We all agree that wow retail lacks class identity?

[kenn9530]

That has been agreed upon for quite some time now as every class can do everything. I personally am hoping that Classic has influenced retail's future design enough so that class identity comes back, and maybe even old school talents come back as well. I loved Bellular's idea that you could level with the old talent system and then when you hit max level you can further customize your toon with the ''new'' talent system as we have it today, with the rows of 3 and you select one.

it will be best if classic does not affect future class design, having more than half of the specs actually useless, talents are also irrelevant as just because you pick a talent point doesnt make it more interesting, and retail all classes are different there are clear class differences, where as a class in classic there are no real differences.

[Shakana]

The specs fluctuate in viability just like they would if they were made to be watered down hybrid classes, even if there were only 5 specs in this game at least one of them would be bad and not played. That being sad the specs and classes are pretty much as close to each other in viability as they've ever been all things considered and there's really nothing unplayable right now.

That's not how i remember, for example in WoTLK, i remember you combining 2 specs and or other 2 specs, when there's 3 specs, you used to combine them and make them really enjoyable, because it was almost like you had the 2 specs selected. I played rogue for the most part, and i remember that being a really good thing, as soon as they ended the hybrid i was like "i don't want to be forced to choose between assass and sub" because i loved both. And i still feel that, so i go outlaw now, cause it's the best one for me personally. And sub is almost forgotten too aswell as a rogue atm.

[Kyphael]

Artifact weapons were garbage because of AP, without it - or rather - without AP being too overpowered compared to the gear, it wouldn't suck so much for alts.

That's being said, classes felt homogenized in legion, each class got the same = artifact, class hall, class mount. So how did that made distinction between classes if all of them had pretty much the same features just with a different textures?

So what did you want? Class Halls for some, but not all? Compelling game play arguments are as arbitrary as Class Halls that serve the same purpose but look different to fit their class aesthetics. Most two people won't agree on what makes classes distinct. Some blame talent trees, others the talent system, some say pruning, less talents, talent over bloat, pruning, etc. Each Class Hall carried its own story and quest lines, were in different geographical places that lore-wise were important to their class history, and every spec had a unique weapon, some of which were iconic to lore. All of that took work and to me, and many others, made Legion enjoyable and no different than Classic when every class had to visit their class trainers in unique locations.

[Anastacy]

God damn that blue font hurts to read.

Why do people have to post so obnoxiously to try and make their posts legit?

[Goradan]

In the past you played as the class and they had their own role to play in the game. Now every spec are pigionholed into doing damage, healing or tanking, you don't have specs anymore, just roles. Enforcing the whole "Tank-Healing-DPS" triangle too harshly is one reason why the classes have lost their identity, another has just been lazy dev's have removed any meaning that stats now have in the same. WoW has lost the appeal of progression and even at max level you don't feel like a living legend that has worked hard to get that far.

[kaminaris]

Oh yeah sorry I forgot they brought back two buffs right? Thats 100% a start, I wish theyd just bring them all back though honestly. I think many people want a medium between classic and BFA, where class buffs would be a great way to get there again. Just don't give the same buff to other classes.

Do you even play BfA cause I dont think so... We have 3 buffs + 2 debuffs. You wanted class identity so you got it, not everyone has a buff now.

[gd8]

That's not how i remember, for example in WoTLK, i remember you combining 2 specs and or other 2 specs, when there's 3 specs, you used to combine them and make them really enjoyable, because it was almost like you had the 2 specs selected.

Lol no, at least not for the most part. Yeah you could realistically spec half into one spec and half into the other but you probably wouldn't be very good at anything and nobody's gonna take you into a group with some wonky ass frankenstein build if it isn't some kind of widely established, viable, and accepted alternative build.

[kaminaris]

So what did you want? Class Halls for some, but not all? Compelling game play arguments are as arbitrary as Class Halls that serve the same purpose but look different to fit their class aesthetics. Most two people won't agree on what makes classes distinct. Some blame talent trees, others the talent system, some say pruning, less talents, talent over bloat, pruning, etc. Each Class Hall carried its own story and quest lines, were in different geographical places that lore-wise were important to their class history, and every spec had a unique weapon, some of which were iconic to lore. All of that took work and to me, and many others, made Legion enjoyable and no different than Classic when every class had to visit their class trainers in unique locations.

That is what class identity is for me. Having something that other classes don't. If everyone have class halls then its not a part of class identity. If everyone got artifact then its not distinguishing any class.

I mean I loved class halls even completed all of them for every class but pointing it as class identity is just being dishonest.
It's all the same, just different texts, different textures.

[Vrinara]

I do think Retail needs to take a deeper look into their classes. I kinda hope 9.0 brings back Talent trees. Nothing complex but if they are gonna do a level squish, they should think about just revamping EVERYTHING... (Including the 1-60 zones.. cause jesus christ I am tired of the Cata story after doing every zone, and every story)

[Seranthor]

.

I see a lot of confirmation bias happening here not to mention attempting to pass your opinion off as some rock solid fact... So, no, I dont buy into your claim, not in the least.

[iamthedevil]

Your choice of font color has too much identity.

[AlmightyGerkin]

We've lost class identity since Cataclysm than it got a bit of rebirth in Mists and Legion but gone in BFA.

[Directionalk9]

I prefer strong spec identity/fantasy, otherwise what the point of specs on classes like Mage/lock/rogue/Hunter, hell even arms/fury or disc/holy.

I don’t want to get torn to shreds, it’s how I feel and what I like. I’ve got no way of knowing what’s good or bad for the health of the game’s class design.

[Felshatner]

I think that class identity / design is one of the primary issues with BFA right now. The reward systems were also pretty bad, but they've been improved and BFA still fails to be compelling for me.

[arkanon]

SNIP

Mate, most ppl on here wouldn't even agree that text is blue.

[Beet]

Do you even play BfA cause I dont think so... We have 3 buffs + 2 debuffs. You wanted class identity so you got it, not everyone has a buff now.

I did play BFA. Quit 6 months ago. I've literally been playing WoW since 2004 so I sometimes get forgetful on what expansion did what since you know, they like to purge things constantly and oh so rarely do they add things back. Debuffs were always a thing so I'd hope there was still debuffs.

And as I said it was a start. Adding back a few buffs they removed =/= class identity. I'd like to see them all back too. Once upon a time there was about what, 25 different debuffs and buffs? Many people enjoyed that. I'm guessing you weren't here for those days so you only know what you've read.

But I suspect this is a part of what people mean when they say class identity. Having a plethora of buffs and debuffs to bring. Paladins alone being capable of giving the raid 4 different blessings and 4 different auras. Thats more than all classes can bring right now put together. Anyways I'm sure youll be back to tell me I got one thing incorrect and yell at me that I must have never played BFA because of it.

[Goradan]

We've lost class identity since Cataclysm than it got a bit of rebirth in Mists and Legion but gone in BFA.

Nah, Cata was the last time there was class Identity, even if it was fading fast.

- - - Updated - - -

True because blizzard doesn't want to break classes by giving them unique abilities because it would be far harder to balance or hotfix if they are broken or OP.

[Nefarious Tea]

I tried to care but you a big fucking block paragraph and you colored it the most obnoxious shade of blue.

So no, class identity is fine, just because your argument is presented in such a way that I actively hate you now, OP.

[Whitedragon]

Quite frankly i thought more people would prefer seeing a class identity than rather waiting for balancing a spec they want to play. Many people that plays mage and warlock, feels this. If they like fire they will be stuck on all patches to come on frost so they can compete with other classes specs that are going well good, but they are bored as hell to play frost instead of fire. This is just an example of a reality that i have seen many times.

But that exists in classic, want to play Balance? lol get lost, want to play a DPS shaman? no good sir you are healing. If you say "well not in lower dungeons and world play" then we can make a point that we have that in BfA as well, because no one is going to turn you down for a mythic 5 if you aren't playing the FotM class.

Seems more that the class/spec you want to play is higher Tir in classic then it is in current, but currents roster is always changing.

[Thelxi]

I strongly disagree with certain specs doing things that other specs can't. This barely works in classic; it would be a complete shitshow if half the classes in retail wow suddenly became undesirable and unviable again. If you are of the opinion that this is a good idea you are an idiot that does not understand nor care about the welfare of this game.

Having said that, yes class identity is lacking in BfA. Legion had very strong SPEC identity, and for some reason Blizzard decided to just push the delete button on that for BfA. Big mistake imo. And just to point out further, you can clearly achieve class/spec identity without fucking with unique/niche class/spec performance.