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  1. #21
    Merely a Setback Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    There's more to necromancy than just summoning undead. And considering all the necromancers in wow they could easily pull ideas and abilities from them if they wanted to stick to WoW only ideas on necromancy.
    Honest question; Can you have a Necromancer class that doesn't summon undead minions?

  2. #22
    Banned Lazuli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LarryFromHR View Post
    Yes I imagine a WoW iteration of a necromancer would involve both corpse explosions and toxic vial smashing definitely, although I really believe that those black/blue Drustvar witch spell effects could play a pretty pivotal role in differentiating necromancers.
    Well yeah if they did necromancers at this point with drust lore then they would 100% be witches

  3. #23
    There are already necromancers in the game, they are called warlocks.

  4. #24
    Banned Lazuli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    No, I'm talking about 6.2 when Blizzard nerfed the spec into oblivion and literally told players not to play the spec before completely revamping it in Legion.

    You want to see that again with DKs? Be my guest.
    MM/surv hunter says hi. When did it happens to DKs lol? I guess you mean the option of 2h frost being taken away? DK has hardly changed through the years.

    DK has never been given the full necro fantasy Blizz always drips that shit in with few spells

  5. #25
    Banned Lilithvia's Avatar
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    AotD and Apocalypse could easily have model swaps without a actual change, or even be left alone.

    I'm thinking the DPS-summoning spec would have 4-5 minions out at all times, with a couple AotD-esque ultimates in case shit went south of extra DPS was needed; but most abilities would be acted out through the pets.

    the DPS-Support would only have one minion out, and be primarily focused on buffs/debuffs/DOTs. Maybe this would be a good spot for a Val'kyr minion?

    Short-ranged healer necro would be running around generating runic power and shoving bones into people and stitching them up. This spec would have to be highly mobile, as a ten yard range would be on most healing abilities, and might be throwing potions and poisons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazuli View Post
    MM hunter says hi. When did it happens to DKs lol? I guess you mean the option of 2h frost being taken away? DK has hardly changed through the years.
    He says it hasn't happened to DKs yet;
    And I had to entirely relearn my bar when Legion prepatch hit.

  6. #26
    Brewmaster Evaddon's Avatar
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    It wouldn't destroy any specs, it would only be similar to warlocks because of the summoner identity.

    Shadow Priest- Is more void then shadow magic now (arguable)
    Unholy Deathknight- is about plague and diseases

    Necromancers are about the Undead,Spirits,Souls, and a tid bit of shadow magic to enhance their capabilities! To me no class really encompasses this idea anymore as said above. But three classes hold a little piece of Necromancer identity but none of them are or hold enough for it to matter...Necromancer could 100% work in game, with existing classes as they're without further changes the argument that they can't is ridiculous

  7. #27
    i think a necro would focus on skellies and flesh golems for longer durations/perma pets. while the DK retained ghouls/gargoyles mostly for short term (outside of maybe UH). Necro could also heal via life force based spells, and even a curses but not lock ones. They should get the old DK Brez but instead of a ghoul be a skelli
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  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Honest question; Can you have a Necromancer class that doesn't summon undead minions?
    You could easily make one that just summons spirits and other non corpse stuff but you dont need to. Does using a paladin being able to use holy magic mean 2 priest specs are worthless? Did windwalker monks getting Invoke Xuen, the White Tiger mean hunters could no longer use tigers?

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by ro9ue View Post
    To me it's basically a cosmetic change for Warlock. Much like Codex of Xerrath (Green Fire)...

    A cool story or challenge based quest that rewards you with.... Teachings of Kel'Thuzad (Warlock Only)

    Turns all of your demons into undead minions:
    - Voidwalker -> Skeletal warrior
    - Imp -> Skeletal Mage
    - Succubus -> Skeletal Archer
    - Felhunter -> Skeletal Hound
    - Plus ghosts and ghouls for the others. Mechanically the same, but thematically undead.
    - etc

    Renames your Soulstone to Phylactery for flavor.

    Destruction - Turns your Fire spells into Deathfrost spells. Nether Portal and stuff of the like will instead be Shadowlands portals with spirits.
    Demonology - Turns all your minions into undead minions, like listed above.
    Affliction - Turns anything shadowy into soul magic as found in Drustvar.

    Etc, etc
    If Necromancer doesn't happen, I'm in favor of this concept as a compromise (warlocks use necromancy in the lore, after all); but what would a skeleton archer have in place of Seduction? On top of that, Succubus is a melee minion.

    I'd say a Banshee would fit the role better (what with banshees in Warcraft having a 'charm' theme to them, and all that).

    OT: Demonology would probably receive an overhaul (again) if they go for the more traditional necromancy theme.

    I don't think DK would lose a lot of abilities, to be honest. Death knight and necromancer existing simultaneously is the equivalent of paladins and priests, as far as I'm concerned. (Same theme with some similar abilities, the only difference being melee and ranged, respectively)
    Last edited by Theoris; 2019-10-16 at 02:13 AM.

  10. #30
    Banned Lazuli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lilithvia View Post
    AotD and Apocalypse could easily have model swaps without a actual change, or even be left alone.

    I'm thinking the DPS-summoning spec would have 4-5 minions out at all times, with a couple AotD-esque ultimates in case shit went south of extra DPS was needed; but most abilities would be acted out through the pets.

    the DPS-Support would only have one minion out, and be primarily focused on buffs/debuffs/DOTs. Maybe this would be a good spot for a Val'kyr minion?

    Short-ranged healer necro would be running around generating runic power and shoving bones into people and stitching them up. This spec would have to be highly mobile, as a ten yard range would be on most healing abilities, and might be throwing potions and poisons.

    - - - Updated - - -


    He says it hasn't happened to DKs yet;
    And I had to entirely relearn my bar when Legion prepatch hit.
    Well summoning undead is not exclusive to necromancer, in really any fantasy. Necromancy is an act not some power you're born with, something you choose. its not hard to weave that into lore. Yeah I just re-read that post and realized I'm drunk and flipped the switch on that but whatever my point still stands.

    You may have had to relearn your bar but its still add 1-2 disease and 1-2 rotation. Nothing really changed.

  11. #31
    Merely a Setback Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    You could easily make one that just summons spirits and other non corpse stuff but you dont need to. Does using a paladin being able to use holy magic mean 2 priest specs are worthless? Did windwalker monks getting Invoke Xuen, the White Tiger mean hunters could no longer use tigers?
    Warlocks already summon spirits though.

  12. #32
    Banned Lazuli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Warlocks already summon spirits though.
    That's not all warlocks though, more of a race spiritual thing (you're probably thinking of trolls). Warlock in lore summon demons not spirits and focus on domination not comunion.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Warlocks already summon spirits though.
    You didn't answer my question. And do you realize that Blizzard has employees that go on mmochampion and that by constantly shitting on every class but tinker it probably annoys them so they do everything in their power to keep tinkers from becoming a class.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Theoris View Post
    If Necromancer doesn't happen, I'm in favor of this concept as a compromise (warlocks use necromancy in the lore, after all); but what would a skeleton archer have in place of Seduction? On top of that, Succubus is a melee minion.

    I'd say a Banshee would fit the role better (what with banshees in Warcraft having a 'charm' theme to them, and all that).

    OT: Demonology would probably receive an overhaul (again) if they go for the more traditional necromancy theme.

    I don't think DK would lose a lot of abilities, to be honest. Death knight and necromancer existing simultaneously is the equivalent of paladins and priests, as far as I'm concerned. (Same theme with some similar abilities, the only difference being melee and ranged, respectively)
    Not sure if it being ranged matters, but could just be a like a Skeletal Thief or something. Frozen Arrow / Blind for CC.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    You didn't answer my question. And do you realize that Blizzard has employees that go on mmochampion and that by constantly shitting on every class but tinker it probably annoys them so they do everything in their power to keep tinkers from becoming a class.
    I got a chuckle just now thinking about the thought process in adding Demon Hunters when Teriz was doing the exact same thing before.
    Last edited by Calfredd; 2019-10-16 at 02:20 AM.

  16. #36
    Banned Lilithvia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Warlocks already summon spirits though.
    You doing everything to shit on anything that isn't tinker is unappreciated here.

    You aren't contributing to the thread positively, so please leave.

  17. #37
    Merely a Setback Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    You didn't answer my question. And do you realize that Blizzard has employees that go on mmochampion and that by constantly shitting on every class but tinker it probably annoys them so they do everything in their power to keep tinkers from becoming a class.
    You swapped out one massive overlap for another massive overlap with a concept that makes no sense for a Necromancer, much less a WoW Necromancer.

    But yeah, let's bring up a completely unrelated class into this discussion.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Lilithvia View Post
    Hey, it's Lilithvia here.

    I've been trying to brainstorm ways Necromancer could work, without destroying Warlock or DK as it is.

    I'll post the best ideas here and try to form suggestions into a three spec class, with credits going where credit is due.

    One: Necromancer only needs one mass-summon spec. Let UDKs summon powerful banshees or val'kyr or gargoyles. The necromancer's place is with the ghouls and the zombies and the Abominations and the skeletons.

    Two: Necromancer could fill a unique Support role that we don't see in modern WoW, while fulfilling the DPS or Healer roles.

    Three: Necromancers could be capable of healing by removing broken bones, sewing up wounds, and the like. Necromancer's healing role would be extremely melee based.

    Thoughts as of end of page 1:
    The only idea that i have seen that is different than death Knights and Warlocks is the plague doctor.

  19. #39
    Merely a Setback Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazuli View Post
    That's not all warlocks though, more of a race spiritual thing (you're probably thinking of trolls). Warlock in lore summon demons not spirits and focus on domination not comunion.
    No, I'm talking about abilities period; Haunt, Soul Drain, Soul Harvest, Phantom Singularity, Misery, etc. In order to give Necromancers "spirit" or "ghost" abilities, you're going to have to take them from the Warlock class.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LarryFromHR View Post
    You going out of your way to shit on classes that have a legitimate shot at making it into the game because you REALLY ship tinker has lost its charm

    It's not that you can't see a way for them to be implemented, it's that you WON'T, even when presented with pages upon pages of people that A want whatever class is being discussed and B grasp at as many straws as you do to theorize.
    Pointing out you can't bring a Necromancer into the game without taking abilities from DKs or Warlock is "shitting on the class"?

    Nah.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Pointing out you can't bring a Necromancer into the game without taking abilities from DKs or Warlock is "shitting on the class"?

    Nah.
    Paladin and Priest, Frost Mage and Frost Death Knight, why are these allowed to exist when both occupy a similar space? You act as if this would be the first time 2 classes would share a similar theme even if Unholy devolved into more of a Disease Death Knight.

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