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  1. #81
    Herald of the Titans Vorkreist's Avatar
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    Classic+ has no place anywhere ever. Most people either want a persistent classic or tbc->wrath.
    Blizzard already stated they won't entertain that silly idea. Actually devoting resources for new content development for something only some tiny confused classic player group won't ever happen.
    Theres less chance of that happening than getting high elves, tauren rogues or good storytelling in a blizz game.

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by det View Post
    ...and even that is debatable as @Will points out in https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...4#post51658434. For somebody who was in Classic, yeah..World pvp stopped when BGs came out and rewards with them, yet when placed in the open world, like flags in hellfire or Haala (SP) - there was always World pvp in those spots...even with flying.

    Maybe as so many things, even this issue is not black or white?
    just because BGs existed doesnt mean people werent out in the world farming/gathering for profs etc, that you could fight. because they were actually on the ground

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Anastacy View Post
    Cool. I don't want any changes to "Classic", so...no Classic+.
    thanks for proving my point :P

  3. #83
    People always want something new. If they ever make classic+, people just want classic++.

    I think the main thing to take from this is that people want the MMORPG aspect taken from classic, and put into new content. And with new content I mean zones, quests and all that.

    Keep the system as classic is and build new playable content on it.

    And I gotta admit that I understand that people want it. In many ways classic is a great MMORPG, especially if you like the "old" style of MMORPG - even though wow never was a old and hardcore mmo to begin with.

  4. #84
    Merely a Setback Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xofa View Post
    Amazing how you simply ignored every points I had on why flying was bad. Please re-read my post again.
    I didn't ignore them; none of them are important.
    “Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  5. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by shaunika123 View Post
    thanks for proving my point :P
    You didn’t state anything that isn’t obvious. People want different things.

    Unless you really meant that “Classic should stay classic”, then that’s a point to be made.
    "Auto-correct is my worst enema."

  6. #86
    This to me is just the different mentality people have today when it comes to anything. You're constantly thinking about tomorrow instead of today. I definitely hear it a lot with classic, first it was all about the launch but quickly it became "its all about the next patch" - which in itself will become "its all about the next patch again" and so on and so on. On retail if an expansion has a "meh" start these days people want to get it over with and they talk about the next expansion - not even thinking about the patches which usually make or break the expansion. But it's not just with games because you get it with other things too like any time there's a new Marvel or Star Wars movie, when people leave the theater they are already talking about the next one.

    I agree though, just enjoy the moment. For all the talk beforehand about how amazing it would be to revisit classic, why not just enjoy that? Even if there's no classic+ or TBC to follow, you're still getting another 2 years of a game you were excited about for years and wanted to play.

  7. #87
    It’s almost like they wanted vanilla but didn’t...

  8. #88
    I want Classic- !!! Only Autoattacks !!! (not)
    666


  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by Granyala View Post
    Then you are a crappy PvPer and I would have escaped on a ground mount as well.

    The moment you allow your enemy to mount up, you've lost him.

    As for the "no danger lurks" argument: well mobs aren't dangerous. They only waste my time and when I get flying in late stage of the game, it is okay for willy the trashmob no longer being able to waste it. Getting epic flight took a long time back then, comparable to the Pathfinder achievements now.

    As for PvP: I don't give a f***. I transitioned to playing on PvE servers at the end of Wrath because of people like you that constantly attack in scenarios when victory is a safe bet b/c the other party was compromised and never lifted a finger otherwise. In 4 years of playing on RP-PvP I can count the # of honorable encounters on one hand.

    Good riddance I say.

    BTW: PvP in classic is exactly the same. Everyone that attacked me so far was either in a group of 3+ or was 5-7 levels above me.. Wooo so honorable, so hardcore....

    PS: In terms of getting ganked, flight didn't change one thing. You want to know why? Because in order to DO anything out in the world I have to dismount and fight mobs. And that is the point when PvPers strike.

    Flight has about at much a consequence for PvPing as the APGs (Auto Pilot Gryphon) people use now. Both remove you from the world for long distance travel.
    Could it be.. let's try think here.. just for a single moment.. Could it be, that if the player was allowed to mount up, he would have to navigate around the terrain, avoid mobs and paths where there would be a higher chance to run into hostile players? ALL those 3 things you take out when you fly. And those 3 things are VERY present in classic. But hey.. what the hell, it's all bullshit I am saying and not true, right? It doesn't affect how we players intervene with the world.

    /facepalm seriously.

    And thanks for the biggest laugh today! "As for the "no danger lurks" argument: well mobs aren't dangerous" Are you for real? Like, are you trying to be serious here or just funny? I really can't tell. I hope its the latter, I honestly do lol :P
    Last edited by Xofa; 2019-10-01 at 11:40 AM.
    Thanos should have won..

    #NotMyEnding
    #ThanosWasRight

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by MrA View Post
    What is so wrong with just sitting back and enjoying the game we have now. There have been dozens of threads all talking about Classic+ this, TBC that. Isn't vanilla enough?

    I can understand 1 thread where everyone talks about the after Classic dilemma but the game has only been out for a month and that's all I see anymore. Anything beyond what we have in Classic will happen at some point, and we will be given the opportunity to give feedback at a later date. There is so much to do right now as is that there shouldn't be any focus on the beyond Classic topic. Its getting hard scrolling though all the Classic+ threads to get something worth reading and replying.
    It is the opinion of quite a bit of players that the game play systems pre 4.0.1 are just better and "more fun". Honestly I am going to have to agree with them, there was a paradigm shift after 4.0.1 dropped. Everything started to be gated, and/or was homogenized. I can barely stand retail in its current state, and honestly am hoping for a big announcement come blizzcon that will revert some of these systems back to where it used to be.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Xofa View Post
    Could it be.. let's try think here.. just for a single moment.. Could it be, that if the player was allowed to mount up, he would have to navigate around the terrain, avoid mobs and paths where there would be a higher chance to run into hostile players? ALL those 3 things you take out when you fly. And those 3 things are VERY present in classic. But hey.. what the hell, it's all bullshit I am saying and not true, right? It doesn't affect how we players intervene with the world.

    /facepalm seriously.

    And thanks for the biggest laugh today! "As for the "no danger lurks" argument: well mobs aren't dangerous" Are you for real? Like, are you trying to be serious here or just funny? I really can't tell. I hope its the latter, I honestly do lol :P
    oh lets be honest here. Even in vanilla world pvp started to die when battle grounds and arena were introduced. Flying was not the big detriment to pvp, the push for BGs, Arenas, and E-sports were.

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by MrA View Post
    What is so wrong with just sitting back and enjoying the game we have now. There have been dozens of threads all talking about Classic+ this, TBC that. Isn't vanilla enough?

    I can understand 1 thread where everyone talks about the after Classic dilemma but the game has only been out for a month and that's all I see anymore. Anything beyond what we have in Classic will happen at some point, and we will be given the opportunity to give feedback at a later date. There is so much to do right now as is that there shouldn't be any focus on the beyond Classic topic. Its getting hard scrolling though all the Classic+ threads to get something worth reading and replying.
    Yeah i agree if they want retail its waiting for you!

  12. #92
    I am not for Classic+ but I won't stand in people's way for it. I mean.. that makes you a lot like the kids that stood in the way of getting Classic. Don't be that kind of person.

  13. #93
    Over 9000! zealo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GhostShaman View Post
    It is the opinion of quite a bit of players that the game play systems pre 4.0.1 are just better and "more fun". Honestly I am going to have to agree with them, there was a paradigm shift after 4.0.1 dropped. Everything started to be gated, and/or was homogenized. I can barely stand retail in its current state, and honestly am hoping for a big announcement come blizzcon that will revert some of these systems back to where it used to be.

    - - - Updated - - -



    oh lets be honest here. Even in vanilla world pvp started to die when battle grounds and arena were introduced. Flying was not the big detriment to pvp, the push for BGs, Arenas, and E-sports were.
    Arenas as a form of more competitive pvp weren't introduced until TBC, which is also were flying came into the picture.

  14. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by justandulas View Post
    I think the idea of osrs in regards to classic+ hold up; I agree completely that the scale of the two games is hardly comparable.

    Osrs highest numbers would be wows lowest

    But the overall “make new content in the old style for that version of the game” is the theme of the comparison I was making.

    It definitely would be easier for osrs as they can get by on a handful of devs and artists; but wows scale requires more. Then again, wow also has more money to play with.

    I’m hoping wow classic gets new classic+ content one day but if not, I’m quite happy with classic as is
    More players are currently playing OSRS than played actively (by the hour) on the private server that started this all - I'm not sure why OSRS can't be used as a good source/precedent/goal.

  15. #95
    The Unstoppable Force Granyala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xofa View Post
    if the player was allowed to mount up, he would have to navigate around the terrain, avoid mobs and paths where there would be a higher chance to run into hostile players?

    And thanks for the biggest laugh today! "As for the "no danger lurks" argument: well mobs aren't dangerous"
    Well typically if you gank a quester, the quester already carved a path through the mobs. So adding crap is not much of an issue.
    As for the terrain: completely irrelevant in this instance, because both, the pursuer and the pursued have to navigate the same terrain.

    So in the sense of "it is easier to escape via flight", the only fact that would matter would be encountering other players. Practical experience tells me that is so rare that it doesn't matter for this comparison. Even on PvP servers, most people out there weren't particularly interested in wPvP in the first place. It's really only a small %age that actively wastes their time ganking others. Back in TBC and Wrath I'd say 80% of the Horde passed on any PvP opportunity when they encountered me in the field.

    Yes I actually am serious. Mobs out there are only dangerous when leveling, keep in mind we are talking about a late point in the expansion (when people would have epic flight in TBC or, by comparison, Pathfinder in Legion/BfA). At that point, world mobs pose no threat at all due the the player outgearing the content to a rather hilarious degree.

    Bottom line: people PvP where the rewards are. Right now there are none in classic, which is why you see a lot more wPvP. That will die down once people are done leveling and once BGs hit, because at that time wPvPing will be only a waste of time, left to a handful of sadistic gankers that just enjoy giving people a bad time.

  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by GhostShaman View Post

    oh lets be honest here. Even in vanilla world pvp started to die when battle grounds and arena were introduced. Flying was not the big detriment to pvp, the push for BGs, Arenas, and E-sports were.
    Uhh, WPVP was still massive on my server - especially outside of the BG queue spots... STV, SS/TM, Crossroads... one side would do a city raid weekly.
    Last edited by Self Inflicted Wounds; 2019-10-01 at 12:10 PM.

  17. #97
    The Insane Thage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xofa View Post
    One of the sole reasons why people love vanilla is because it doesn't have flying. IF you were around when flying got introduced you would also be aware that it's the same thing people are telling over and over again: FLYING RUINED so much of the game and not just World PvP.
    LMFAO Yeah! It's not the slower, more methodical gameplay, the world design encouraging exploration, the class design encouraging cooperation and ad hoc parties to maximize your chance of success against tough quests, the sweeping, immersive dungeons and raids, or the days-long brawls in Alterac Valley. No, 'one of the only reasons' it was such a great game was because you couldn't fly. Excuse me while I roll my eyes so hard they tumble out my skull and hit the floor.

    Also, as someone who actually was around in BC: Nobody gave a fuck. World PvP objectives in Outland and EPL were still hotspots that saw plenty of action, as were raid entrances. Flight in BC and WotLK were net positives because the devs weren't lazy about world design back then. People didn't screech about flying in autistic meltdowns until Cataclysm, when it started to impact the game experience because Blizzard got lazy about world design. Then, in an example of 'useful idiot' propaganda that the Kremlin would be envious of, they manipulated the people REEEEEing over flight into fighting their battles for them so they could continue getting away with lazy world design.

    For someone who calls people who disagree with you "retarded AF," you might want to make sure you're not engaged in rampant historical revisionism as you screech and get red-faced over something that only became a problem with the developers got lazy and made it a problem.
    Be seeing you guys on Bloodsail Buccaneers NA!



  18. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by Thage View Post
    LMFAO Yeah! It's not the slower, more methodical gameplay, the world design encouraging exploration, the class design encouraging cooperation and ad hoc parties to maximize your chance of success against tough quests, the sweeping, immersive dungeons and raids, or the days-long brawls in Alterac Valley. No, 'one of the only reasons' it was such a great game was because you couldn't fly. Excuse me while I roll my eyes so hard they tumble out my skull and hit the floor.

    Also, as someone who actually was around in BC: Nobody gave a fuck. World PvP objectives in Outland and EPL were still hotspots that saw plenty of action, as were raid entrances. Flight in BC and WotLK were net positives because the devs weren't lazy about world design back then. People didn't screech about flying in autistic meltdowns until Cataclysm, when it started to impact the game experience because Blizzard got lazy about world design. Then, in an example of 'useful idiot' propaganda that the Kremlin would be envious of, they manipulated the people REEEEEing over flight into fighting their battles for them so they could continue getting away with lazy world design.

    For someone who calls people who disagree with you "retarded AF," you might want to make sure you're not engaged in rampant historical revisionism as you screech and get red-faced over something that only became a problem with the developers got lazy and made it a problem.
    I agree with all those reasons listed; but I played in Vanilla until current, and now in Classic. Flying definitely hurt wpvp. That doesn't mean it didn't have other good/bad things about it, but it was definitely not good for the wpvp experience.

  19. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by Thage View Post
    LMFAO Yeah! It's not the slower, more methodical gameplay, the world design encouraging exploration, the class design encouraging cooperation and ad hoc parties to maximize your chance of success against tough quests, the sweeping, immersive dungeons and raids, or the days-long brawls in Alterac Valley. No, 'one of the only reasons' it was such a great game was because you couldn't fly. Excuse me while I roll my eyes so hard they tumble out my skull and hit the floor.

    Also, as someone who actually was around in BC: Nobody gave a fuck. World PvP objectives in Outland and EPL were still hotspots that saw plenty of action, as were raid entrances. Flight in BC and WotLK were net positives because the devs weren't lazy about world design back then. People didn't screech about flying in autistic meltdowns until Cataclysm, when it started to impact the game experience because Blizzard got lazy about world design. Then, in an example of 'useful idiot' propaganda that the Kremlin would be envious of, they manipulated the people REEEEEing over flight into fighting their battles for them so they could continue getting away with lazy world design.

    For someone who calls people who disagree with you "retarded AF," you might want to make sure you're not engaged in rampant historical revisionism as you screech and get red-faced over something that only became a problem with the developers got lazy and made it a problem.
    world design became lazy coz people were only flying and missing all the stuff on ground, so why bother implementing anything if nobody see it?

    you shouldn't confuse yourself and anyone

  20. #100
    The Insane Thage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trbn View Post
    world design became lazy coz people were only flying and missing all the stuff on ground, so why bother implementing anything if nobody see it?

    you shouldn't confuse yourself and anyone
    That's funny, I don't remember being able to fly in BC and WotLK (barring the run-speed loaner mount necessary for Storm Peaks questing) until level cap, which had a not-insignificant gold cost associated for flying training, epic flying, and cold weather flying (otherwise, enjoy your 60% flight speed until later patches buffed normal flight to 180%). By level cap, you've seen all the sights there are to see. Naxxramas looming menacingly in the skies above eastern Dragonblight isn't as intimidating the fiftieth time you ride below it, any more than the gates of Stormwind remain impressive the fiftieth time you ride through the Valley of Heroes. So you're demonstrably wrong here up until, again, the devs started getting lazy in Cataclysm.

    This had nothing to do with Blizzard's decisions to both get lazy with world design in the 80-85 Cataclysm zones while simultaneously allowing players to fly from level 80 in Cataclysm zones (something that could have been addressed with dismounting turrets/NPC guards like zones you weren't 'supposed' to fly in in BC), that was the developers taking the easy way out which they've reliably continued to do ever since. Excuse me while I remain unconvinced that we should reward their laziness.
    Be seeing you guys on Bloodsail Buccaneers NA!



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