Greedfall

[The Butt Witch]

I quit the game in the tutorial, when I was casually let know that the game is not playable comfortably without a controller, and since I'm a hardcore PC player who doesn't use one, I promptly refunded it.

Thank Holy Gaben for the refund policy.

[Edge-]

Oh, so now we should "cancel" an entire century because it was "ugly"?

Jesus fucking christ, these people.

Except they're not calling to "cancel" or "boycott" it, they're simply presenting a valid criticism that's expanded upon throughout the piece as the author points out repeatedly that Spiders largely doesn't take a position on any of this nor do they allow players to. Which, in a roleplaying game, is definitely a missed opportunity.

Don't get me wrong, Heather Alexandra writes a ton of stuff I disagree with and I don't entirely agree with this piece either. but these are some fair criticisms IMO.

[Edge-]

"Missed opportunity" is one thing.

Calling the game "kind of fucked up" because it dares to be set in that era and isn't a story about the player being a champion of social justice and rising up and defeating the big mean evil people is just nonsense. And to pen a review of a game based on that is even worse.

I think it's less that that's not the "core", of the game but that it's not even an option for players. That it doesn't really properly contextualize much and is extremely limiting in terms of the diversity of player choice.

Few things -

1. Still not calling to "cancel" it as you claimed.

2. It's not a review, and Kotaku doesn't even do formal scored reviews. It's an impressions piece.

3. Impressions pieces critical of games are common, and aren't indictments of the game. It's one writers views on the game, and you don't have to agree with them. But you also don't have to resort to hyperbole when disagreeing with them.

4. If you don't just take that one paragraph out of context, she goes into detail on why she says it's "kind of fucked up", and has some valid points to make here. Here are a few snippets -

That isn’t to say that no art could use a setting like this, but it needs to be used with an awareness of what this setting actually means. Greedfall doesn’t demonstrate that level of care at the moment. It’s set dressing. The magical New World is mostly a playground for the player, not a means to examine complex issues. Greedfall wears a costume, perhaps not ignorant to what the costume means, but seemingly unwilling to do anything too powerful with it.

In the time I’ve played Greedfall, it’s clear that while I can alienate factions (sometimes gaining favor with my companions for doings so) there’s a great deal of advantage to placating all parties and maintaining the status quo on Teer Fradee. Don’t rock the boat. Make sure to bow before the racist cardinal even if you want to stab them in the neck. Dedicate yourself to a milquetoast middle path that keeps a peace but transforms nothing. Greedfall often pays lip service to the hypocrisies of its various factions—by what right does that inquisitor have to call anyone a barbarian, as he gleefully kills any native that fails to convert to his religion?—but in my first 10 hours of playing, I’ve yet to see these moments of awareness coalesce into anything actionable.

(emphasis mine)

That Greedfall has thus far limited reactions to the world around me and funneled me towards the diplomatic path doesn’t feel like a thoughtful merger of systems and themes like what was found in in 2016's Tyranny.

And here's her clearly stating that she understands that others may not have the same issues she has with the game -

That Greedfall is a decent RPG will be enough, for some. For me, it isn’t. Not right now.

https://kotaku.com/greedfalls-detail...s-u-1837994750

[Lazuli]

Yeah, and again, it's just her complaining that the game is set in a particular time but doesn't address the issues of that time in the way that she thinks is right. God forbid they just be presenting the era as it was, or be telling the story they want to tell, or anything else. No, that's not acceptable. To this writer, if a game is set in X era, it must rail against anything bad in that era as if the characters are looking at it from our perspective.

Said criticisms are barely about the game at all. They're not even really about the plot of the game. It's merely whining that the game *isn't* a social justice simulator. That's it.

Agree'd her blog post is just qq I can't stab racist qq evil white men die pls qq me social justice roar

This is why you don't read kotaku, and avoid social media this is the only place these fake victim apologists exist, funny how I never seen a SJW in the real world.

[Edge-]

Yeah, and again, it's just her complaining that the game is set in a particular time but doesn't address the issues of that time in the way that she thinks is right.

If you read it, it's that the game barely addresses those issues at all while not allowing players to really have any control over doing so themselves.

But yes, that's kinda like, the whole point of impressions pieces. Writers give their thoughts on a game.

God forbid they just be presenting the era as it was, or be telling the story they want to tell, or anything else. No, that's not acceptable.

In a RPG that focuses on deep player involvement? Actually...yeah, it kinda does. Dragon Age is a frequent comparison for Greedfall, and while it takes a purely fictional fantasy setting throughout the series it addresses and has a lot to say about all kinds of real world issues, giving players a ton of agency to influence how those issues play out in the game.

In comparison, Greedfall plays lip service to all of this and does give players a lot of agency...just not in how they engage with and address these themes/issues.

Said criticisms are barely about the game at all. They're not even really about the plot of the game. It's merely whining that the game *isn't* a social justice simulator. That's it.

If you read the article...yeah...they are. She references multiple specific points in the game where this lack of ability to actually do anything meaningful in the setting, despite some lip-service being payed to the social issues, was especially frustrating for her.

It's not about being a "social justice simulator" at all. Good lord, anti-SJW's are just as bloody annoying as they SJW's they complain about and just as prone to being offended by bloody nothing.

[Krastyn]

Yeah, and again, it's just her complaining that the game is set in a particular time but doesn't address the issues of that time in the way that she thinks is right. God forbid they just be presenting the era as it was, or be telling the story they want to tell, or anything else. No, that's not acceptable. To this writer, if a game is set in X era, it must rail against anything bad in that era as if the characters are looking at it from our perspective.

Said criticisms are barely about the game at all. They're not even really about the plot of the game. It's merely whining that the game *isn't* a social justice simulator. That's it.

I think you're still missing the point because you're so tunneled on SJW's. The point isn't that she can't address the issues of that time in the way she thinks is right, her issue seems to be you can't address the issues of that time at all. That it's simply back story that your quest giver is a racist slave owner, but not part of the actual story. The option should be there to overthrow the owner, and the option should be there to help the owner further enslave.

But if the game, as the author implies, just funnels you to help everyone equally and play the middle ground, then all the characters back stories are effectively meaningless.

[Awsumpossum]

I don't have a leg to stand on in this disagreement, as I don't even know who this writer is, but I was curious about this specific piece:

"In the time I’ve played Greedfall, it’s clear that while I can alienate factions (sometimes gaining favor with my companions for doings so) there’s a great deal of advantage to placating all parties and maintaining the status quo on Teer Fradee. Don’t rock the boat. Make sure to bow before the racist cardinal even if you want to stab them in the neck. Dedicate yourself to a milquetoast middle path that keeps a peace but transforms nothing. Greedfall often pays lip service to the hypocrisies of its various factions—by what right does that inquisitor have to call anyone a barbarian, as he gleefully kills any native that fails to convert to his religion?—but in my first 10 hours of playing, I’ve yet to see these moments of awareness coalesce into anything actionable."

Is that not the entire point? The writer says you can rock the boat, but at a cost and that gameplay forces you not to? But isn't that the MOST realistic portrayal of what it meant to live during this time period? Choices have consequence and you aren't rewarded for doing the morally "right" thing in today's sociopolitical climate? I know absolutely nothing about the game, nothing about the author, but this seemed kind of like a dumb critique? Am I missing something?

[Edge-]

I don't have a leg to stand on in this disagreement, as I don't even know who this writer is, but I was curious about this specific piece:

"In the time I’ve played Greedfall, it’s clear that while I can alienate factions (sometimes gaining favor with my companions for doings so) there’s a great deal of advantage to placating all parties and maintaining the status quo on Teer Fradee. Don’t rock the boat. Make sure to bow before the racist cardinal even if you want to stab them in the neck. Dedicate yourself to a milquetoast middle path that keeps a peace but transforms nothing. Greedfall often pays lip service to the hypocrisies of its various factions—by what right does that inquisitor have to call anyone a barbarian, as he gleefully kills any native that fails to convert to his religion?—but in my first 10 hours of playing, I’ve yet to see these moments of awareness coalesce into anything actionable."

Is that not the entire point? The writer says you can rock the boat, but at a cost and that gameplay forces you not to? But isn't that the MOST realistic portrayal of what it meant to live during this time period? Choices have consequence and you aren't rewarded for doing the morally "right" thing in today's sociopolitical climate? I know absolutely nothing about the game, nothing about the author, but this seemed kind of like a dumb critique? Am I missing something?

I think they touch on that here -

The visual language at play in this game harkens back to some vile shit. That isn’t to say that no art could use a setting like this, but it needs to be used with an awareness of what this setting actually means. Greedfall doesn’t demonstrate that level of care at the moment. It’s set dressing. The magical New World is mostly a playground for the player, not a means to examine complex issues. Greedfall wears a costume, perhaps not ignorant to what the costume means, but seemingly unwilling to do anything too powerful with it.

Emphasis mine.

In that largely these choices aren't meaningful and pay lip service only, without actually saying anything about them. Not in the sense that the game dogmatically says, "THIS IS THE ONLY OPTION", but in the sense that these options are very much lacking in their weight/impact given the topics at-play.

[Video Games]

Im gutted people are even talking about kotaku. I only linked it to mock it and let people know they should buy it anyway.

[Sixnalia]

I haven't been experiencing the gripes that reviewer had.

Played more hours on both of my playthroughs than they have.

I've been doing a heavily neutral one and one where I've sided with the natives, but push for the trading faction a little bit.


My choices definitely feel weighty. The game is showing me that every side has its good and bad.

And I'm also seeing the consequences of being overly neutral.


-----

For the gameplay.
I'm enjoying magic, but it feels far stronger than melee and guns/potions. To the point the fun of being uber kinda runs low at times.

Gun/Potion build is more pleasing for me, as I have to remain aware of limited resources that don't keep regenerating.

[Crissi]

11 hours in and Im still having fun. Making a more supporter role with the heal maxed out and the shield spell.

Definitely prob going to antagonize the Theleme faction. just...have no love for what they're doing but Petras is awesome. Hoping I can keep him around while also being more pro Bridge and Native.

[Deathknightish]

Finished the game 2 days ago, and it feels so empty now. Easily one of the best proper RPGs I've played despite it's technical flaws. I give the game a weak 8 or a very strong 7, but that is ONLY because of it's eurojankiness. The roleplaying and everything else is absolute world class. Bioware, watch and learn, but more importantly remember where you started off. Spiders is the new old Bioware.

Now imagine what Spiders can do with an even bigger budget, something this game surely will allow as Greedfall is their first game that got this amount of attention.

[Maxilian]

As other have pointed out, the game have some technical problems and, in general, it have some problems that make it feel like an old game, for example: -Questionable faces in dialogues, not many costumization option when creating your character and the talent three is lacking, and some questionable voice acting but IMHO the world, the combat and the factions are interesting enough that make you want to keep going, for example:

-I really though that Petras was going to be my most disliked character, and right now, is one of the character i love the most

-All factions have their good and their bad things, heck... i though that i would have Teleme as one of my most hated factions, and that's far from the case, i like that just like they have assholes in their factions, they also have really nice people and that you can see that the faction per se, is not "the religious extremist faction" just a religious faction with extremist in it. (I have them and the natives as the 2 factions with better reputation right now)

-I have one problem, is that sometimes your decisions don't feel like the actually change anything, for example SPOILER ALERT: With teleme faction, you can discover that the founder of the religion also came to the island and ended up following the religion of the native, basically, combining both the tenants of the light and nature, and you can have that info be accepted by head of teleme and actually publish that info to the people, but still after that we run into people that are against the nature tenants of the natives and you don't even have the chance to say anything about the changes that their mother cardinal have made, nor do other characters say anything about it.
Note: I actually like the talent three for crafting, as in the long run, you can get most of the perks of them without even having to have all 3 points (1 is enough, as you can get +1 with an armor and +1 with one of your teammates if you have a good relationship with them) -i'm half way through the game, so it may change

Note2: Gameplay recommendation, don't get armor crafting more than 1 point (you can easily get Kurt friendly in the game quite early and you also get a guantlets that give you +1 in craftmanship, in general, keep any item that give a +1 in anything, so you can just equip them as its required)

- - - Updated - - -

To unlock "Fury" the only ability in the Warrior tree... I spend my 5 points on improving 1h sharp weapon damage... Then I have to spend 6 on 2h sharp. A weapon type I'll probably never use, in order to spend 3 more to unlock "Fury" The only ability in the Warrior tree.

That ability sucks, so don't waste your time, but i do agree that you are forced to pick talents that you really don't care about, i mean as a 2-handed user, i'm also forced on picking 1 handed talents that i will use for the first 5 lvls in the game and no more.

Then, if I want to unlock the heal spell, I need to spend 6 more points on Shadow magic, in order to gain access to heals. It all just seems a bit... pointless.

Unless you go with Blunt weapons (as you can jump from the Blunt weapon side directly to the Heal -but not the shield sadly-)

[Gallahadd]

That ability sucks, so don't waste your time, but i do agree that you are forced to pick talents that you really don't care about, i mean as a 2-handed user, i'm also forced on picking 1 handed talents that i will use for the first 5 lvls in the game and no more.

Yeah, I actually respecced a while ago. Went for Blunt weapons, healing and heavy armour. Works WAY better than my lame attempt to use 1h sharp. Although, this spec has it's own share of problems, like the animations being both long AND interuptable. And the heal/armour restore spells not scaling. AT ALL. Like. Not with level, stats, talents. Nothing.

I've found a couple of necklaces that boost healing, but they're useless for me, because they require a different stat.

[Maxilian]

Yeah, I actually respecced a while ago. Went for Blunt weapons, healing and heavy armour. Works WAY better than my lame attempt to use 1h sharp. Although, this spec has it's own share of problems, like the animations being both long AND interuptable. And the heal/armour restore spells not scaling. AT ALL. Like. Not with level, stats, talents. Nothing.

I've found a couple of necklaces that boost healing, but they're useless for me, because they require a different stat.

Yeah, that's the build i run with, the healing spell not scaling is not that big of an issue for me (as the MP cost does not increase either, so after a while, you can just spam it when needed) -I look at it as my potions-, the Armour one... well... IDK, i have it, but i rarely remember to use it -that buff should really last longer-

[Gallahadd]

the Armour one... well... IDK, i have it, but i rarely remember to use it -that buff should really last longer-

Yeah, you can spam it... and get interupted a bunch, because the animation is so long XD. I mean, it's not a HUGE amount to ask, a little scaling on the spells. Even if it just scaled with level, that would probably be enough.

If you get the bottom right stat, the Mana/Accesories one, it also increases buff times by 1 sec per level.

[Gaidax]

Nice game, I am impressed as to how down to earth this is with low fantasy, diplomacy and discovery theme. It is a bit too easy even on the most difficult setting, but combat is nothing to write home about (like my current build is literally spam one button and everything dies on extreme and there are only couple abilities to use only for the most difficult packs) and it's mostly about story and adventure.

The story itself is not about some intergalactic or world-ending threats, but instead is somewhat close to real world. Of course there is mysticism and magic, but they are super tame.

I recommend people who want to try it out to wait for some 40% discount or so and snatch it, it's a nice RPG.

[Velshin]

Nice game, I am impressed as to how down to earth this is with low fantasy, diplomacy and discovery theme. It is a bit too easy even on the most difficult setting, but combat is nothing to write home about (like my current build is literally spam one button and everything dies on extreme and there are only couple abilities to use only for the most difficult packs) and it's mostly about story and adventure.

The story itself is not about some intergalactic or world-ending threats, but instead is somewhat close to real world. Of course there is mysticism and magic, but they are super tame.

I recommend people who want to try it out to wait for some 40% discount or so and snatch it, it's a nice RPG.

Does it have the same feeling as Witcher 3 in term of magic, politics, and lore?

[Gaidax]

Does it have the same feeling as Witcher 3 in term of magic, politics, and lore?

It's hard to compare, because setting is very different through and through.

Witcher is the better game, especially because after all it's a trilogy and there is considerably more player investment into protagonist in Witcher because his personal story is a strong driver there and on top of that an underdog kind that is something people relate to.

This one is sort of Witcher-light, you have all the factions, politics, internal struggles big and small, but it just isn't that type of the game. They also did not really establish much emotional connection to the protagonist, they tried, but it was almost "by the way" thing in the beginning. The fact that you are a ranking official with special privileges makes everything different already.

It's a colonization of unknown land story spiked with some growing mystical and mysterious threat that does not have any actual face. You will try to uncover mystery surrounding it, while tiptoeing around factions, natives and so on, but it's no Witcher.

It's not a story where you run around chasing after your lost love fighting monsters, while your friends are dead and you are shunned by the whole world.

[Volatilis]

I dunno, combat certainly looks as jank as the witcher's is.