Bolvar as Lich King, and the Cataclysm Schtick

[rhorle]

Trolling? Fire is orange most times man.

Then why are you taking an objection to the usual color of fire being used?

[Archmage Xaxxas]

Is this another 'shit on blizzard' thread? Cause you are literally saying that your stupid idea of why they made him red/fiery, is the same reason as what you thought of when you were a kid. You sure you are still not a kid in mind?

I've seen many threads shitting on blizzard. Shitting for content, story, classes, etc etc etc, even art, and now we got a new way to insult blizzard! Let's project our retarded thoughts to make sense of their decisions, so that we can call them retarded more and more!

You mistake me for someone else. I've never been one to shit on them and I'm still not. That being said, I'm not blind to the nonsense in this world and I actively search for cover ups. Call me paranoid, but don't take it further than that.

- - - Updated - - -

Then why are you taking an objection to the usual color of fire being used?

Over the course of the thread I've understood that it was potentially Frostmourne's Blue coloured Necromantic/Death Magic that influenced the Blue theme for Arthas, and the Death Knights ingame. With Frostmourne shattered, it could make sense that Bolvar's magic is able to inhabit the crown instead.

So will Bolvar's Death Knights have fiery eyes?

[Archmage Xaxxas]

Wait I got it! They made Bolvar fiery to hype Cataclysm, they made green gems in Cataclym to hype Mists of Pandaria, they made Ordos fiery in Mists of Pandaria to hype WoD, and they made the botani green to hint at Legion, and omg they made Legion have an artifact fishing pole to hype Kul Tiras!!!!!!

Well certainly Garrosh for WoD, but but other than that, no. It seems if it was at all the case with Bolvar, they learned their lesson because of how seemingly ridiculous it was.

[Archmage Xaxxas]

Or ya know ... non-existant...

Hopefully!


To keep the discussion on track however, this seemed to be glossed over on the first page:
https://www.wowhead.com/news=295682/...adveNZSm1vkr0w

Evidence that going forward in some cases, Lich King related shenanigans will be in fiery orange and red.

[fikcrim]

I should be very clear I know the lore reasons. I'm talking about the human decision making in finalizing those lore facts. Blizzard's always been good at explaining things away. I'm trying to peel the curtain back here because I haven't been buying it.

That means they decided to make the red dragons connected to the element of life, so they could burn up Bolvar in the Wrathgate, so he could be a "fiery" Lich King a year later, all because the expansion after that has dragons who breathe fire.

That must mean they've set this up from WC2 when they came up with the dragon lore.

Does that seem likely? And for what? You think more people bought Cataclysm because the dude in the last raid's cinematic had fiery eyes?

[Archmage Xaxxas]

That means they decided to make the red dragons connected to the element of life, so they could burn up Bolvar in the Wrathgate, so he could be a "fiery" Lich King a year later, all because the expansion after that has dragons who breathe fire.

That must mean they've set this up from WC2 when they came up with the dragon lore.

Does that seem likely? And for what? You think more people bought Cataclysm because the dude in the last raid's cinematic had fiery eyes?

Hey if that helps you sleep but no.

If Bolvar isn't the first Undead via Red Dragon Fire then obviously I'd be missing a key point that sets that up to be possible. Was that in WC2?

[Oneirophobia]

OKAY we can actually put a cork in this thread I guess..

2 minutes ago WoWhead shared new Death Knight Ebon Blade Swords https://www.wowhead.com/news=295682/...adveNZSm1vkr0w

They're fiery too. Woo!

Okay, and this isn't a marketing ploy for a fiery expansion this time, because? Going by your logic, anyway.

[fikcrim]

Hey if that helps you sleep but no.

If Bolvar isn't the first Undead via Red Dragon Fire then obviously I'd be missing a key point that sets that up to be possible. Was that in WC2?

I'm talking about the introduction and establishment of the dragonflights and their powers.

[BananaHandsB]

Or are all of you perfectly understanding of why he's fiery? Because I really really suspect it was a marketing ploy, and they didn't plan on doing anything with Bolvar or the LK again back then.

They obviously left it open as a potential plot device...I'm really not sure what you're getting at. Did you seriously think the lich king would forever sit in a block of ice in ice crown? I didn't think it could be more obvious that Bolvar taking the crown was only a temporary solution to the lich/undead problem.

[Archmage Xaxxas]

Okay, and this isn't a marketing ploy for a fiery expansion this time, because? Going by your logic, anyway.

Well for one, Cataclysm isn't in the making. However it's clear that they're going forward with the idea whether it was a mistake or not- which I take it they've continued to find clever ways to make it all work.

I'm talking about the introduction and establishment of the dragonflights and their powers.

So you can negate any real discussion. I know.

They obviously left it open as a potential plot device...I'm really not sure what you're getting at. Did you seriously think the lich king would forever sit in a block of ice in ice crown? I didn't think it could be more obvious that Bolvar taking the crown was only a temporary solution to the lich/undead problem.

Actually I'd expect Flaming Bolvar to be actually quite unable to sit inside of a block of ice as it would melt, and I've felt that was reasonable to point out since day 1.
Jokes aside, I'm really not sure that at the time, Blizzard had any concrete ideas as to what they wanted the longterm future of the Lich King to look like, and were probably quite satisfied with Bolvar being the "Jailor of the Damned" "forevermore" as Bolvar says himself.

[fikcrim]

So you can negate any real discussion. I know.

You're the one not giving proper responses.

[rhorle]

Actually I'd expect Flaming Bolvar to be actually quite unable to sit inside of a block of ice as it would melt, and I've felt that was reasonable to point out since day 1.

The same reason why he didn't burn up. Magic. It is reasonable to point that out just as much as it was reasonable for you to be upset that blizzard made fire orange. In other words not reasonable at all.

[Archmage Xaxxas]

You're the one not giving proper responses.

I asked you a question to confirm if I was wrong or not. Don't even go there, I'm giving you the stage to tell me if Bolvar is the first and only case of Undead Resurrection via Red Dragonflame or not.

Because if he is, then yes it kind of matter for the sake of this discussion. However if they established that in the lore with WC2 then boo hoo to me right

[fikcrim]

I honestly have no idea what you want from me.

[Imurbandaid]

Omg guys he is right, and it goes much deeper! Alexstrasza only did a fire cone on wrathgate to sell more copies for deathwing shooting flames across whole zones. There is no other reason for her to even be there. Alexstrasza (dragon like deathwing) shoots fire across wrathgate (like deathwing) and Bolvar is orange and fiery MUCH WOW blizzard did it all to sell cataclysm copies. /s

But seriously, wrathgate quests were made and tested long before Cata, so Bolvar getting flamed was planned long before cata. What would OP possibly want a body that just got flames of the life-binder blown across it to really look like? I've really read it all.

You ask if you were right as a child, OP. Well you were wrong, and to even still think it as an adult means you are actually more childish than when you were nine, good day.

[rhorle]

I asked you a question to confirm if I was wrong or not. Don't even go there, I'm giving you the stage to tell me if Bolvar is the first and only case of Undead Resurrection via Red Dragonflame or not.

Who says he is undead? Instead of the life-binders flames killing him it preserved his charred body and kept him alive. This is not the first instance of the life-binder having the power of life/preservation. You are asking them to prove a loaded question and acting as if it proves a point of yours. It doesn't.

It doesn't matter for the sake of your discussion. Because you called blizzard poor for making fire look like fire. There is no real discussion here. This is more of a blog post then something to discuss.

[Evaddon]

Mate...they literally put him on ice again to use later, Blizzard tends to set up things and threads and leave them dangling for later story telling rather good or bad, they've done this since Warcraft 3.

The fire was, and always has been because of the Red Dragonflight...rather this is what kept him strong enough to endure the scourges torture before accepting the Helm of Damnation,or just kept him in his state of undeath isn't fully clear but it can be theorized. But no they didn't make him fiery beacause of the Cataclysm which he had zero part in

[Skirdus]

I'm pretty sure it was just a coincidence that Bolvar and Deathwing were aesthetically similar in nature

[Mirishka]

So when Fall of the Lich King came out, I'm pretty sure I was 9 years old, nearly 10 that month.
I'm including that because I felt back then even as a kid I could see through BS here and there where it mattered to me, and WoW mattered a lot.

*snip*

Or are all of you perfectly understanding of why he's fiery? Because I really really suspect it was a marketing ploy, and they didn't plan on doing anything with Bolvar or the LK again back then.

"hur hur he is fiery cuz marketing not cuz he was burned by dragon fire"

Were you always this good at creating pointless topics, or did you have to work at it?

[Rhaide]

Ner'Zhul is basically no more - in the book "Arthas", Arthas has a dream/astral projection-y scene where he destroys Ner'Zhul and claims the Helm of Domination as his own. It is still tainted with demonic energy, but the old rules are gone.

No reason it can't glow another color. I don't remember the power being described as 'blue light'.