Should Antifa be classified as a terrorist organization?

[Dextroden]

What political ideology are they pushing beyond, "We don't like fascists."? Not defending their tactics, but they're not pushing any political ideology in the slightest, because there isn't one that the individuals support wholesale.

You don't defend their tactics but regularly joked about assaulting people with milkshakes.

Okie dokie.

[Edge-]

The ideology that they push is athoriterism. Might makes right. That its their views or your blood.

Except that's not what they're pushing at all, you're just re-using what you call a "leftist buzzword" but there's no merit to it.

Outside of their use of violence, which again I'm not defending, how are their promoting authoritarianism (which is what I assume you meant)? What is their ideology? What are their social positions? What are their foreign policy positions? Monetary positions?

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You don't defend their tactics but regularly joked about assaulting people with milkshakes.

Okie dokie.

Oh the horror, someone had a milkshake dumped on them. I'm sure they'll need crisis counseling for life because they're apparently a snowflake.

[Dextroden]

Except that's not what they're pushing at all, you're just re-using what you call a "leftist buzzword" but there's no merit to it.

Outside of their use of violence, which again I'm not defending, how are their promoting authoritarianism (which is what I assume you meant)? What is their ideology? What are their social positions? What are their foreign policy positions? Monetary positions?

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Oh the horror, someone had a milkshake dumped on them. I'm sure they'll need crisis counseling for life because they're apparently a snowflake.

Yeah. And gay people can get over retards screaming faggot at them on the street. And trans people can survive being misgendered. But I'm sure you'll be moved to tears by their sob story over it.

[Monster Hunter]

Shhh. Don't remind people of that or the boat of Jews that we told to shove off when they came seeking refuge. Totally an antifascist (doesn't exist) nation.

Haha people seem to conveniently forget parts of history when they want to spin a narrative. I've seen alot of people in the UK try to paint ww1 as a fight for freedom against imperialism.... Conveniently forgetting we were the British EMPIRE......

Or parliament saying shit like we're the worlds oldest democracy..... When 90% of people couldn't vote till 1926..... Oldest Parliament... Not oldest democracy. But thats off topic

[Saucexorzski]

Except that's not what they're pushing at all, you're just re-using what you call a "leftist buzzword" but there's no merit to it.

Outside of their use of violence, which again I'm not defending, how are their promoting authoritarianism (which is what I assume you meant)? What is their ideology? What are their social positions? What are their foreign policy positions? Monetary positions?.

Yes it is. When that is their tactics. That is their message. They come masked to hide who they are. they come armed to fight those who disagree. they do harm to everything in their path.

[Edge-]

Yeah. And gay people can get over retards screaming faggot at them on the street. And trans people can survive being misgendered. But I'm sure you'll be moved to tears by their sob story over it.

Do conservative have a long history of being targeted by milkshakes systemically? Have they faced a near constant barrage of harassment historically? Did these milkshaking attacks end with, say, one of them being beaten to a pulp and left for dead (and eventually dying) tied up to a barbed wire fence?

No? Cool, that was a pointless strawman you put up there. Not looking to get into gender issues as that's out of bounds, but this was a terrible post.

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Yes it is. When that is their tactics. That is their message. They come masked to hide who they are. they come armed to fight those who disagree. they do harm to everything in their path.

Cool, so if that's your position than you can say the same about all the white supremacist groups that show up armed, and often times masked, to protests as well. If you're being consistent, at least.

That's still not an ideology though. That's just a tactic. You seem unaware of what an ideology is so here are a few definitions -

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ideology
https://www.britannica.com/topic/ideology-society
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/...glish/ideology

Antifascism can absolutely be part of a political ideology, but it is not one itself.

[Dextroden]

Do conservative have a long history of being targeted by milkshakes systemically? Have they faced a near constant barrage of harassment historically? Did these milkshaking attacks end with, say, one of them being beaten to a pulp and left for dead (and eventually dying) tied up to a barbed wire fence?

No? Cool, that was a pointless strawman you put up there. Not looking to get into gender issues as that's out of bounds, but this was a terrible post.

Oh boo hoo. People want to claim oppression points for things that didn't happen to them.

You make light of what's technically assault. I make light of what is verbal and and physical assault. Perfectly fair.

And sounds like those people should get some of that therapy you recommended if being called something mean is so harmful.

Edit: And a mod saying gender threads aren't allowed here. What a joke.

[Edge-]

Oh boo hoo. People want to claim oppression points for things that didn't happen to them.

Talk to some trans folks and most will have stories about harassment/threats that they've suffered for being trans. And even if they haven't personally faced serious threats, the history of violence against trans people, for example, for simply being trans is ever present within the community.

When was the last time conservatives were forced to use specific bathrooms because laws were passed that treated them like sexual predators simply for existing, again?

You make light of what's technically assault. I make light of what is verbal and and physical assault. Perfectly fair.

I make light of it because conservatives love to insult liberals for being snowflakes, and if we're being real here a milkshaking is about as violent as telling someone to go fuck themselves, especially vegan milkshakes. Not excusing it if it violates the law and I've consistently supported criminal punishments for any that engage in this behavior, but pretending it comes anywhere close to actual physical assault and injury is dishonest as fuck. They need a change of shirt and maybe a shower. How dreadful.

[Saucexorzski]

Cool, so if that's your position than you can say the same about all the white supremacist groups that show up armed, and often times masked, to protests as well. If you're being consistent, at least.

That's still not an ideology though. That's just a tactic. You seem unaware of what an ideology is so here are a few definitions -

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ideology
https://www.britannica.com/topic/ideology-society
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/...glish/ideology

Antifascism can absolutely be part of a political ideology, but it is not one itself.

never claimed antifa was an ideology. weird strawman, I claimed they push authoritarianism which is an ideology.

[Dextroden]

Talk to some trans folks and most will have stories about harassment/threats that they've suffered for being trans. And even if they haven't personally faced serious threats, the history of violence against trans people, for example, for simply being trans is ever present within the community.

When was the last time conservatives were forced to use specific bathrooms because laws were passed that treated them like sexual predators simply for existing, again?



I make light of it because conservatives love to insult liberals for being snowflakes, and if we're being real here a milkshaking is about as violent as telling someone to go fuck themselves, especially vegan milkshakes. Not excusing it if it violates the law and I've consistently supported criminal punishments for any that engage in this behavior, but pretending it comes anywhere close to actual physical assault and injury is dishonest as fuck. They need a change of shirt and maybe a shower. How dreadful.

And how dreadful a friend of yours got harassed. But, did anyone actually do damage? Last I checked, words are as harmless as milkshakes. So, sounds like your friend needs to stop being such a snowflake.

[Monster Hunter]

Do conservative have a long history of being targeted by milkshakes systemically? Have they faced a near constant barrage of harassment historically? Did these milkshaking attacks end with, say, one of them being beaten to a pulp and left for dead (and eventually dying) tied up to a barbed wire fence?

No? Cool, that was a pointless strawman you put up there. Not looking to get into gender issues as that's out of bounds, but this was a terrible post.

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Cool, so if that's your position than you can say the same about all the white supremacist groups that show up armed, and often times masked, to protests as well. If you're being consistent, at least.

That's still not an ideology though. That's just a tactic. You seem unaware of what an ideology is so here are a few definitions -

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ideology
https://www.britannica.com/topic/ideology-society
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/...glish/ideology

Antifascism can absolutely be part of a political ideology, but it is not one itself.

Anti facism isn't part of an ideology any more than an ideology is opposed to any other ideology.

Anti facism can be used as a tactic to gain support for an ideology or orgonosation by banding together otherwise ideologically opposed individuals to be used to fight the main opposition.

Like how the German communist party attempted to use the antifacist of Germany to sweep away the Nazis know full well that would leave them as the dominant party and ideology over the Democrats and bismarkians.

Antifa is neither an ideology nor a group per say. Its a movement, a movement that can contain groups and a movement that can be co-opted as a tool for an ideology. But still just a movement that is easily fractured if it isn't kept focused and internally policed.

[Endus]

never claimed antifa was an ideology. weird strawman, I claimed they push authoritarianism which is an ideology.

Yes, authoritarianism is an ideology.

However, not only are Antifa not pushing it, they're diametrically opposed to it, and their actions directly breach one of the four basic tenets described in the basic description of authoritarianism, here; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authoritarianism

Specifically, #3.

There's no possible way to make the argument that antifa are "authoritarian". There's plenty to criticize them on, but lying about basic terminology like this isn't an argument.

[Dextroden]

Yes, authoritarianism is an ideology.

However, not only are Antifa not pushing it, they're diametrically opposed to it, and their actions directly breach one of the four basic tenets described in the basic description of authoritarianism, here; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authoritarianism

Specifically, #3.

There's no possible way to make the argument that antifa are "authoritarian". There's plenty to criticize them on, but lying about basic terminology like this isn't an argument.

Who's this Antifa you're speaking about? As you know, there is no such group.

[Saucexorzski]

Yes, authoritarianism is an ideology.

However, not only are Antifa not pushing it, they're diametrically opposed to it, and their actions directly breach one of the four basic tenets described in the basic description of authoritarianism, here; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authoritarianism

Specifically, #3.

There's no possible way to make the argument that antifa are "authoritarian". There's plenty to criticize them on, but lying about basic terminology like this isn't an argument.

They are causing harm to silence those that disagree with them. That's all one needs to know that they are autheritain. And that any ideology they push will be tainted by the means they chose to bring it about.

[Endus]

They are causing harm to silence those that disagree with them. That's all one needs to know that they are autheritain. And that any ideology they push will be tainted by the means they chose to bring it about.

That's not what "authoritarian" means, at all. You're just deliberately misusing words.

[Saucexorzski]

That's not what "authoritarian" means, at all. You're just deliberately misusing words.

And you just refusing to acknowledge what is happening in the antifa protest movement.

[Edge-]

And you just refusing to acknowledge what is happening in the antifa protest movement.

Out of curiosity, is the use of violence the extent of your definition for what constitutions fascism?

[Dextroden]

Out of curiosity, is the use of violence the extent of your definition for what constitutions fascism?

Well, you guys are in a thread arguing that unlawful violence and intimidation to further your political goals isn't terrorism. So.....

[Endus]

And you just refusing to acknowledge what is happening in the antifa protest movement.

I've never denied that antifa are willing to engage in violent resistance. I have, in fact, stated exactly that, and that while I support their cause and motivations, I can't support their initiation of violence.

So no. I'm not "refusing to acknowledge" anything. I'm pointing out that you're using words incorrectly, in the hopes that doing so lets you reshape reality. Which it will not and can not ever do.

[Saucexorzski]

Out of curiosity, is the use of violence the extent of your definition for what constitutions fascism?

No. Fascism is far more complex than simple authoritarianism.

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I've never denied that antifa are willing to engage in violent resistance. I have, in fact, stated exactly that, and that while I support their cause and motivations, I can't support their initiation of violence.

So no. I'm not "refusing to acknowledge" anything. I'm pointing out that you're using words incorrectly, in the hopes that doing so lets you reshape reality. Which it will not and can not ever do.

disagree with your bolded word. Nothing they do is resistance. they actively go to places. and actively engage in violence. They do not resist anything, they engage those who disagree with them.