new forsaken leader spoilers

[Rhlor]

Thank you, both for the info and for your response. The first few resonses above you have completely focused on the wrong thing. They focus on what they fear would happen to the forsaken rather than what is actually happening.

The forsaken become evil, hardcore killers they moan, they put it aside to be a bit more like their original selvs with improvement potential, and they loathe.

What if blizzard is setting up Calia to lead an undead allied race? And the forsaken are no longer one diemnsional evil buggers but have another sid eto them? Why must you think all of a sudden the forsaken are all going to be like Calia? Why not htink some would be like Calia, and some would be like Sylvanas? Why not look forward to the possibiliteis this new information can resutl in rather than moan abouut a result you can't even verify? Why always go to the worse possible conclusion to get yourself disapopinted and unhapppy, completely ignoring and failign to think about what else this means?

I think the person who didn't know that this was going to happen lied to himself. I don't care in particular, I am more happy because in this way we ended the silly faction war, blizz never knew how to make a good story of faction war in WoW

[Shakana]

Yes, that's because Sylvanas is the archetypal Forsaken and the founder of the faction as well as its leader for fifteen years. Every Forsaken theme is represented in Sylvanas, except arguably the whole being from Lordaeron theme, instead it's a different fallen kingdom ravaged by Arthas. That doesn't mean that no other Forsaken characters exist or that Sylvanas is the sole cause for any Forsaken doing anything. That's simply outright false..

Forsaken banner is her. That's all proof i need to say Sylvanas is forsaken's image. And that alone annoys me with the recent events. And even more with people saying they want their forsaken to stay loyal to Sylvanas. I just want forsaken FOR ONCE, to be their OWN image. Even if this means having no leader. They should change their banner too.

I'm saying that Sylvanas lead the Forsaken initially so as to kill Arthas and then planned to kill herself. This was Vanilla to Wrath. Then she saw she'd go to hell and focused on making the Forsaken powerful/immortal to make herself powerful/immortal. This is Cata to BTS. Finally, she decided to fuck the whole business and kill everyone for some very vague goal. This is BFA and onwards.

But the Forsaken do not share those steps or that mentality. In Vanilla you have Forsaken like the rogue trainer, or those tied to Varimathras who already talk about Forsaken world conquest and killing the living. In turn, in Cataclysm you have the shift of mentality to adopting the Lordaeronian identity and undeath as a transhumanist state. The Forsaken and Sylvanas are closely connected, but they do not have the same span nor the same mentality in their majority ,let alone between individual characters. Sylvanas being in charge didn't stop Clarice, Judkins, Zelling, Onslaught and so forth from existing.

I recommend people play the old and new Forsaken quests, because A) They're good B) It'd allow people to discuss them without resorting to these stale memes.

Vanilla undeads are the hardcore undeads. They even mess up with disgusting things human bodies, they are freaking hardcore to the max. And anyone that loved WC3 they like this kind of things, way too much to even accept a big change like this suddenly. And well i get that. With the time passing their start having a bit change of mindset, ofc. That's totally normal. I mean lore needs to continue if we are going to have more stories, i don't see why not changing a bit the races mindset. And even more with classic (need to put this invisible or they will talk about it here xD) that they will always be remember for who they were. Retail devs feels they can move on to start a new era for the forsaken, horde, etc.

[Raisei]

I liked you better when you admitted you just wanted Calia in the job out of spite instead of actually trying to debate something you have no knowledge of or prior interest in except for the purposes of trying to own the Forsaken playerbase.

I do accept that my knowledge is limited, as I have not been playing a Forsaken for 15 years. But this is exactly the thing you are missing: Things change. Characters and lore evolve or devolve if you prefer to put it negatively.
A story like Legion or BFA with the high rez cinematics and actually connected story-telling is a new things for WoW and was unthinkable before. The game evolves and the new lore of Legion, BTS and BFA trumps whatever was said in Forsaken quest #41 in Cata. Sorry, that is just how things are.

So yes, I argue with knowledge gained from newer sources, that does not make those any less canon. And you are missunderstanding my intentions, while I take some amusement from this, it is mainly derived from the more absurd arguments I am exposed to here and the disporpotioned rages against a character who (I repeat myself here) has barely been given more then 2 minutes of dialogue. WE DO NOT KNOW if she is in constant agony because of her body actually rotting behind the nice fascade, we do not know how much she lost when she died.

All I am saying is: Have a bit of patience, allow the characters to actually be introduced before you rip them to shreds. I mean with this kind of attitude do you actually expect anyone to take this playerbase seriously? If you want to influence the writers and devs of Blizzard to actually change things the playerbase should be more constructive and less "bad writing, lol, Blizzard so stupid" (which I know you, Dickmann, are trying to be, most others are not).

Also I maintain that Calia as leader of the Forsaken could be a completely valid and interesting character. That she does not fit the picture you build from past quests only underlines the point I made above. Things change, otherwise the game world becomes stale.

[CreatureLives]

It doesn't bother me that Calia is leading The Forsaken. She never really even was part of The Alliance. Sure, she is friendly with Anduin but so is Baine and Thrall. At the end of the day, the majority of the Forsaken are from Lordaeron. Those are her people. So I get it.

Derek though? How would anyone in The Horde be cool with that? His sister (Who he is still on good terms with) is one of the founders of The Alliance and his family/people just rejoined The Alliance. How could you ever trust him if you were part of The Horde?

[Verdugo]

I do accept that my knowledge is limited, as I have not been playing a Forsaken for 15 years. But this is exactly the thing you are missing: Things change. Characters and lore evolve or devolve if you prefer to put it negatively.
A story like Legion or BFA with the high rez cinematics and actually connected story-telling is a new things for WoW and was unthinkable before. The game evolves and the new lore of Legion, BTS and BFA trumps whatever was said in Forsaken quest #41 in Cata. Sorry, that is just how things are.

So yes, I argue with knowledge gained from newer sources, that does not make those any less canon. And you are missunderstanding my intentions, while I take some amusement from this, it is mainly derived from the more absurd arguments I am exposed to here and the disporpotioned rages against a character who (I repeat myself here) has barely been given more then 2 minutes of dialogue. WE DO NOT KNOW if she is in constant agony because of her body actually rotting behind the nice fascade, we do not know how much she lost when she died.

All I am saying is: Have a bit of patience, allow the characters to actually be introduced before you rip them to shreds. I mean with this kind of attitude do you actually expect anyone to take this playerbase seriously? If you want to influence the writers and devs of Blizzard to actually change things the playerbase should be more constructive and less "bad writing, lol, Blizzard so stupid" (which I know you, Dickmann, are trying to be, most others are not).

Also I maintain that Calia as leader of the Forsaken could be a completely valid and interesting character. That she does not fit the picture you build from past quests only underlines the point I made above. Things change, otherwise the game world becomes stale.

Only thing Calia and her lightforged abominations are good for is raid fodder, which will hopefuly happen when someone at Blizzard actualy remembers that they wanted the light to do something bad.

[Sorrowseer]

|Fuck yeah, lordaeron finally back to the Menethils, this is the only good news I have seen in the spoilers, so happy

[dope_danny]

So...... I think this entire script, plus what we know in-game, makes it very clear, that all of the identity of the Forsaken was put on Sylvanas. Remove her and the Forsaken is without any identity or purpose.

Its kinda sad to see an entire race just be left in such a state, where they have NO personality left.

Technically that was their identity. Lot of them were people from Lordaeron but a lot also aren't. They weren't a unified people and culture. Just the leftovers that got freed from the scourges mind control and found nobody wanted to trust them after the scourge war. They congregated to a powerful personality and were influenced by them.

Honestly in retrospect looking at how the general people of Lordaeron even in vanilla had no problem with mindslaves and questionable human experiments makes me wonder if the 'there must always be a lich king' idea isn't just talking about a magic crown but that there is a soft hive mind aspect to the plague and the most dominant personality in a collective actively influences the personality and behaviour of those around them. Essentially zombies with a little more autonomy which in the end is what the plague victims are at the end of the day.

Which could also easily lead Blizz to write that a stronger personality influenced Sylvanas and it wasn't her fault and time for a redemption road trip yaaaay...

[Shakana]

Derek though? How would anyone in The Horde be cool with that? His sister (Who he is still on good terms with) is one of the founders of The Alliance and his family/people just rejoined The Alliance. How could you ever trust him if you were part of The Horde?

Baine took Derek to his sister after Sylvanas turned him into an confused undead. His sister, Jaina, is friend with thrall, baine saved derek and took him home, Calia is his lover, so he wants to follow her anywhere. Alliance and horde are supposedly trying to maintain peace. Won't be that much of a problem.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wREeahXw1Q

IS HEEEE THE BOMB THIS TIMEEEEE

[Rhlor]

Calia Menethil The new Forsaken Leader - Patch 8.3 Questline (Horde)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRmiK4Nl3eg
Calia Menethil The new Forsaken Leader - Patch 8.3 Questline (Alliance)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgNpBx1lXzU

[Shakana]

Calia Menethil The new Forsaken Leader - Patch 8.3 Questline (Horde)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRmiK4Nl3eg
Calia Menethil The new Forsaken Leader - Patch 8.3 Questline (Alliance)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgNpBx1lXzU

Thank you for providing info Rhlor.

[RH92]

Oh, fuck that.

First they castrated the Orcs and now Forsaken are going to be led by two Alliance inserts. I guess they should be renamed into Rescued since Anduin's light will guide them into peace and prosperity. Being miserable and sadistic will be forbidden, say goodbye to your racial indentity.

The only benefit of that is we might actually get 'Forsaken' Paladins, only they won't be badass anymore.

[Rhlor]

Delaryn is one of the people who meets with Calia! I guess it will be the new military leader of the forsaken instead of nathanos

[tromage2]

Delaryn is one of the people who meets with Calia! I guess it will be the new military leader of the forsaken instead of nathanos

Why need a military leader? its peacecraft.
We are now footsoldiers of the almighty boy king Anduin.

[Rhlor]

Why need a military leader? its peacecraft.
We are now footsoldiers of the almighty boy king Anduin.

to fight against n'zoth?

[Atticon]

The use of the word "honor" here is critical. What would be the prime criterium for the leaders of the other Horde races to accept the Forsaken's new leader?
Honor.

[Friendlyimmolation]

The use of the word "honor" here is critical. What would be the prime criterium for the leaders of the other Horde races to accept the Forsaken's new leader?
Honor.

And every Forsaken player cried out in horror.

[Unlimited Power]

It's ironic how close this is to my prediction of a council between Voss, Calia and Derek. Turns out the council became the horde leadership itself, but it feels good to hit the mark so close anyway.

That said I stopped being invested in this story long ago. It has generally been extremely predictable ever since Legion, and from the conversations in 8.2.5, this seemed like one of the most obvious story progressions. Frankly not sure how this surprises anyone, however disappointing they may find it.

I personally don't mind it too much. At this point most Forsaken have been depicted at cartoon levels of evil for ages at the encouragement of their leader, and I'd like to see the conflicts that'll inevitably arrive from having a leader with a different mindset.

[guisadop]

Finally the forsaken have a real, rightful Menethil ruler, as it should be.

[Kazlofski]

I sure hope there is a story being prepared for Sylvanas loyalists later on.
Makes no sense whatsoever that perhaps the most cruel and dark edgy race in WoW (Classic: making different plagues that were ordered by Sylvanas but they still always got a good chuckle out of poisoning other races to death and up to fantasizing on committing in game genocide and hating on everything living pretty much) will be lead by a super "good" alliance lead and get a 180 change to their personalities and motives/interests/characteristics.

Hope they have a plan for the next expansion regarding this (Doubtful).

[Stormdash]

Finally the forsaken have a real, rightful Menethil ruler, as it should be.

Having Menethil rulers is why they became the Forsaken. This is tone-deaf idiocy by Blizzard.