Saudi Oil Attacks

[Felya]

Stop constantly calling him that in an attempt to make it look like he was American, just because he was allowed to live there for a while doesnt make him any less of a Saudi citizen.

Why does the truth offend you so much? He was a US resident, before being murdered by SA. Something that resulted in punishment by congress, where they voted to stop selling weapons to SA, but Trump vetoed it and is hiding his negotiation transcripts on a top secret espionage server, instead of following protocol. Now we have troops protecting the oil of a Saudi King. I’d rather those troops were protecting US interest...

[Themius]

Why does the truth offend you so much? He was a US resident, before being murdered by SA. Something that resulted in punishment by congress, where they voted to stop selling weapons to SA, but Trump vetoed it and is hiding his negotiation transcripts on a top secret espionage server, instead of following protocol. Now we have troops protecting the oil of a Saudi King. I’d rather those troops were protecting US interest...

Don't forget Saudi officials closely related to 9/11.

[ati87]

You have not shown me a fact it is. Just a link to another person's opinion and your own hatred of Fox News. Do you accept Iran's position they had nothing to do with the attacks and not the US intelligence? Are you a supporter of the present Iranian regime?

There are several European countries now which think Iran was responsible for the attacks. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/...201421030.html You think they all are wrong?

No I showed you an article that proved that your source is full of crap and an given what they do are an actual danger.
And then you have Fox news...

Also I assume you are referring to this piece of the article. Nowhere in the article does it say that Iran did it.

"It is clear for us that Iran bears responsibility for this attack. There is no other plausible explanation," the three leaders said in the joint statement released by France.

And let me ask you this question. DO you want war? Do you want millions of people to die? Do you want a new ISIS? Are you a supporter of state sponsort terrorisme which the SA government is. Because that;s the people you are ''teaming'' up with who want to attack Iran.

My 13 year old self knew that the Iraqi war was at best stupid decision pushed by war mongers and the same group of people now are pushing for war with Iran.

[Gaidax]

Oh that's right, we still don't know what the details are. What we do know, is the current seats held by various parties will make it very difficult for a 61-vote majority without, well, the Arab voters. Which means, anything that includes "by the way, fuck the Palestinians" is going to meet with resistance.

Personally, I don't think the plan exists. It might have, but with Netanyahu's current situation, I think they had to drop back 10 and punt. I think further evidence is that they withheld it until after the election -- because they knew how it would hurt Netanyahu's chances if they released a "by the way, fuck the Palestinians" plan before the election. Didn't seem to matter, or maybe everyone else saw the same thing in Trump's silence.

Therefore, I will continue to say "there is no Middle East peace plan" until there's actual evidence otherwise. Y'all can point it out the second it's released, but, I'm not holding my breath.

It's fuck both sides plan, that's why it's not released yet, so not to hit Netanyahu in the balls before the elections. The plan will include unacceptable provisions to both sides and is doomed to fail anyway.

As for elections, there will likely be a 3rd run, because right now there is a deadlock. Arab party has some nice numbers, but it's 13 out of 120 seats, it's not necessary to make coalition and neither side will involve them in the coalition at this time, at most Gantz might cut some backstage deal with them for support from opposition to screw Netanyahu.

There is still a chance to form government, but it will require someone to blink first and break a few important pledges in process.

[Breccia]

It's fuck both sides plan, that's why it's not released yet

That seems to contradict how much Trump has been cozying up to Netanyahu, through Kushner by proxy. I have heard literally nothing even suggested about any plan in which Netanyahu somehow has to make amends or concessions. Hell, he campaigned and ran on "annex the West Bank" which I'm pretty sure the UN frowns upon, unless it's vetoed by the USA.

You could be right, we don't know, very little is known. But what we do know, so far, is
1) Trump takes Jerusalem from the Palestinians
2) Trump begs money from Arab countries to pay them
3) ???

[ABEEnr2]

Not sure if this has been mentioned or not. But if it is true, then the so called evidence should prove it. https://www.foxnews.com/politics/ira...gime-saudi-oil

Iran’s main resistance group claimed Monday to have intelligence detailing how Tehran was behind the recent attacks on a Saudi oil facility -- just days after Iranian President Hassan Rouhani challenged the international community to provide such evidence of its involvement.

The National Council of Resistance of Iran (NCRI) said it has received information from within the government that detailed the missile and drone attacks on Saudi oil facilities on Sept. 14.

you mean the same group that is labeled "terrorist organization"? Yeah no, foreign NCRI will do whatever it takes to blame iran.

[Gaidax]

That seems to contradict how much Trump has been cozying up to Netanyahu, through Kushner by proxy. I have heard literally nothing even suggested about any plan in which Netanyahu somehow has to make amends or concessions. Hell, he campaigned and ran on "annex the West Bank" which I'm pretty sure the UN frowns upon, unless it's vetoed by the USA.

You could be right, we don't know, very little is known. But what we do know, so far, is
1) Trump takes Jerusalem from the Palestinians
2) Trump begs money from Arab countries to pay them
3) ???

This does not matter who's cozying up to whom. Trump just keeps the guy on the leash. Netanyahu can't refuse Trump, that's why when this plan gets revealed with inevitable complete show-stoppers for Israel, Netanyahu will offer some sort of public support-iiiish for it, while hoping Palestinians will rescue him by rejecting it. That's why Trump will do the most he can to offer as much insensitives to Palestinians as possible with the rumored grandiose development plans so they don't scuttle this opportunity outright.

Jerusalem as usual will be the thing negotiated last, him putting embassy on what will be Israel side of it in any case does not change shit there.

All in all this plan will fail anyway, because it does not matter who proposes what - two sides won't agree and even if by some sheer miracle they do and it goes somewhere, it will be inevitably scuttled by extremists both sides.

- - - Updated - - -

Heck the whole elections BS on Israel side and PA/Hamas cold war on Palestinian side simply leave no ground whatsoever for any deal. This needs to be fixed first, so no wonder the whole thing is shelved for now.

[Ghostpanther]

No I showed you an article that proved that your source is full of crap and an given what they do are an actual danger.
And then you have Fox news...

Also I assume you are referring to this piece of the article. Nowhere in the article does it say that Iran did it.



And let me ask you this question. DO you want war? Do you want millions of people to die? Do you want a new ISIS? Are you a supporter of state sponsort terrorisme which the SA government is. Because that;s the people you are ''teaming'' up with who want to attack Iran.

My 13 year old self knew that the Iraqi war was at best stupid decision pushed by war mongers and the same group of people now are pushing for war with Iran.

Na. Your article did not prove that. It is a opinion piece.

I do not want war and was against the invasion of Iraq. And I do not think we need to involve ground troops or do any type of military invasion of Iran. And I do not think SA is a innocent party in this matter. But I do trust the opinion that Iran was behind the coordinated drone attack on the SA oil fields. Personally, I think the US should let the countries which need the oil from that region do the security for it.

[Gaidax]

I think the US should let the countries which need the oil from that region do the security for it.

Whole world needs it including US. Couple more attacks like that and you will be paying double you pay now for power and gas. Nobody in the West wants to get back to $100 a barrel.

This is a big deal and if various rogue states continue with this bullshit there will be a war.

[Ghostpanther]

Whole world needs it including US. Couple more attacks like that and you will be paying double you pay now for power and gas. Nobody in the West wants to get back to $100 a barrel.

This is a big deal and if various rogue states continue with this bullshit there will be a war.

It would increase the price of gas at the pumps for the US. That is true. And for other things. But the US is also self sufficient now with oil. We are exporting some of it. The countries which need it the most, should be footing most of the cost of the security in the region was my point. It is time the US stop being the main one trying to police the world and carry most of the cost of doing it with money and lives.

[ati87]

Na. Your article did not prove that. It is a opinion piece.

I do not want war and was against the invasion of Iraq. And I do not think we need to involve ground troops or do any type of military invasion of Iran. And I do not think SA is a innocent party in this matter. But I do trust the opinion that Iran was behind the coordinated drone attack on the SA oil fields. Personally, I think the US should let the countries which need the oil from that region do the security for it.

But you are pushing an propaganda article so what is it?
Do you think that linking and reading propaganda articles from group that have a known bias is a good thing?

[Gaidax]

It would increase the price of gas at the pumps for the US. That is true. And for other things. But the US is also self sufficient now with oil. We are exporting some of it. The countries which need it the most, should be footing most of the cost of the security in the region was my point. It is time the US stop being the main one trying to police the world and carry most of the cost of doing it with money and lives.

This is not how this works, US and rest of the world is not living in some sort of bubble.

You think US is self-sufficient? Remind me where your smartphone was built. It was built overseas using power generated from non-US oil and it is sold and resold to you based on these expenses and profit margins. This is why oil prices spiking end up doing so much damage, it's a bloody domino effect. Like it or not, world is running on oil for now.

Kinda reminds me of that meme about #MAGA hats being Made in China. Well guess what if China pays more for oil, US will pay more for #MAGS hats too.

[Ghostpanther]

This is not how this works, US and rest of the world is not living in some sort of bubble.

You think US is self-sufficient? Remind me where your smartphone was built. It was built overseas using power generated from non-US oil and it is sold and resold to you based on these expenses and profit margins. This is why oil prices spiking end up doing so much damage, it's a bloody domino effect. Like it or not, world is running on oil for now.

Kinda reminds me of that meme about #MAGA hats being Made in China. Well guess what if China pays more for oil, US will pay more for #MAGS hats too.

I meant when it comes to oil. The US, more so than most other countries, could if they needed to do so, survive and function just fine without any foreign assistance or products.

But I guess that is another topic.

[Masark]

Nobody in the West wants to get back to $100 a barrel.

Eh, Alberta would probably like that.

The government of my province probably would also.

[jeezusisacasual]

I meant when it comes to oil. The US, more so than most other countries, could if they needed to do so, survive and function just fine without any foreign assistance or products.

But I guess that is another topic.

They could survive but at what cost? The US would be hit the hardest due to the long distance to travel for products. Tomatoes would go from 2$ to 8 or 9$ overnight. Also people forget how much our economy is based on the retail sector alone which is one of the first things to get cut in a crunch time scenario. It would be a monster recession.

[Gaidax]

Eh, Alberta would probably like that.

The government of my province probably would also.

The government of the province may like it, but will you like it when prices of just about everything you can imagine will skyrocket due to inflated gas prices?

- - - Updated - - -

They could survive but at what cost? The US would be hit the hardest due to the long distance to travel for products. Tomatoes would go from 2$ to 8 or 9$ overnight. Also people forget how much our economy is based on the retail sector alone which is one of the first things to get cut in a crunch time scenario. It would be a monster recession.

This is something people seem to just not understand.

It's not a simple case of "lol we gots lots of oils" it's a case of modern world, especially Western countries relying a lot on foreign sources for just about every commodity imaginable. US being self-sufficient is a dream beyond a dream at this point... I mean... you guys can't even make your own #MAGA hats for crying out loud.

That's why when oil prices start to rise everyone is shaking in their booties - it leads to everything becoming much more expensive and if a gallon of gas in your nearest gas station rises above certain threshold - you will have a political crisis at hands, the one that will make this whole Trump thing look like a pleasant afternoon nap.

[Masark]

The government of the province may like it, but will you like it when prices of just about everything you can imagine will skyrocket due to inflated gas prices?

Gas prices today aren't really that much different from when oil was up in the 3 digits.

[Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang]

Gas prices today aren't really that much different from when oil was up in the 3 digits.

Well at least here in Europe, most of what you pay for at the gas pump is taxes and taxes on taxes. Those that will suffer on the other hand will be the developing countries that import and/or give subsidies for gas.

[I Push Buttons]

They could survive but at what cost? The US would be hit the hardest due to the long distance to travel for products. Tomatoes would go from 2$ to 8 or 9$ overnight. Also people forget how much our economy is based on the retail sector alone which is one of the first things to get cut in a crunch time scenario. It would be a monster recession.

A small cost?

Even as recently as a decade ago your argument might have had merit, back then we had almost 11 million barrels per day net petroleum product imports on average and ~18.7 million barrels per day consumption, foreign imports were upwards of 60% of our consumption...

But net foreign petroleum imports have been declining rapidly ever since then (and domestic production increasing)... Thus far in 2019, the US only has net petroleum imports of about a million barrels per day on average... We consume upwards of 21 million barrels per day. IE: Net foreign imports constitute a tiny percentage of our petroleum consumption these days. And of our foreign petroleum imports, upwards of half of it comes from Canada and Mexico who will never stop selling it to us...

The only thing keeping the US from energy independence presently is that different types of oil are useful for different things and its ever so slightly cheaper to ship some types of oil abroad and import other types of oil depending on its usage than to try and process all of it domestically. We could easily process it all domestically, it would just cost money that no one is inclined to spend at present because there is no reason to.

[jeezusisacasual]

A small cost?

Even as recently as a decade ago your argument might have had merit, back then we had almost 11 million barrels per day net petroleum product imports on average and ~18.7 million barrels per day consumption, foreign imports were upwards of 60% of our consumption...

But net foreign petroleum imports have been declining rapidly ever since then (and domestic production increasing)... Thus far in 2019, the US only has net petroleum imports of about a million barrels per day on average... We consume upwards of 21 million barrels per day. IE: Net foreign imports constitute a tiny percentage of our petroleum consumption these days. And of our net foreign petroleum imports, upwards of half of it comes from Canada and Mexico who will never stop selling it to us...

The only thing keeping the US from energy independence presently is that different types of oil are useful for different things and its ever so slightly cheaper to ship some types of oil abroad and import other types of oil depending on its usage than to try and process all of it domestically. We could easily process it all domestically, it would just cost money that no one is inclined to spend at present because there is no reason to.

To keep the overall economy for the common person it is required. Oil is a speculative market in which i have in the past traded futures in. For instance just the very thought that a 2% supply disruption means prices can rise as much as 25% because they simply can and no one can stop them. Its the same reason why the price per barrel is extremely cheap but still the price is above previous marks in the overall barrel price. This will be the future to be honest with you, people want guaranteed amounts of profitability in commodities.