9.0 General Discussion

[CCP Official]

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[quite an expert in wow]

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`thanks for taking your time to post here

i think you have many things to do but still make time to post some things its great

[thilicen]

As long as we get a ranged class and not another leather melee I'll be happy.

[Shadochi]

CCP approve this thread. It has been cleansed of impure discussion.

Huh, seems like something like that would take a long time in a thread like this...

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As long as we get a ranged class and not another leather melee I'll be happy.

Thats why I'm up for Bards:
Not really established in WoW lore so Blizz can interpret them however they want.
A war just ended so a great time for Bards to rise up and start making songs about the recent war.
Make them a "Jack of all trades" - can use any armor class but they get different bonuses for wearing all of the same type.
Have each main stat do something different.
Have them act as a wildcard class in rosters where they are able to fill in for certain boss mechanics where you would otherwise bring a class you don't need in the rest of the raid, albeit a bit weaker at it.

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I wonder if Azeroth *just dies* peacefully (the titan soul) what would happen. The Emerald dream would probably be gone and maybe some events at the maelstrom, but I see no reason why the whole planet would stop supporting life, at least not for a long while.

And the void would definitely have lest interest in our world if that happened in a way that prevented them bringing the soul back/resurrecting it.

What if we used Knaifu to trap Azeroth in it and thus remove any reason for the Old God forces to invade Azeroth?

[formerShandalay]

Huh, seems like something like that would take a long time in a thread like this...

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Thats why I'm up for Bards:
Not really established in WoW lore so Blizz can interpret them however they want.
A war just ended so a great time for Bards to rise up and start making songs about the recent war.
Make them a "Jack of all trades" - can use any armor class but they get different bonuses for wearing all of the same type.
Have each main stat do something different.
Have them act as a wildcard class in rosters where they are able to fill in for certain boss mechanics where you would otherwise bring a class you don't need in the rest of the raid, albeit a bit weaker at it.

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I wonder if Azeroth *just dies* peacefully (the titan soul) what would happen. The Emerald dream would probably be gone and maybe some events at the maelstrom, but I see no reason why the whole planet would stop supporting life, at least not for a long while.

And the void would definitely have lest interest in our world if that happened in a way that prevented them bringing the soul back/resurrecting it.

What if we used Knaifu to trap Azeroth in it and thus remove any reason for the Old God forces to invade Azeroth?

I think 'just dying' is out of the question, because souls are kind of immortal in WoW, even the souls of mortals. I guess the closest you could come to removing the soul without killing the planet is actually extracting the soul as we saw with Argus at the Seat. At the moment though the body is dying around the soul.

If you put the worldsoul inside Xal'atath I think it would get corrupted by default, because it would be stuck in a powerful shadow-thing without its usual escape to the peaceful dream. And if it sleeps inside the dagger I don't think the dreams would be particularly nice ^^

[Shadochi]

I think 'just dying' is out of the question, because souls are kind of immortal in WoW, even the souls of mortals. I guess the closest you could come to removing the soul without killing the planet is actually extracting the soul as we saw with Argus at the Seat. At the moment though the body is dying around the soul.

If you put the worldsoul inside Xal'atath I think it would get corrupted by default, because it would be stuck in a powerful shadow-thing without its usual escape to the peaceful dream. And if it sleeps inside the dagger I don't think the dreams would be particularly nice ^^

I guess so, I was meaning more something along the lines of disabling/tampering with the titan structures that help her to stop her from developing and maybe even draining her out (most titan facilities seem to function off of Azeroth's power, unless I missed something that was referenced as their power source). Something along the lines of pulling the plugs of a patient that is on a machine keeping him alive, since Azeroth needed them at least in the past to make sure it survives the wound from Y'Shaarj. Which is when the dream in its current form started because she basically got put into a coma.

I know most of the idea makes no sense, I just wanted to ponder a bit about the idea of stopping the void lords by taking away what they need (atm Azeroth is the only known nascent world soul and it seems like Void Lords cant corrupt existing titans as easily). Which is basically what Sargeras tried to do but we might see the reasoning behind his actions and find a better way to deal with the issue. Since right now we will just be fighting the Void forces until Azeroth titan forms, and who knows how many more millennia that could take.

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People are missing out on the reasons why they'd give us Tinkerers. I'm not saying this WILL happen, but if it does, it likely has to do with ancient Titan machinery. Preventing the world re-origination from wiping us all out, or going into Azeroth's core with a great "submarine"-drill to restart the heart, wipe out the Old Gods' tendrils, or whatever. There's a ton of cool ways to justify the Tinkerer class.

All is true, but personally I would prefer more of a soft introduction to a class where they just join our ranks (like Monk and DK did) without a specific purpose.
The way DH were introduced, there was very little reason for them to stay allied with the factions after the Legion was defeated and not go back to just being the Illidari.
DK's didn't join the factions solely for the reason to stop Arthas, and each DK joined forces individually with the faction, unlike the DH + Faction allegiance that was formed to stop the Legion.

My prefered introduction would be that based off of Mechagone research some new technology came out that allowed better control of contraptions so races adept in Engineering in any form get it. So I'd prefer it to be called Machinist or something of that sorts. Don't want another class locked behind only two races.

The only issue is faction imbalance at the moment, but could be easily dealt with in a .5 patch.

Ally:
Gnomes - they have tinkerers in lore
Mechagnomes - Do i really need to explain
Draenei - have artificers
(?)Lightforged Draenei - maybe for same reason as draenei

Horde:
Goblin - have tinkerers or whatever they call them
Mag'har Orcs - engineers that built the various Iron Horde contraptions
(?)Orcs - learned from their Mag'har brothers?

Blood Elves or Nighborne COULD work - they had constructs that were mostly powered by magical means tho

[formerShandalay]

I guess so, I was meaning more something along the lines of disabling/tampering with the titan structures that help her to stop her from developing and maybe even draining her out (most titan facilities seem to function off of Azeroth's power, unless I missed something that was referenced as their power source). Something along the lines of pulling the plugs of a patient that is on a machine keeping him alive, since Azeroth needed them at least in the past to make sure it survives the wound from Y'Shaarj. Which is when the dream in its current form started because she basically got put into a coma.

I know most of the idea makes no sense, I just wanted to ponder a bit about the idea of stopping the void lords by taking away what they need (atm Azeroth is the only known nascent world soul and it seems like Void Lords cant corrupt existing titans as easily). Which is basically what Sargeras tried to do but we might see the reasoning behind his actions and find a better way to deal with the issue. Since right now we will just be fighting the Void forces until Azeroth titan forms, and who knows how many more millennia that could take.

I don't think the battle is called 'eternal' for nothing. There is nothing that can stop Light and Void from clashing with each other and what we need to do is take care that we don't get crushed between them and still have a world that can sustain us. We can't just eradicate the void, because reality is made of it (and the Light), so if we try what Sargeras wanted we just end ourselves anyway and that makes fighting the void kind of moot in the first place. What we need to do is preserve out world(soul) and kick out everything that tries to corrupt it.
What I think might be possible is actually getting rid of the 'infestation' of the Old Gods, at least in their bodily form or in the form of actual spiritual presence. Like... absorb them and everything they are, spirits, souls, mass, infestations and whatnot into some vessel(s) and dump them on an already destroyed world like Telogrus. There anyone can study the stuff to be prepared for any further onslaught by the void, but it can't influence our world(soul) anymore. We'd still need to be vigilant of course, because something might come back or someone might try and conjure another Old God onto our world or whatever. Or some Etherals just open lots of portals and dump void on our planet like they did on their own.
We can, of course, also never get rid of the corruption in the form of 'emotions' or 'mortality' that makes mortals what they are. That would be a case of eternal vigilance again.

[Wangming]

I'm #TeamNecromancer

A Necromancer sounds way more likely in a death themed expansion

If the choice is between Necromancer and Tinker, I'm TeamNecromancer. Something is going on with Bolvar at least. He has encrypted stuff in the patch. And at the very least NPC deathknights for all the non DK races.

[Life-Binder]

#TeamDarkDragonNecroTinkerRanger

[Shadochi]

I don't think the battle is called 'eternal' for nothing. There is nothing that can stop Light and Void from clashing with each other and what we need to do is take care that we don't get crushed between them and still have a world that can sustain us. We can't just eradicate the void, because reality is made of it (and the Light), so if we try what Sargeras wanted we just end ourselves anyway and that makes fighting the void kind of moot in the first place. What we need to do is preserve out world(soul) and kick out everything that tries to corrupt it.
What I think might be possible is actually getting rid of the 'infestation' of the Old Gods, at least in their bodily form or in the form of actual spiritual presence. Like... absorb them and everything they are, spirits, souls, mass, infestations and whatnot into some vessel(s) and dump them on an already destroyed world like Telogrus. There anyone can study the stuff to be prepared for any further onslaught by the void, but it can't influence our world(soul) anymore. We'd still need to be vigilant of course, because something might come back or someone might try and conjure another Old God onto our world or whatever. Or some Etherals just open lots of portals and dump void on our planet like they did on their own.
We can, of course, also never get rid of the corruption in the form of 'emotions' or 'mortality' that makes mortals what they are. That would be a case of eternal vigilance again.

The clash between the Light and Void has been going on in the universe long before the Titans came to be, if I recall Chronicles Vol 1 correctly. The void is trying to use the titans to get an upper hand on the light. If there are no titans to be corrupted the clash would continue as it was probably. Which is I think why Sargeras was adamant of getting rid of world souls. He saw the universe as something belonging to the life that spawned from it but the souls would allow the Void to consume the universe. Not saying his actions were correct, but his intentions were.

Then there is always the possibility that the void would stay because a lot of the races of Azeroth can be easily corrupted, but could beings like Old Gods survive since they seem to be feeding off of and growing from Azeroth's life force.

I always wondered what happened to the old god being summoned in Outland...

As for the Ethereals, I know their lore is old and before the Void Lords were established but I have a theory that K'aresh also had a titan soul which got corrupted and released the Void Lord Dimensius and we only dealt with a manifestation of him sent to hunt down remaining survivors of K'aresh.

[Nyel]

What exactly would be the difference between Necromancer and Death Knight? The same as Priest and Paladin? I think they are trying to further distinguish classes and then bringing in Necromancer would exactly by the opposite of what they're trying to achieve.

This has been discussed so many times but a Death Knight is a Necromancer in plate armor. Unholy and a possible Necromancer DPS spec would almost exactly be the same: plagues, skeletons, summoning undead. The only real difference a Necromancer spec could have would be some kind of healing spec where you heal with twisted diseases or something like that.

Tinker, even unfitting for some kind of Shadowlands expansion, is a completely new class that could have three absolutely different specs that none of the existing classes have. I don't see any reason why Blizzard would go the Necromancer route instead.

What I could see is... some kind of "Lifebinder" class that has both, a life AND a death focused spec at the same time. So a class that can manipulate both, e.g. like "Red/Green Dragonflight spec" plus a "Death" themed spec. But even that sounds like a major a*pull.

[Shadochi]

What exactly would be the difference between Necromancer and Death Knight? The same as Priest and Paladin? I think they are trying to further distinguish classes and then bringing in Necromancer would exactly by the opposite of what they're trying to achieve.

This has been discussed so many times but a Death Knight is a Necromancer in plate armor. Unholy and a possible Necromancer DPS spec would almost exactly be the same: plagues, skeletons, summoning undead. The only real difference a Necromancer spec could have would be some kind of healing spec where you heal with twisted diseases or something like that.

Tinker, even unfitting for some kind of Shadowlands expansion, is a completely new class that could have three absolutely different specs that none of the existing classes have. I don't see any reason why Blizzard would go the Necromancer route instead.

What I could see is... some kind of "Lifebinder" class that has both, a life AND a death focused spec at the same time. So a class that can manipulate both, e.g. like "Red/Green Dragonflight spec" plus a "Death" themed spec. But even that sounds like a major a*pull.

Same theme as DK's but at range with a possible Healer spec seems OK to me. As you said, that is in the core of the theme what Priest/Pally is.
Death Magic DPS spec, Plague/Alchemist DPS spec, Witchdoctor healer spec?

And to be fair even if it is a similar theme, it would be welcome since it would be the first ranged DPS spec added since launch.

[formerShandalay]

The clash between the Light and Void has been going on in the universe long before the Titans came to be, if I recall Chronicles Vol 1 correctly. The void is trying to use the titans to get an upper hand on the light. If there are no titans to be corrupted the clash would continue as it was probably. Which is I think why Sargeras was adamant of getting rid of world souls. He saw the universe as something belonging to the life that spawned from it but the souls would allow the Void to consume the universe. Not saying his actions were correct, but his intentions were.

Then there is always the possibility that the void would stay because a lot of the races of Azeroth can be easily corrupted, but could beings like Old Gods survive since they seem to be feeding off of and growing from Azeroth's life force.

I always wondered what happened to the old god being summoned in Outland...

As for the Ethereals, I know their lore is old and before the Void Lords were established but I have a theory that K'aresh also had a titan soul which got corrupted and released the Void Lord Dimensius and we only dealt with a manifestation of him sent to hunt down remaining survivors of K'aresh.

The clash between Light and Void created the universe and everything inside it is made up of both. But that's not what I meant, what I meant was the war between the Light and the Void, that has supposedly gone on for longer than our reality existed, meaning even before said clash there was a universe where they were at war. This is what I'm referring to: "Do the naaru speak of the eternal conflict? That the entire history of your world is but a fraction of the time that has passed? Of those that came before the draenei? No? <short chuckle>" (said by Xal'atath in the Netherlight Temple, emphasis mine)

At least according to chonicle the void lords want to use the titans simply to manifest inside reality (and consume everything, as is their nature), because otherwise they can only remain as fractions of themselves and only for a very short period of time.
Sargeras first plan was a little rushed, because he was consumed by fear after listening to the dreadlords on the maddened world, but his plan seems at least grounded in a wish to ... do good? Or something?
But after he killed the other Titans he was simply mad and nothing he did makes any sense with his first plan. Now he wants to corrupt the world souls himself and make them into his Dark Pantheon, which is an idea he got from a vision of an "eye" looking at him after he tried entering Azeroth and got thwarted. An eye that he became totally obsessed with and put it on the tip of his staff, which kind of looks like a generic Old God eye. So, yea, maybe burning all of the universe and thereby saving... something else was as sound of a plan as Arthas burning Stratholme to save the Eastern Kingdoms (which while a horrible deed is at least debatable), but afterwards it's kind of a mess and turning out to be exactly what he wanted to prevent, which is being an insane and therefore easy pawn.
Sargeras is kind of repeating what Amon tried and then again Malthael tried and then in a smaller way Arthas tried and now possibly Sylvanas is trying.

And with Dimensius, Xal'atath has something to say there too and my theory for this is, that the Ethereals actually tried to conjure a voidlord, because Dimensius tore open portals and did not destroy the world by void alone, but by arcane magic too, which I think is the case because he did not actually possess a worldsoul there, either because there was none or because he hurried too much and that's why he was only a fragment of the power he could have been : "I long for the day our masters can truly pass into this realm. You have only seen fragments, shadows; the faintest of echoes. Ask the Ethereals what one of these manifestations are capable of." (Xal'atath) And even then he went on to devour another world, from which he was stopped by T'uure (https://wow.gamepedia.com/T%27uure). So, yea I agree this was probably a real void lord, just not born from a worldsoul, but portal-ed in so to speak, which was why he was so "weak".

So, yea, I do really understand why Sargeras was so scared of them, but to us mortals it would make no difference if we get annihilated by Sargeras or by a Void Lord.

I sometimes wonder about the Old God in Outland too. If he was responsible for the forming of the Twilight Hammer clan there? And maybe for some of the other stuff that went on. Did it die when Draenor blew up? I'd really like to know these kinds of things

[huth]

Also, we have the Blingtron encoded messages as a possible loose end for a future patch/expansion: https://www.wowhead.com/item=113999/...1-150#comments

Would work great with tinkerers.

Let's not forget the 7000 line also came with a new set of messages.

[Kereberus]

So would Necromancer be a hero class?

[Blayze]

So would Necromancer be a hero class?

A fourth Mage spec, perhaps?

[Nyel]

A fourth Mage spec, perhaps?

Mage? Rather a Death Knight ranged spec.

[Kagdar]

#teamnewclassthatcantankandmeleedpsplease
#teamitsabouttimetheyintroduceshamantanks

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

So would Necromancer be a hero class?

Hot take, hero classes are gone in 9.0. DKs and DHs now start at 1.


Also I'm Team Ncromancer because the "3 names" leak and Mechagon exists for an AR. If Mechagnomes weren't added maybe Tinker still had a shot.

[Costa]

Panda DKs...another thing the leak had ... hmmm

Hype!!!!!! Blizzcon soon.