Neither Johnson's Tories nor Swinson's LDs have said much on what their policies outside of Brexit are and it is more than a little ironic that you claim to know what either parties policies might be when you did not even know what Labour's policy on a second referendum was.

    Seriously you've been pushing something which is not true for several hours and pretty much everything you've presented as evidence has been proven to be untrue and you still won't admit you were wrong.
    They’re at conference now, take a look at their website. Their policies are tax cuts for business, and tax rises for everyone else who can’t run their life through a shell company.

    They talk about trying to make the rich pay up, but offer absolutely zero clear policies on that, just vagaries about reducing tax loopholes.

    Let’s not forget that it wasn’t long ago that they were in a coalition with the Tories, and have recently taken on board a number with questionable reputations regarding their ‘liberal’ values.

  16. #21236
    Quote Originally Posted by Tranthalp View Post
    If that was the plan it didn't work. Johnson will go up 2-3% in the polls.

    The Luxembourg guy can't speak English and was largely incomprehensible. He sounded agitated and nervous. He did not "demonstrate dominance" in any way.

    Johnson by contrast sound relatively calm and reasonable.

    On the issues they were discussing I side very much with the EU but this stunt was very counter-productive.

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    Yes I'm sure he is acting out of the goodness of his little pig fucker's heart....
    You didnt understand what he was saying? You need your ears checked son.

  17. #21237
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    They’re at conference now, take a look at their website. Their policies are tax cuts for business, and tax rises for everyone else who can’t run their life through a shell company.

    They talk about trying to make the rich pay up, but offer absolutely zero clear policies on that, just vagaries about reducing tax loopholes.
    Source?

    I’m looking at their website now and see:

    https://www.libdems.org.uk/economy

    In order to balance the books and build a sustainable economy for the future we must ensure that everyone pays their fair share. Liberal Democrats have a longstanding commitment to fairer taxation, and in government we raised the personal allowance for Income Tax. It remains our ambition to make taxes fairer and simpler, to help those on low and middle incomes, and to ensure that those on the highest incomes, and large international companies, make a fair contribution. We will:

    • Aim in the long-term, and as resources allow, to raise the employee National Insurance threshold to the Income Tax threshold, while protecting low earners’ ability to accrue pension and benefit entitlements.

    • Ensure those with the highest incomes and wealth are making a fair contribution. We have identified a series of distortions, loopholes and excessive reliefs that should be removed. These include reforms to Capital Gains Tax and Dividend Tax relief, and refocusing Entrepreneurs’ Relief. We would reverse a number of the Conservatives’ unfair and unjustified tax cuts, including: The cutting of Corporation Tax from 20% to 17% - Capital Gains Tax Cuts - Capital Gains Tax Extended Relief - The Marriage Allowance - The raising of the Inheritance Tax Threshold.

    • Take tough action against corporate tax evasion and avoidance, including by: Introducing a General Anti-Avoidance Rule, setting a target for HM Revenue and Customs to reduce the tax gap and continuing to invest in staff to enable them to meet it. - Reforming Corporation Tax to develop a system that benefits the smallest companies while ensuring the biggest multinationals cannot avoid paying sums comparable to nationally-based competitors. We will consult on shifting away from a profits-based tax to one that takes account of a wider range of economic activity indicators, such as sales and turnover. - Reviewing the Business Rates system, prioritising reforms that recognise the development of the digital economy, lessen the burden on smaller businesses, and ensure high streets remain competitive. We will also consider the implementation of Land Value Taxation.

    • Conduct a full-scale review into the burden of taxation and spending between generations to ensure that government policy promotes fairness between generations.


    E.g., actually, they're proposing to reverse the Conservatives’ cuts to corporation tax.

  18. #21238
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    They’re at conference now, take a look at their website. Their policies are tax cuts for business, and tax rises for everyone else who can’t run their life through a shell company.

    They talk about trying to make the rich pay up, but offer absolutely zero clear policies on that, just vagaries about reducing tax loopholes.

    Let’s not forget that it wasn’t long ago that they were in a coalition with the Tories, and have recently taken on board a number with questionable reputations regarding their ‘liberal’ values.
    You mean this website - https://www.libdems.org.uk/?

    The website that quite clearly states "In order to balance the books and build a sustainable economy for the future we must ensure that everyone pays their fair share. Liberal Democrats have a longstanding commitment to fairer taxation, and in government we raised the personal allowance for Income Tax. It remains our ambition to make taxes fairer and simpler, to help those on low and middle incomes, and to ensure that those on the highest incomes, and large international companies, make a fair contribution"

    and then goes on to say "Aim in the long-term, and as resources allow, to raise the employee National Insurance threshold to the Income Tax threshold, while protecting low earners’ ability to accrue pension and benefit entitlements."

    and

    "Ensure those with the highest incomes and wealth are making a fair contribution. We have identified a series of distortions, loopholes and excessive reliefs that should be removed. These include reforms to Capital Gains Tax and Dividend Tax relief, and refocusing Entrepreneurs’ Relief. We would reverse a number of the Conservatives’ unfair and unjustified tax cuts, including:- The cutting of Corporation Tax from 20% to 17% - Capital Gains Tax Cuts - Capital Gains Tax Extended Relief - The Marriage Allowance - The raising of the Inheritance Tax Threshold"

    that they will "Take tough action against corporate tax evasion and avoidance..."

    and "Establish an independent review to consult on how to set a genuine Living Wage across all sectors. We will pay this Living Wage in all central government departments and their agencies, and encourage other public sector employers to do likewise."

    as well as "Stamp out abuse of Zero Hours Contracts. We will create a formal right to request a fixed contract and consult on introducing a right to make regular patterns of work contractual after a period of time."

    etc, etc.

    You could have read the website seen that what you believe was not true before wasting everyone's time with the above nonsense.

    Even if what you had written about Lib Dem policy was true, which of course it isn't, it in no way offers any evidence of any sort that the LDs would go into coalition with the Cons.

    The next GE will be dominated by Brexit and the Con and LD Brexit policies are polar opposites, to go into coalition would destroy both parties and I know that you would probably like that but it is not going to happen.

    Please stop grasping at straws.

  19. #21239
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeGin Tufnel View Post
    Source?

    I’m looking at their website now and see:

    https://www.libdems.org.uk/economy

    E.g., actually, they're proposing to reverse the Conservatives’ cuts to corporation tax.
    It would appear that I misread that part, however, they do have intent to increase income tax 'to cover NHS and Social Care costs'.

  20. #21240
    Quote Originally Posted by Demolitia View Post
    Easy there. The EU and its leaders could have acted this way from day one and deliberately chose not too. While it's fun in a way to hear him vent his frustration, everybody else manage to keep their shit together. It's nice to show that patience is running thin, but Bettel just took the easy opportunity to belittle BoJo in a way Merkel and Macron never would have, although they easily could have. He could very easily have compromised to respect his guest, and instead chose to humiliate him as a PR stunt. His dick move will not change a thing. Luxembourg is not nearly that influential in this case.
    edit: And yes, Bojo could have decided to take his chance and stand next to Bettel at the conference, but if Bettel was as much of a dick during lunch as he was during the conference, I can understand Why BoJo thought better of it.
    Of course Macron and Merkel wouldn't have done this. If Germany or France, the historical enemies that the UK still actually, literally sees as enemies, had done this, it would have blown up way bigger. Luxembourg, on the other hand, can do this and serve as a demonstration. The UK leadership needs to be taken down a lot more pegs than this before they can be reasoned with. This was a good thing.

    Edit: The most important bits in this interview is when he corrected British journalists and clearly told them that he, the Luxembourg PM, does not have a mandate to negotiate. A misconception that the British still don't get. Barnier is the contact and nobody else. The entire EU's efforts are focused in that one person.
    Last edited by Slant; 2019-09-17 at 09:54 AM.
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