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  1. #1
    Light comes from darkness shise's Avatar
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    King Anduin and the irrational haters

    Why do people irrationally hate him?

    Let´s think in perspective, for once. Forget all you know and check this out:

    In the current times, the Horde is the most dominant force in Azeroth, by quite a long margin. Not only do we have the most land and capitals, but the Alliance has recently lost a large amount of its population and a major landmark. On top of that, it has happened with no grievances to the Horde as this was the act of a "common enemy".
    The Alliance currently suffer a bit of an identity issue with Tyrande going a bit "her way". I do not judge this, I only mention it to state the facts.

    The Horde has now (or so it seems) gained the full strength of (most of) Sylvanas army.

    Right now we have reached peace, but for sure the Horde is easily a 3 to 1 ratio against the Alliance.

    Now, about King Anduin. He is a rather pacific, strategic king, and that is smart in times like this when the Alliance has genuinely nothing to do in a full scale war against the Horde.
    He helped Saurfang, who in turn wanted the true Horde back. Sylvanas never cared all that much about the Horde, ever since classic btw, that is the very original Lore and not just BfA.
    This is, yet again, a smart move by the Alliance King. Sylvanas would have destroyed him so what else could make sense but to ally with whoever you can to take her down?

    Out of this scenario, Anduin is a warrior. He lacks the experience and maybe the strength of many others, but remember his age. Hi will fight if needed, he believes in honor and he will genuinely help anyone who needs help (Horde or Alliance).


    I was Alliance for over 13 years, now I am Horde, so I am more neutral than ever as I obviously still have feelings for the Alliance, but I am now Horde.

    So please, explain me all the hate? He is a pretty good King, I won´t say that he is the best or anything, we can leave it plain neutral, he is plain good.



    And btw, for those coming with "this is Warcraft not lovecraft derp", think a bit, we´ve got Warcraft in nearly every single expansion, we´ve got Horde vs Alliance no matter what other leaders where trying to accomplish, so your argument is pretty much invalid. Even in WotLK when we last joined forces (that is over 10 years ago btw..), we still had Horde vs Alliance conflicts.

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by shise View Post
    Why do people irrationally hate him?

    Let´s think in perspective, for once. Forget all you know and check this out:

    In the current times, the Horde is the most dominant force in Azeroth, by quite a long margin. Not only do we have the most land and capitals, but the Alliance has recently lost a large amount of its population and a major landmark. On top of that, it has happened with no grievances to the Horde as this was the act of a "common enemy".
    The Alliance currently suffer a bit of an identity issue with Tyrande going a bit "her way". I do not judge this, I only mention it to state the facts.

    The Horde has now (or so it seems) gained the full strength of (most of) Sylvanas army.

    Right now we have reached peace, but for sure the Horde is easily a 3 to 1 ratio against the Alliance.

    Now, about King Anduin. He is a rather pacific, strategic king, and that is smart in times like this when the Alliance has genuinely nothing to do in a full scale war against the Horde.
    He helped Saurfang, who in turn wanted the true Horde back. Sylvanas never cared all that much about the Horde, ever since classic btw, that is the very original Lore and not just BfA.
    This is, yet again, a smart move by the Alliance King. Sylvanas would have destroyed him so what else could make sense but to ally with whoever you can to take her down?

    Out of this scenario, Anduin is a warrior. He lacks the experience and maybe the strength of many others, but remember his age. Hi will fight if needed, he believes in honor and he will genuinely help anyone who needs help (Horde or Alliance).


    I was Alliance for over 13 years, now I am Horde, so I am more neutral than ever as I obviously still have feelings for the Alliance, but I am now Horde.

    So please, explain me all the hate? He is a pretty good King, I won´t say that he is the best or anything, we can leave it plain neutral, he is plain good.



    And btw, for those coming with "this is Warcraft not lovecraft derp", think a bit, we´ve got Warcraft in nearly every single expansion, we´ve got Horde vs Alliance no matter what other leaders where trying to accomplish, so your argument is pretty much invalid. Even in WotLK when we last joined forces (that is over 10 years ago btw..), we still had Horde vs Alliance conflicts.
    Sauce for those numbers?

  3. #3
    the hate is very rational though

  4. #4
    I believe your ratio is wrong. Well, if it isn't it should. Let's not forget that there hasn't been that many years since Vanilla, and the Horde had a really low population compared to any of the Alliance races, let alone the entire faction. It is merely a plot device, so it is hard to say who has the upper hand as Blizzard will change anything to suit the plot they intended, regardless of whether it makes sense or not.

    Many who do not like Anduin do not like the fact that he has been painted and hinted at as the saviour of Azeroth. And he is not a Warrior, he is a Priest.

    I personally cannot enjoy any 'High King' the Alliance will ever have. The Alliance has always been a coalition, no race was superior to the others, no race could tell the others what to do. Even Tyrande pulling any support is not 'treason' nor is it an act of defiance as the Alliance races were never subjects of Stormwind.

    The Horde, on the other hand, had a Warchief and that Warchief was the supreme power and had a say in whatever he intended. The Horde has never been a coalition. That is made even worse by the fact that the Trolls and the Tauren would have died by now if the Orcs had not saved them. Even the Forsaken did not originally start out that great, and Silvermoon needed Sylvanas and the Horde to save them from whatever was left of the Scourge in the area.

    Yet, Blizzard invented a 'High King of the Alliance' only to make things 'even' when they start that 'morally grey' and 'no, the Horde is not more evil than the Alliance, it's just that...'. It does not mean I do not like Anduin's character, but I fail to see why any of the Alliance races would decide to be ruled by the king of Stormwind. It makes no sense whatsoever.

  5. #5
    Stood in the Fire Toxuvox's Avatar
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    I'd say that at the minute, most of the main NPCs in game have become somewhat shallow. The current writing team have either run out of ideas, or are just not fully into it when it comes to the depth of our racial leaders. That includes Anduin, Baine, Thrall, Genn and more or less, all the rest of our big lore folks. There's potential in all of them, but (and this is just my opinion) the character writers need to take some bold risks and spend some real time to make these characters engaging again (or in some cases, for the first time).

  6. #6
    Because he is a pussy.

    He did not aid the citizens of Teldrassil, nor honored their death.
    He defiled the night elven blade Shalamayne by giving it to the genocidal maniac Saurfang, the Butcher of Ashenvale, who was the strategic brain behind the Burning of Teldrassil
    He rewarded the Butcher of Ashenvale with an honorable death, and we all know, that is all orcs are living for

    Despite what Blizzard is saying - Alliance still has a SPACESHIP, seasoned war heroes like FUCKING Tyralion and Alleria, Malfurion (who caused the great Sundering), Velen, the Prophet (who mysteriously is MIA the entire xpac). One of the most powerful mages on Azeroth (Jaina)

    When it comes to lore characters, the Horde has no one to match up with this force. Yet, the "Highking" is somehow "alone".

    People hate Anduin because he is the amalgamation of the devs hate for the Alliance. He is the embodiement of the devs desire to make Alliance dumb losers.


  7. #7
    Good king would appease its people and offer blood. I don't remember Anduin giving o-kay sign for people to massacre enemy villages or perform mass executions of prisoners of war in their towns. That's how you unleash and tame spirits of agitated subjects. If Anduin was a wise monarch he would line up Hordies for the Night Elves to practise shooting. He would lit bonfires across the Azeroth.

  8. #8
    Anduin should have acted when he had the chance, e.g. directly after the Burning of Teldrassil. He chose to not to (or do you call his irrational and pitiful attempt of "conquering" Lordaeron as some kind of act? Without Jaina they'd all been dead). He's a horrible Alliance leader and he is a naive weakling. Irrational hate? Anduin is useless and does more for the Horde than he does for the Alliance. His latest notable move? Let Sylvanas escape.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by shise View Post
    Why do people hate him?
    Here, fixed that for you.

    It's ok to ask if you don't understand something. But you better not use derogatory terms like "irrational" in your opening statement. That gives the impression you've already made your judgement and the question is a rethorical one.

    #notmyking
    #betrayer of the Kaldorei


  10. #10
    Why do people hate or love imaginary characters in a video game is the more relevant question to ask.

  11. #11
    Epic! Pheraz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eggroll View Post
    Because he is a pussy.

    He did not aid the citizens of Teldrassil, nor honored their death.
    He defiled the night elven blade Shalamayne by giving it to the genocidal maniac Saurfang, the Butcher of Ashenvale, who was the strategic brain behind the Burning of Teldrassil
    He rewarded the Butcher of Ashenvale with an honorable death, and we all know, that is all orcs are living for

    Despite what Blizzard is saying - Alliance still has a SPACESHIP, seasoned war heroes like FUCKING Tyralion and Alleria, Malfurion (who caused the great Sundering), Velen, the Prophet (who mysteriously is MIA the entire xpac). One of the most powerful mages on Azeroth (Jaina)

    When it comes to lore characters, the Horde has no one to match up with this force. Yet, the "Highking" is somehow "alone".

    People hate Anduin because he is the amalgamation of the devs hate for the Alliance. He is the embodiement of the devs desire to make Alliance dumb losers.
    Pretty much this. He is the worst sterotype of rightful good you could imagine. I wasn't a fan of his father either because that one was too derpy. But Anduin is just... no. As a best friend. Okay. As a priest in a church. Okay. But not as the representive leader of the alliance.
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  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Eggroll View Post
    People hate Anduin because he is the amalgamation of the devs hate for the Alliance. He is the embodiement of the devs desire to make Alliance dumb losers.
    Guess you missed the parts where the Horde for no reason got to play the bad guy several times, lose, and survive only because of the mercy of the Alliance leaders, basking in the glory of their righteous victory. I wonder when we'll invade Orgrimmar next time...
    The last expansions where the Horde provide some troops, but all the important characters are alliance or faction neutral alliance races. The Horde heroes die, wither away or stay in the background for some reason. The only Horde victories are cowardly genocides to stir up some shit between the races, and give the alliance a good cause to kill some hordies. I guess Blizzard hates both factions then?
    Mother pus bucket!

  13. #13
    Light comes from darkness shise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sezh View Post
    Why do people hate or love imaginary characters in a video game is the more relevant question to ask.
    Yes, it is when you are in MMO-Champion, a forum website mainly dedicated to imaginary characters.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by OneWay View Post
    Whole problem with Anduin is that he thinks he is neutral and that he is the face of alliance and alliance has many faces and Sylvanas experienced that first hand. "We friends? No harsh feelings?" said no King after his kingdom did so many genocides and atrocities against different races. Against differences! This was was coming and Sylvanas was right.
    Then again, Sylvanas killed numerous Hordes with no remorse, so not quite the same example. Anduin did not rule in the past, so far his time ruling is about trying to use common sense and dialogue over randomly rising the axe.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Pheraz View Post
    Pretty much this. He is the worst sterotype of rightful good you could imagine. I wasn't a fan of his father either because that one was too derpy. But Anduin is just... no. As a best friend. Okay. As a priest in a church. Okay. But not as the representive leader of the alliance.
    But that is what the light and paladins are all about, rightfully peace and use of warfare to protect it.. that is EXACTLY what he is, a paladin of the light, which is the purest Alliance representation (from a human perspective ofc).

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by tankbug View Post
    Guess you missed the parts where the Horde for no reason got to play the bad guy several times, lose, and survive only because of the mercy of the Alliance leaders, basking in the glory of their righteous victory. I wonder when we'll invade Orgrimmar next time...
    The last expansions where the Horde provide some troops, but all the important characters are alliance or faction neutral alliance races. The Horde heroes die, wither away or stay in the background for some reason. The only Horde victories are cowardly genocides to stir up some shit between the races, and give the alliance a good cause to kill some hordies. I guess Blizzard hates both factions then?
    Yeah, well, at least Horde gets SOME real victories. Yeah, Alliance invaded Orgrimmar - but nothing really came of it afterwards. On the contrary. In the aftermath Tyrande granted the Horde the uncontested use of Aszharas ressources. The only thing the Horde got was a "slap on the wrist".

    Meanwhile the Alliance had territory actually destroyed or lost. While Horde did not lose any territory afaik.
    -Southshore and Hillsbrad Foothills
    -Theramore
    -Teldrassil (Undercity doesn't count, since it was blown up by Sylvanas - and evacuated beforehand)
    -Ashenvale


    Of course the Horde's victories are not glorious, Horde is the edgelord "monster" faction after all.


  15. #15
    He managed to lose almost all of our infantry to ill-planned campaigns, got Teldrassil and nearly all of its civilian population burnt to death due to being drawn into an obvious feint, lost our entire navy to another feint, shall I go on...?

    I will concede that it is difficult to lay the blame for this on Anduin entirely, however. Even if he were a wiser and more experienced King, he is still bound by the quality of his advisors, and his advisors are another failed pacifist and a former isolationist who brought disaster to his own kingdom with selfish delusions of grandeur. His spymaster is also the worst fucking spy in the entire world (of Warcraft).
    OMG 13:37 - Then Jesus said to His disciples, "Cleave unto me, and I shall grant to thee the blessing of eternal salvation."

    And His disciples said unto Him, "Can we get Kings instead?"

  16. #16
    He's basically Christie Golden's pet to push her agenda against your "typical" male.

    https://twitter.com/christiegolden/s...12328479260672

    Just watch, sooner or later, everyone (Alliance or Horde) will "understand" and follow Anduin's way as he slay the toxic male character (probably Horde) of Warcraft.

  17. #17
    Light comes from darkness shise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fetus Rex View Post
    Good king would appease its people and offer blood. I don't remember Anduin giving o-kay sign for people to massacre enemy villages or perform mass executions of prisoners of war in their towns. That's how you unleash and tame spirits of agitated subjects. If Anduin was a wise monarch he would line up Hordies for the Night Elves to practise shooting. He would lit bonfires across the Azeroth.
    You either don´t play the game right now or you don´t read and skip all cinematics. The Horde did not do anything to Teldrasil, it was Sylvanas side, which, as we all know by now, was not the true Horde. The true Horde confronted her and she left behind her army.

    A good king avoids blood, but will cause it if necessary. That is exactly what Anduin seems to be alike.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by shise View Post
    But that is what the light and paladins are all about, rightfully peace and use of warfare to protect it.. that is EXACTLY what he is, a paladin of the light, which is the purest Alliance representation (from a human perspective ofc).
    Idk if you heard of it, but Paladins have a specc called "Retribution" for a reason. Apparently Manduin never specced into that.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by shise View Post
    You either don´t play the game right now or you don´t read and skip all cinematics. The Horde did not do anything to Teldrasil, it was Sylvanas side, which, as we all know by now, was not the true Horde. The true Horde confronted her and she left behind her army.

    A good king avoids blood, but will cause it if necessary. That is exactly what Anduin seems to be alike.
    Lol! The mastermind behind the attack on Ashenvale and Teldrassil was Saurfang, the Butcher of Ashenvale. What narrative are you trying to push here? And there were plenty of Horde troops in the WoT. It's not as if Sylvanas was there all by herself. Remember, Saurfang put that axe into Malfurions back? How did he do that if he wasn't there?

    A good King protects his citizens from harm. He never did that for the citizens of Ashenvale/Darkshore/Teldrassil or Brennandan.
    Last edited by Eggroll; 2019-10-09 at 10:08 AM.


  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Niter View Post
    I personally cannot enjoy any 'High King' the Alliance will ever have. The Alliance has always been a coalition, no race was superior to the others.
    Ya know, after reading this it made me realize. Horde and alliance have kind of swapped ... Alliance was a coalition while the Horde had a Warchief. Now Horde is ruled by a council and Alliance has a High King. o.0
    Quote Originally Posted by Boubouille View Post
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  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Sezh View Post
    Why do people hate or love imaginary characters in a video game is the more relevant question to ask.
    Why do people like or dislike characters in a book, a tv show or a movie? They're fictional, but that's the point of a story telling media. To get people to connect with characters, to care about them. Game of Thrones for example, wouldn't have been half as successful if no-one gave a shit about the characters.

    That said, there's a difference between liking and dislike and fanatical love and hate. Some people here definitely lean more towards the latter options.


    OT: I think Anduin is fine as a character, I don't understand the dislike. Sure, he's not as exciting as Varian was, but his character makes sense. He's a kid that has grown up being taught peace and acceptance who is now in a position to put those morals into practice. Him not striking for peace, or not being upset about having to go to war, would be far more out of character than what he is currently doing.

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