[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[Monster Hunter]

On balance, Corbyn’s shit is less bad than the overt racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia, xenophobia, islamophobia, and indeed anti-semitism present in the current government.

But you wouldn’t think that from the coverage.

Two wrongs don't make a right. Good thing we have more than two party's isn't it.

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Most of the book is about Imperialism and the role of capitalist oligarchy, in fact Corbyn was quite specific about what aspect of the book he was calling "brilliant":



You can read his entire foreword here:

http://www.spokesmanbooks.com/Spokes.../130Corbyn.pdf

Yes the author was anti-Semitic, but that was unfortunately common at the time.

If you give a pass to fiction, then what about Henry Ford, Hugo Boss or Coco Chanel? Is anyone who quotes Ford, wears a Hugo Boss suit or Chanel earrings an anti-Semite?

I'm sorry, it's fair to criticise him for the foreword and ask him to condemn the anti-Semitic parts of the book, but you're massively oversimplifying.

Sorry but you can't equate people wearing or using products made by company's that supported the Nazis and have since disavowed and apologised at length for it, with a supporting a book that still directly supports the same anti-semitism that spawned the nazi party in the first place.

That book still contains and espouses the hateful ideology and should not or ever be promoted or supported by a main stream politician, adding a foreword isn't a magic guard agaist the hateful cancer within that book.

The left has gone through great pain over the last 100 years to cut out the anti semetic elements that were common befor and for a long time after ww2 and corbyn making dogwhistles the anti semetic communist elements is no better than Boris's dogwhistles the islamaphobic far right wing.

[Shalcker]

Sorry but you can't equate people wearing or using products made by company's that supported the Nazis and have since disavowed and apologised at length for it, with a supporting a book that still directly supports the same anti-semitism that spawned the nazi party in the first place.

Are you sure it is "directly supporting" it? As far as i understand it simply follows common memes of the time - among other depictions of imperialism that have nothing to do with jews.

[tehealadin]

I can't help but laugh a little and shake my head. Corbyn's cabal trying to control the Labour party are like "We don't have a problem with Jews", a Jewish MP calls out antisemitism and the weak, dismissive response to it by the leadership, now gets targeted for deselection by said cabal. Of course you don't, course you don't. At best it is an astonishingly poor and naive view of the optics of the situation, at worse a confirmation of the claims Margaret Hodge has made about the party. I lean towards the latter.

[Jessicka]

Two wrongs don't make a right. Good thing we have more than two party's isn't it.

And the Lib Dems certainly aren't unsullied by bigotry, including anti-semetism. Trying to be better is all you can strive for. The fact that BXP and Tories, you sign up to those, you're signing up for the bigotry; it's expected, part of the package, it won't damage them in the way it might other parties (indeed it often does the opposite). So the right wing parties will use that against those for whom better is expected.

[Monster Hunter]

Are you sure it is "directly supporting" it? As far as i understand it simply follows common memes of the time - among other depictions of imperialism that have nothing to do with jews.

It's part of what was known as "the socialism of fools" or "Der Antisemitismus ist der Sozialismus der dummen Kerle"

Anti sematism Was fundementaly part of the right wing it was more common but wasn't common amongst most socialist left wing thinkers untill certain elements of socialist thinkers brought into the left wing anti sematism and the idea of the zionist conspiracy from the right. Those people such as stalin were called the socialists of fools, both sides pointed to Karl marxes publication "on the Jewish question" as evidence for and against anti-semitism.

It's still an extreamly deep element of some communist groups. And something that needs to be guarded against as it threatens to derail everything the left wing stands for. Publications such as the one corbyn promoted are from a sect of socialism that should very much be left in the past and not promoted in today's day and age, there is no shortage of socialist thinkers and commentators to promote who are not tainted by the socialism of fools to pick from, that to me its in excusable that this was the one he chose to write a foreword for. And to me marks corbyn himself and mcdonell out as fools socialists who need purging from Labour as soon as possible.

[Pann]

Interesting article on hedge funds backing a no deal Brexit.

TLDR for those that can't be bothered to read it;

'In short, there is no evidence that the hedge funds that have backed Johnson’s election campaign have “millions of pounds” of speculative bets on no-deal Brexit. They have millions of pounds of speculative bets on U.K. companies, yes, but that is simply business as usual. So this is yet another a tin-foil-hat conspiracy theory. But no doubt it will continue to run.'

https://www.forbes.com/sites/frances.../#7af212984455

[Monster Hunter]

some crap

oh look its that business owner again. shouldn't you be running your multi million dollar empire not making soc accounts because people are pointing out you're party has some problems ?

[Monster Hunter]

I don't have a multi million dollar empire, I just have more income than a random code monkey.

I'd venture it is "you're" Liberal Democrat party that has problems, since it is the one with people in it who believe Jews steal people's organs.

yea but i have never denied they have problems, difference is whataboutism isn't a defense, non of them are the leader of the party and the lib dems aren't the main opposition...yet.

now i know this is kind of pointless as your only going to get banned and have your posts deleted again, but i highly doubt you're income come's from anywhere except universal credit, i recommend you sit your ban out because your not helping your own case by looking this immature, as i said before i doubt you could run a bath let alone a company.

bet you wont even name the company, because it doesn't exist.

[Monster Hunter]

Splendid. Well done. See how easy that was.

easy what was, the topic is labour, there the main opposition and the ones failing the nation in that capacity. like i said whataboutism isnt a defence for labour utterly reprehensible behavior. luckily they wont be the main opposition for much longer.

also they were all punished with suspensions. you forget that most of the labour scandal hasn't been there anti-semites in the party, its been labor trying to defend them and there leader mr corbyn trying to re-define antisemitism

if they had just suspended and punished them like the lib dems did they wouldn't be under investigation by the human rights commission. https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/...n-labour-party

no one can vote for a party thats being investigated by the equality and human rights commission and still claim to hold any moral back bone.

[Monster Hunter]

To observe the fallacy in this statement we should consider what would happen if a general election were called and the LD's were to become the official opposition, following your insane logic:

1) The LD party would become more antisemitic.
2) The Labour party would now be less antisemitic.

...simply on the basis that Labour had less relative power.

Obviously that's bullshit.

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The LD leadership vaciliated for years about Ward and Tonge. Tonge was in serious danger of dying of old age before they did anything, Nick Clegg in particular persistently refused to take action. Ward lost his seat at a general election, he was never fired, and Tonge resigned after a decade of inaction when she was finally suspended, presumably so she could go and inspect gentile corpses for missing body parts.

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You seem unfamiliar with the law in this country. If you accused of something, that does not mean you are guilty of it until something is actually proven.

the labour party is the only other party in history to be investigated for racism, the other being the BNP. let that sink in.

those in the lib dems were delt with ward for example was suspended and now is a tiny little local councilor not an MP. and im sure if you complained they would sack him. but if you complain to labour they will try to tell you that your definition of antisemitism is wrong, thats the difference.

there is also a scale issue, this is the odd person in the lib dems in labour it was / is systemic, and instead of taking action they chose to defend the anti-semites and instead argue the definition, that is why they are under investigation.

but hears the thing your trying to deflect but ultimately your not doing anything except highlighting why people should there for vote green, because labours behavior during the anti-sematism scandal has been abhorrent, no matter what some Lib-dems have also said.

you are a morally bankrupt person, supporting a morally bankrupt party that would leave the working class in the country physically bankrupt, which is why you resort to childish behavior and shouting because you have no other value to the future of progressive politics in this country.

[Monster Hunter]

Yeah when it comes to funds and positions in the market, just the position is proof of nothing. You will find no successful case against a case of insider trading without actual proof of insider trading in the form of communications. It is the very nature of hedge funds management that demands one takes opposing positions to achieve diversification. Chances are those same funds have other positions that will be hurt from Brexit; considering that Brexit has largely been a coin toss for most major funds the prudent position is to diversify so you can have a strong position both if it happens with a no deal and if it happens with a deal or doesn't happen at all.

I think there looking at the wrong sector any way. Investors that stand to make money out of a no deal Brexit are those primeraly invested in cureancy speculation and commodities such as gold and silver, the safe havens during economic turmoil. Gold been up and down like a yoyo past few days between the trump China trade war and fears of an imminant recession in Germany, And brexit being unclear.

[Monster Hunter]

some more crap

and you support antisemitic 5th columnists in the labour party because like the party your morally bankrupt and have no argument as to why any one should support the closet Nazis other than whataboutism's.

i spell check when i give a crap about the person im talking to, your a banned soc account that will have there posts delete soon as the mods come online so why bother engaging a troll whos opinions i don't care about and will be deleted soon?

this clearly rubs you the wrong way. which is funny as all hell, but so far all you seemed to be doing is showing why the labour party is losing support.

the anti sematism in the labour party is well documented, the investigation isn't even about the antisematism but if the labour party is inherently antisemetic. like i said only two party's have ever been investigated and the other was the BNP. labour are the new BNP as far as im concerned and any one who supports them really isn't entitled to dictate whats right and wrong.

end of the day labour has a much higher per-portion of antisemites than it should have and thats why its being investigated. if you dont like that take it up with the commission, you guys might as well seen as you have already tried telling the jews to redefine antisematism. there are no lows the labour party would sink to that would surprise me.

[draykorinee]

I have problems with Labour but all this overhyped antisemetic stuff is just garbage smearing 90% of the time.

[Flarelaine]

With the exception of the The Times, which on occasion I do find space in my schedule to accommodate, literally, every single other right-leaning British newspaper isn't fit to wipe my arse.

The Times is worth checking out every day for the cartoon alone.

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Revocation can be notified by one of several people if I'm not mistaken, including the Speaker of the House.

Wouldn't that be a scene. Robe, garish tie and all.

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Today's Express has 'Boris would win an election in jail!' emblazoned across their front page. I fear they may be correct.

I never knew there were elections in jails.

[Pann]

Surprise, surprise the opposition parties decide not hold a confidence motion.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49877512

[Huehuecoyotl]

Surprise, surprise the opposition parties decide not hold a confidence motion.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49877512

Probably because that's exactly what Boris wants.

If he gets kicked out of power, and the opposition are the ones that have to ask for an extension, that works perfectly for his plan to go into the election on the basis of "Tories v the enemies of Brexit" platform.

On the other hand, if he has to pen the letter that the law demands he writes, and the extension happens as a result of his actions, his entire basis for the election is undermined. Plus he looks like a pussy, which doesn't play well to the base he is trying to keep.

I'm pretty sure the only reason they are pushing the whole "we have a way around the Benn act" so hard is because they really don't. They know they will have to ask for an extension unless they get that no confidence vote first. Bluffing is pretty much the only thing they've been doing for the last 3 years. It's as natural as breathing now.

Wait until he writes, and the EU agree an extension. Then vote, get him out of power and get the election going. Let him stand on his record of utter, comprehensive and unprecedented failure. If people still vote for him, that's their problem.

[Kallisto]

Surprise, surprise the opposition parties decide not hold a confidence motion.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49877512

Well they really can't risk it yet until Boris signs the paper asking for an extension. Then when that's done they can do it without risking him breaking the law.

[Jessicka]

Well they really can't risk it yet until Boris signs the paper asking for an extension. Then when that's done they can do it without risking him breaking the law.

It's sad that we have such an untrustworthy PM. On the other hand, one wonders what more skeletons will fall from his closet in the meantime. Ousting him is starting to look like the kinder option than just watching him stew in his own metaphorical filth.

[Pann]

Well they really can't risk it yet until Boris signs the paper asking for an extension. Then when that's done they can do it without risking him breaking the law.

Of course not! But that didn't seem to be an issue when the SNP were playing Billy Big Bollocks a few days ago. I wonder what the next week's excuse will be?

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You know what the awful thing is? BJ could come and out and admit it and it wouldn't make the slightest bit of difference to the voting intentions of those who support him. They simply do not care.

By the same token BJ could come and out and deny it and it wouldn't make the slightest bit of difference to the voting intentions of those who oppose him. They simply do not care.

[Valerean]

Bottom line is that the prorogation debacle doesn't seem to have made a dent in BJ's polling.

Either they get rid of him via VONC and risk an election (not desirable for Labour with the polls being what they are), or hold fire and gamble on No. 10 not having come up with some ingenious wheeze to circumvent Benn's legislation (which they say they have).

The SNP were happy to throw their weight around a few days back, but the reality is that (for the moment) there is still no consensus in Parliament for an alternative administration.