Needing for Repair

[TheRevenantHero]

That was my initial point, yes.

I was further saying that even if he cannot be reported under TOS, which may occur if the party didn't ask him to stop. In my, (albeit anecdotal experience), it appears as though the specifics of what occurred in the chat logs prior to the ninjaing event tend to be deciding weights behind whether action is taken.

i.e. If he says "I'm going to need everything to pay my repair bill", and no one tells him not to, then it could be understood as an implied acceptance of him needing everything and therefore not ninja looting.

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Which, of course, it absolutely is ninja looting. Blizzard just may not enforce it as such. Which brings me back to the "condemnation of the community" aspect. My server has several "blacklisted" players for ninja looting and otherwise toxic attitudes. They aren't banned by blizzard, but they're still facing repercussions for their actions. Which was my overall point.

If nobody tells him to stop then it's not entirely ninja-looting since nobody cares. But if people say something and they disregard it then, you're right. It becomes ninja-looting.

According to someone else in this thread, server blacklisting doesn't exist. I'm glad you actually enforce it.

[owbu]

If a person is rolling need on everything, even when they can't equip it, it falls under ninja looting and therefore griefing.

That's just not true. Unless Blizzard has changed their policy for classic without telling anyone, they do not take action against players rolling whatever they want on whatever item they can roll on. The only situation that you can get them for griefing/ninjaing is when a PM breaks the loot rules he stated at the start of the run.

Blizzard's definition of "ninja" is very different from the community's definition.

[TheRevenantHero]

This is not true - if you can need on it, it is not ninja looting - and its that simple. Ninja looting, when it comes to Blizzards line, is when loot rules are clearly defined before the even is started, and then the master looter goes against those outlined rules.

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Rubbish - your realm has a few ppl you dont like because they got loot you wanted. No one cares - they are still completing content without any issues.

You can literally need on everything in Classic. Doesn't matter if you can equip or not. I've absolutely reported people for needing on something they couldn't equip so they could vendor it for money when I would have won the roll. Blizzard mailed me the item with the typical vague Blizzard response about taking action and telling me what they did was against the ToS. This was back in Wrath, though. I haven't reported anyone since then because I typically only run dungeons and such with friends.

But sure. Continue to claim things didn't happen purely because YOU haven't experienced it.

[arkanon]

You can literally need on everything in Classic. Doesn't matter if you can equip or not. I've absolutely reported people for needing on something they couldn't equip so they could vendor it for money when I would have won the roll. Blizzard mailed me the item with the typical vague Blizzard response about taking action and telling me what they did was against the ToS. This was back in Wrath, though. I haven't reported anyone since then because I typically only run dungeons and such with friends.

But sure. Continue to claim things didn't happen purely because YOU haven't experienced it.

This NEVER happened. You are just one lie after the other - Blizzard do NOT remove items someone legitimately won via the need/greed system. Why are you so full of absolute lies?

[TheRevenantHero]

This NEVER happened. You are just one lie after the other - Blizzard do NOT remove items someone legitimately won via the need/greed system. Why are you so full of absolute lies?

LMFAO YES THEY ABSOLUTELY DO. I went to a ZG run in Cata before it was removed on my worgen DK. The ML didn't put forth any rules forward. Just everyone rolled 1-100 as standard. Jin'rokh The Great Apocalypse dropped off the final boss and I won the roll. The ML took it and hearthed out. I reported him and got the item mailed to me with the Blizzard copy paste message about how that kind of behavior is bad and gave me the item I won blah blah. If I really have to, I'll get on and screenshot my Jin'rokh but I'm sure you'll blabber about some nonsense about me lying there too.

In short, fuck off and stop trying to troll me. Thanks.

[arkanon]

Update from earlier:

I found an article from 2010 which states their policy on ninja looting. Definitely dated, but it seems to be their most recent statement on the subject matter, so there's little reason to believe their policies have changed since then:

https://eu.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/900641023

Are you not wondering why they ONLY talk about master loot when discussing "scam" loot (ninja looting)?

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LMFAO YES THEY ABSOLUTELY DO. I went to a ZG run in Cata before it was removed on my worgen DK. The ML didn't put forth any rules forward. Just everyone rolled 1-100 as standard. Jin'rokh The Great Apocalypse dropped off the final boss and I won the roll. The ML took it and hearthed out. I reported him and got the item mailed to me with the Blizzard copy paste message about how that kind of behavior is bad and gave me the item I won blah blah. If I really have to, I'll get on and screenshot my Jin'rokh but I'm sure you'll blabber about some nonsense about me lying there too.

In short, fuck off and stop trying to troll me. Thanks.

Read the post linked directly above yours. It completely contradicts what you are saying, as it only references MASTER LOOT. You know why? Because they do NOT take any action at all in need/greed situations.

"Every time you join a raid group you are agreeing to the rules that are set up by the Raid Leader, both regarding the raid groups goals and loot distribution, and it is your responsibility to ask & confirm what they are."

What does your ML situation have to do with standard Need / Greed loot distributions?

[TheRevenantHero]

Are you not wondering why they ONLY talk about master loot when discussing "scam" loot (ninja looting)?

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Read the post linked directly above yours. It completely contradicts what you are saying, as it only references MASTER LOOT. You know why? Because they do NOT take any action at all in need/greed situations.

"Every time you join a raid group you are agreeing to the rules that are set up by the Raid Leader, both regarding the raid groups goals and loot distribution, and it is your responsibility to ask & confirm what they are."

What does your ML situation have to do with standard Need / Greed loot distributions?

Ok, buddy boy. I think I'm just gonna put you on ignore because you're an inflammatory troll who has been attacking me all. Congratulations on being the first person I've ever put on ignore!

[TheRevenantHero]

Jin'rokh was a drop from level 70 ZA prior to it being reworked into a 5 man in Cata, along with ZG.

It's been nearly 10 years. I knew it was either ZA or ZG, I just couldn't remember which. All I know is that it was mailed to me and I still use it for transmog to this day because it's a sweet looking sword.

[arkanon]

It's been nearly 10 years. I knew it was either ZA or ZG, I just couldn't remember which. All I know is that it was mailed to me and I still use it for transmog to this day because it's a sweet looking sword.

But that was NOT a 5man dungeon using group loot - which is what is being discussed here. And i still dont believe you because, as the linked blue post from blizzard states, it is YOUR responsibility to confirm loot rules when joining a pug. Blizzard would NEVER take an item won by a LEGITIMATE need roll on an item in any content running group loot. You claimed they would, and then suddenly started talking about Cata, and this one master looter than "ninjad" an item because YOU didnt confirm loot rules. So even forgetting all of your blatent dishonesty, i still dont beleive for a second they gave you that item, as, but your own admission, you never confirmed the loot rules when joining the group.

"Every time you join a raid group you are agreeing to the rules that are set up by the Raid Leader, both regarding the raid groups goals and loot distribution, and it is your responsibility to ask & confirm what they are."

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Not particularly considering it's more-or-less consistent with everything I've been saying regarding ninja looting.

i.e. "Ninjaing" as a violation of ToS in a Need Before Greed loot system would be very unlikely to result in action from Blizzard and the primary punishment which results from that conduct is the condemnation of the server community.

When you say a "need before greed loot system" what you are actually talking about is MASTER LOOT, which is not GROUP LOOT. And who decides what is needed and what is not? was MS>OS discussed? as you can see from the attached blue post, these things are extremely important.

[arkanon]

you have no choice you cant kick a tank
there is a big shortage of tanks in the game

Blizzard should patch paladins and give them a taunt and consider it a bug/flaw fix

Aoe taunt to make up for the "error"

[munkeyinorbit]

you have no choice you cant kick a tank
there is a big shortage of tanks in the game

Blizzard should patch paladins and give them a taunt and consider it a bug/flaw fix

You absolutely have a choice. If you decide that the tank can walk all over you, treat you like shit, and take what they want then that is your choice. I have personally ruined and got groups and raids disbanded purely on what I perceive as ninja looting at least a dozen times. I even caused so much drama that guilds have died over ninja. It came at great personal cost at times but I will not let people cheat me without some repercussions. But you do you.

PS. I am not opposed to pallies getting a taunt but I am OK with them staying as healers.

[TheRevenantHero]

You absolutely have a choice. If you decide that the tank can walk all over you, treat you like shit, and take what they want then that is your choice. I have personally ruined and got groups and raids disbanded purely on what I perceive as ninja looting at least a dozen times. I even caused so much drama that guilds have died over ninja. It came at great personal cost at times but I will not let people cheat me without some repercussions. But you do you.

PS. I am not opposed to pallies getting a taunt but I am OK with them staying as healers.

To mirror what you've said about me, I don't believe you. I don't believe that a single person has the power to destroy an entire guild.

[MrKnubbles]

Nah, he was just being greedy. Repairs aren't that expensive, in my experience.

[Aphrel]

"Du är en ninja lars olof"

put the ninja tank on ignore and move on

[arkanon]

To mirror what you've said about me, I don't believe you. I don't believe that a single person has the power to destroy an entire guild.

You don't think a GM can dismantle a guild?

[kamuimac]

"Du är en ninja lars olof"

put the ninja tank on ignore and move on

and next time look for tank 4 hours instead 2

must be fun living in delusionville where people actually blacklist tanks and healers.

[Charge me Doctor]

yeah except, tanks are obsolete untill lvl 50. And no raid will bring a ninja tank. And since they only need 2-4, demand is lower than supply.

When there is only 1 level 58-60 warrior in /who for your raid you'll bring "a ninja tank". Don't kid yourself. Or you'll leave and the guy who became a leader after you will get him instead.

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That is true. I put everyone that spam LFG and have a reserved item in the run on Ignore, my list is almost full, had to remove toxic people so i could find room for the reservers instead :/

Also in general groups are way more toxic now than they where back then. It is a bit sad to see tbh.

Man, you do realize that most on the time level 60 players go into dungeons for a specific piece and call reserves on that? It's opposite of toxicity, you know what you get when you agree on these terms. instead of going into pointless drama over pixels during run.

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If someone makes a misstake the insults start flying. It is amazing how badly tempered some people are.

Might be that Mograine on EU is just a bad apple among servers.

That was a thing since vanilla. Probably even since the dawn of ages, you know, people being assholes is not something new. For example, yesterday a warlock was booted out of PUG MC run for "delaying raid for 20 minutes" because it took him too long to get to the entrance and summon raid leader and his guildies

[klaps_05]

you have no choice you cant kick a tank
there is a big shortage of tanks in the game

Blizzard should patch paladins and give them a taunt and consider it a bug/flaw fix

even better, patch paladin's protection spec out so they play an actual tank

[Annelie]

Man, you do realize that most on the time level 60 players go into dungeons for a specific piece and call reserves on that? It's opposite of toxicity, you know what you get when you agree on these terms. instead of going into pointless drama over pixels during run.

Yes i know that, and? We did dungeons in vanilla also and there where almost no reserved runs. Reserving items just tell me that you are an idiot and thus you end up on my ignore list. Every single level 60 person that join a dungeon is there for a reason. Not just you.

[Mendzia]

Personally i would leave the group mid run, put him on ignore and find a new party.