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  1. #241
    Quote Originally Posted by TigTone View Post
    I agree that he shouldn’t be high king, I also agree He’s in part to blame for teldrassil but for a different reason.

    His failure for teldrassil was thinking Sylvanas would be a leader that is for peace. All cities should have been on standby for war and defense because she was warchief.
    well in defense of anduin thinking sylvanas is a beacon of potential hope and peace she is the ONLY Horde leader to work beside the leader of the Alliance and save his life more than twice.
    "You know you that bitch when you cause all this conversation."

  2. #242
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    who said it need? since mop orcs had zero relevancy in the story, and only now we get a leader that again become MIA

    but if you are telling me the elf cringe fest of Legion is better oh boy thats just you, cause i would rather shot my foot than do the questline with Malfuion and Tyrande again, despite being a horde player.



    everything prior bfa who had faction conflicts was good or at lest acceptable, its not one shit expansion that we should end years of factions

    also, even Legion had faction conflict, and it was nonsense as everything from wod till today, can still hear the world pvp quests about towers, jesus
    ? Warlords didn't have Orcs be relevant? I don't get that. And BfA has an Orc left, right, center and in every gorram cinematic under the sun. I don't give much of a shit about the 10 minutes where Tyrande was crying for her beloved, these two have always been boring as sin. It's still way better than the endless parade of honorbros vs murderbros nonsense we got now.

  3. #243
    Quote Originally Posted by TheramoreIsTheBomb View Post
    well in defense of anduin thinking sylvanas is a beacon of potential hope and peace she is the ONLY Horde leader to work beside the leader of the Alliance and save his life more than twice.
    Still burned Teldrassil.

    I feel like I'm the only one who still remembers this.

  4. #244
    what if arthas comes back tomorrow
    "You know you that bitch when you cause all this conversation."

  5. #245
    Scarab Lord Polybius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TigTone View Post
    I agree that he shouldn’t be high king, I also agree He’s in part to blame for teldrassil but for a different reason.

    His failure for teldrassil was thinking Sylvanas would be a leader that is for peace. All cities should have been on standby for war and defense because she was warchief.
    No one in their right mind thought the Warchief would start a war after being exhausted fighting the Legion. Not even Nathanos.

  6. #246
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    Illidan saying that would be the aforementioned lampshading. Because - and stay with me here because this is only Blizzard's official stance on the matter as per their summary of the story on WoW's website - he still became Sargeras' jailer. And please, Saurfang's sadness is his motivation in this expansion. Take his sadness out and he'd have no presence. And, pray tell, what "spiteful narrative" am I carrying Saurfang to with his sadness here? Him becoming a Night Warrior? How would that be spiteful towards him?
    I'm aware he became Sargeras' jailer - I'm saying being Sargeras' jailer is *not* the destiny Xe'ra wanted for him, as both implied by her speech to him and shown in the "Illidan" novel's ending. That not how lampshading works, and lampshading isn't really applicable in this context. It's more an averted trope. The "spiteful narrative" is your blatant dislike of Saurfang and the need to continually paint him as a sadsack, driven solely by despair, which as I said isn't really representative of his story at the current. Him becoming the Night Warrior is just a farce I'm semi-entertaining out of amusement.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    Errr, no. Retcon is the change in and on itself. Unless you think that changes to continuity that don't get explanations aren't retcons. Which would be wrong, because it's the change that, you know, changes the continuity. Metzen admitting he fucked up about the Eredar wasn't the retcon, him fucking up in the first place was.
    A retcon is the change that occurs as well as the explanation and circumstances of new continuity rising from it, with the alteration also effecting past events. Unexplained changes are bad forms of retcons, whereas explained ones could be either. Metzen did indeed admit to forgetting about the Eredar's original plight, but I maintain that the new continuity is actually better than the older version of the continuity, where the Eredar were just another variety of demon with little to no backstory. The Eredar/Draenei retcon created a good deal more narrative fission and launched a compelling set of story-arcs all on its own, it's an improvement to what came before it even if it was caused by an accident and error.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    You keep repeating it, but that won't magically change that retcon is by default a result of sloppy writing. Even if (arguably especially if) we went by your take on what retcon is. Because if retcons were explicitly explanations for changes that would make them excuses for said sloppy writing. Which is by no measure imaginable a good reason.
    YMMV as to what "sloppy writing" is. I call a change that improves the story and opens up greater narrative and dramatic arcs an improvement on its face, but if you want to get hung up on the original error I can't really stop you. Angling for error-free perfection is an often onerous if not impossible chore, and if one sets their standards so high as to demand there be no errors in 20+ years of a given narrative then one is likely to be often disappointed.
    "We're more of the love, blood, and rhetoric school. Well, we can do you blood and love without the rhetoric, and we can do you blood and rhetoric without the love, and we can do you all three concurrent or consecutive. But we can't give you love and rhetoric without the blood. Blood is compulsory. They're all blood, you see." ― Tom Stoppard, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead

  7. #247
    I predict it will be absolute utter trash and make all Alliance players officially regret playing this piece of shit garbage game. Aka: Cata/Mop 2.
    Khadgar: Prepare to heroically CTRL-E through the portal with me!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hooky View Post
    yeah wow cool..how about raising the valor cap consider WoD isn't that far away? 1000 valor points gets u a lollipop and kick in the nutsack these days! Back in my day we could get a bucket of candy and a pet ferret with that sort of points!
    Quote Originally Posted by Herecius View Post
    QUICKLY FRIENDS, TO THE HYPERBOLEMOBILE!

  8. #248
    The Insane Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    ? Warlords didn't have Orcs be relevant? I don't get that.
    not horde orcs, they are on the garbage since blizz fuck up their lore since MOP, wod help to paint then even worse, dismissing their narrative of redemption
    And BfA has an Orc left, right, center and in every gorram cinematic under the sun.
    you mean just saurfang and thrall, an old fart cause they kill every other orc character and thrall cause there is none else left with relevant story, they even try to put Rexxar but he is irrelevant.

    It's still way better than the endless parade of honorbros vs murderbros nonsense we got now.
    lmao, if you aid so, i would rather get wtlk/cata lv of faction war instead being bombarded with cringefest and no representation at all.

  9. #249
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doomchicken View Post
    I predict it will be absolute utter trash and make all Alliance players officially regret playing this piece of shit garbage game. Aka: Cata/Mop 2.

    Don't say that, me resubbing depends on what happens tomorrow.
    Honorary member of the Baine Fanclub, the only member really.

  10. #250
    Quote Originally Posted by Sharby View Post
    Don't say that, me resubbing depends on what happens tomorrow.
    Sorry fam, but with how absolute garbage the Alliance has been written this expansion, I have zero hope that Blizzard actually remember that they exist outside of serving as the hordes foil/murder victims.
    Khadgar: Prepare to heroically CTRL-E through the portal with me!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hooky View Post
    yeah wow cool..how about raising the valor cap consider WoD isn't that far away? 1000 valor points gets u a lollipop and kick in the nutsack these days! Back in my day we could get a bucket of candy and a pet ferret with that sort of points!
    Quote Originally Posted by Herecius View Post
    QUICKLY FRIENDS, TO THE HYPERBOLEMOBILE!

  11. #251
    The Insane Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doomchicken View Post
    Sorry fam, but with how absolute garbage the Alliance has been written this expansion, I have zero hope that Blizzard actually remember that they exist outside of serving as the hordes foil/murder victims.
    if you think the horde writing is any better or everyone is satisfied you are fooling yourself

  12. #252
    I will most likely become the warchief

  13. #253
    the alliance has to completely and unilaterally forgive the horde once sylvanas is out. there isn't time for anything else to happen and the way the blizzard writers work is paying absolutely no attention to any inconvenient details to the narrow story thread they want to tell.

    bfa has been a story about the horde and focused on the horde and the entire alliance storyline has been a reluctant afterthought so far and i'm sorry to tell you thats not gonna change tomorrow. blizzard is writing their way to the horde struggling with their identity and then being taken back by noble heroes like thrall, and once that happens as far as they are concerned that story arc is over so the alliance will have to fall in line and accept the horde are good so we can all move on to fighting old gods yet again

    you can say "but what about the night elves they wont forgive the horde" but look back at bfa and you will realize blizzard dont care about little things like that. tbh every aspect of the night elf story from the war of thorns to darkshore has been such an afterthought and incompatible with the main storyline (e.g. genn decides to help the night elves instead of going to darza'alor then leads darza'alor anyway) that i would be amazed if it was even written by the same people as the rest of bfa. they pretty obviously coralled a d-team of writers together and told them to make a night elf vs undead scenario in darkshore using warcraft 3 as inspiration. which is why the forsaken are raising bodies like they're the scourge. and yes this directly conflicts with the way derek proudmoore is treated but they are struggling to write even the main war campaign consistently there was never any hope they could add the darkshore story on top of that.

    whatever happens in the patch is gonna be unrepentant and laughable shit but the fact is the main storyline exists in a universe where darkshore never happened so don't expect any of it to come up in any way.
    they hated sillag because he told them the truth

  14. #254
    Scarab Lord Polybius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    if you think the horde writing is any better or everyone is satisfied you are fooling yourself
    Eh, the writers tried but you can tell which one had the most effort. They didn't even bother completing Twilight Highlands.

  15. #255
    Quote Originally Posted by Sharby View Post
    Don't say that, me resubbing depends on what happens tomorrow.
    whelp.... i hate to break it to you but...
    "You know you that bitch when you cause all this conversation."

  16. #256
    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyah View Post
    I will most likely become the warchief
    This is it. This is the leak.

  17. #257
    Quote Originally Posted by Bennett View Post
    How sad is it the second a character has the slightest degree of depth some people elect to act like petulant children about it. Have fun with your one dimensional characters I guess
    Such deep.. "Honor.. honor honor honor.. HONOR .. hOnOr.. HoNoR.. Hodor.. I mean.. honor.. honor honor.. honor".. Yeh so deep.

    "Why'd you use rogues to kill sentinels without face to face combat?" - "Honor"
    "Why didn't you finish off malfurion when him alone caused thousands of horde deaths?" - "Honor"
    "Why did you try to attack Darkshore with the night elf army not even being there?" - "honor"
    "Why did you leave your race without a leader and try to commit suicide during a world war?" - "Honor"

    He isn't even a character. He is just a plot device with the excuse to say "honor".

    Edit: Man.. Ever said a word so many times you second guess yourself on how to pronounce it?
    Last edited by GreenJesus; 2019-09-24 at 01:58 AM.

  18. #258
    Thrall, Saurfang, Baine, Jaina, Genn & Anduin arrive in Durotar to confront Sylvanas. With Thrall there, they know there would be a riot if Sylvanas threatened him. Again, the Book states Sylvanas preferred not being Warchief so she is willing to go back to how it was before she became in charge, but she also knows the Alliance leaders would want some kind of retribution.

    But suddenly Tyrande appears & attacks Sylvanas. Thrall tries to put an end to it & places himself between them, but at this point everyone is in fight or flight mode. Tyrande mortally wounds Thrall, so of course Baine & Saurfang would attack Tyrande with intent to kill. Jaina manages to freeze Baine, but Sylvanas kills Genn from behind then banshee forms into Tyrande's body, suffocating her. Jaina tries to teleport her & Anduin out but Nathanos shoots her dead.

    "Now that I have you at my mercy, I want you to beg," Sylvanas tells Anduin.

    "I will not beg for my life, Banshee"

    "Not that....I want you to beg me to bring them back"

  19. #259
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    if you think the horde writing is any better or everyone is satisfied you are fooling yourself
    Never addressed the hordes writing since it's already been discussed to death about how shit it is. I'd rather beat a slightly less dead horse than a horse that's been beaten so hard it's literally pulp.
    Khadgar: Prepare to heroically CTRL-E through the portal with me!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hooky View Post
    yeah wow cool..how about raising the valor cap consider WoD isn't that far away? 1000 valor points gets u a lollipop and kick in the nutsack these days! Back in my day we could get a bucket of candy and a pet ferret with that sort of points!
    Quote Originally Posted by Herecius View Post
    QUICKLY FRIENDS, TO THE HYPERBOLEMOBILE!

  20. #260
    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    If unifaction means we get more character and (perhaps) race based based stories, than I'll take it at this point.
    I doubt it. We'll probably get more things like Dalaran. It's technically a multi-racial neutral city, but in reality it's all humans all the time.

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