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  1. #61
    Could be work in progress. I don’t think “classes reworked” would be an announcement in the trailer. Only time will tell I suppose.

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by probert View Post
    Diablo 3 sold 16 million copies, but mainly on the back of the legendary status of Diablo 2 + Blizzard's reputation (and being ported to every platform under the sun).

    Diablo 4 looks much more interesting, and closer to the original 2 games than what Diablo 3 turned into. Its safe to say that while Diablo 3 is a decent game with high production quality, its staying power was low and it wasn't in line with the rest of the series. Given what we saw in the trailer for D4, they took the criticism to heart -- its more mature/dark/grim/violent, they fixed the art design and color palette, and have at least acknowledged the progression and mechanics problems D3 had.

    Save yourself the $20-40 and just play Path of Exile until Diablo 4 launches. My $0.02.
    PoE is a great game, one I've played since its closed beta.

    Sadly, Tencent has bought out GGG (80% now, 20% over the course of a few years). Thus, there are now two major concerns with POE.
    1) How long until Tencent essentially takes over control and leads development to likely disappointment and/or changes MTX to be more game-impacting to push sales.
    2) Playing it is supporting Tencent, a chinese company who helped design and implement China's absurd social credit system, not to mention other more recent concerns in China.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by letgoit View Post
    Blizzard isn’t reading your MMO-champ forum diatribe. You’re ranting into the void, buddy.
    You are definitely incorrect regarding that, Blizzard reads many posts from both reddits and major forums, especially ones which garner a lot of attention. Hell, they even stated during Blizzcon that they'd love for people to post constructive criticism for them to take into consideration.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Alcsaar View Post
    long?
    My man, you seem to be having an issue thats shared by small minority. You seem to be fed up with wow so much that you nitpick and try to find negative stuff about anything they announce. Huge amount of people is eagerly awaiting shadowlands, and it feels far from a maintenance exp. What I would suggest to you is to take a break from everything wow related, including forums and all talk about it for at least a month. After you come back, I can promise you that you will see Shadowlands for what it is - a badass exp that, if delivers as shown, will be one of the best, if not the best one to date.

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by ping-pong View Post
    My man, you seem to be having an issue thats shared by small minority. You seem to be fed up with wow so much that you nitpick and try to find negative stuff about anything they announce. Huge amount of people is eagerly awaiting shadowlands, and it feels far from a maintenance exp. What I would suggest to you is to take a break from everything wow related, including forums and all talk about it for at least a month. After you come back, I can promise you that you will see Shadowlands for what it is - a badass exp that, if delivers as shown, will be one of the best, if not the best one to date.
    I guess if I'm overly critical of Blizzard, you must be the opposite end of the spectrum: overly confident.

    I haven't played WoW or frequented the subs in 5 months. Even before that I really didn't frequent the forums. I DID take a break, and this is what I came back to and concluded.

    What exactly is making you so excited about Shadowlands?

    There is only one new major mechanic that we potentially haven't seen before, the tower. Everything else is typical and expected (new zones, quests, etc.).

  5. #65
    lack of new race is fine. we've needed customization overhaul for original races for a long time.

    no class. kind of disappointing but having my main feel like a paladin again might be worth the sacrifice.

    i think the endless tower could be a lot of fun if it's done right. the islands and warfronts were huge flops in BFA so i'm kind of glad they aren't wasting time on more "chore" content.

  6. #66
    OP, I feel you brother but I feel that Shadowlands has lots of room to surprise me. I feel better about this expansion than I did for the BfA reveal. A faction war never interested me... however, another plane... that's kinda cool to explore.
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    No fucking way. The worst idea since democracy.

  7. #67
    Elemental Lord Makabreska's Avatar
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    Aw geeez, so now it's "maintenance", instead of "filler"?
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Alcsaar View Post
    The longer posts is constructive criticism in hopes that Blizzard takes concerns into consideration when they're developing, as they've promised that they will. I WANT to play the game, which is why I created the post. The post isn't to bash the game because I don't like how its shaping up, its essentially a plea to them to make changes that will interest me and any others who agree with my concerns.

    Just because I haven't played the game in 5 months because I don't like it doesn't mean I don't still have interest and hopes that it will pull me back in.
    But you and other people are not considering someone like me that wants this expansion as it is. You might not agree with being a "maintenance" expansion and what they provide you this expansion, but they are the ones doing all the work. You can do all criticism you want ofc, but who actually works in it, and have all the work ain't you and you end up disregarding others that likes it. I wanted changes and i want them on a new expansion instead of bfa, that i actually want bfa to just end already.

    That's all i think, i think i feel all the criticism even well constructed as yours, just makes others feel underwhelmed by how bad the expansion has been welcomed, and tbh i like what they are offering in this expansion. Is it really necessary? No, but i know it's your hopes to change what you (and i know you're not alone) want, but there's also people that agrees with me that the expansion seems really good. Why don't we just wait and play it? And let them finish the content, that seems they still have loads of stuff in the works.

    Only complaint i have to do the most, is that they had no word on GCD's. That is something that literally almost everyone claimed to never ask for it or wanting it in the game.

    Don't get me wrong, i don't mind reading good texts and constructive criticism. And i enjoy yours, but when i hit the part reading "boring", i felt like i was reading another complain and i just felt the same thing i have been feeling on the forum so much that is, people seems like lost souls, on forums trying to make the game fun for them to play but not wanting to play, and basically making everyone stunned and not letting them appreciate the game. Not saying it's the case, but look in this way, maybe this is the first step for them to actually make it right in the future, if you forbid them to work, and make them feel they are not good enough to make those changes that people so want, because they will always feel they failed the community. All i'm saying is, i don't mind this, but it gets too much sometimes.

  9. #69
    Mechagnome Akta's Avatar
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    I think shadowland will be a nice surprise. There aren't new pointless features just for the sake of doing something new, they are in a point they have to rework and reorder what we already have. Shadowland will fix what we miss at the core.
    ...Le Poète est semblable au prince des nuées
    Qui hante la tempête e se rit de l'archer;
    Exilé sul le sol au milieu des huées,
    Ses ailes de géant l'empêchent de marcher.

    Charles Baudelaire

  10. #70
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    There are 10 or so ranged DPS specs already in the game. I don't see that adding another is going to bring anything unique to the basic mechanics of:

    • Stand out from the fight a ways.
    • Cast a spell. Shoot something or blow something up.
    • Cause damage.

    This is part of the problem. There are too many specs. Too many classes already. You can add new classes but essentially all they are are new skins on what already exists with different visual effects and renamed abilities. Are you really onboard for saying that adding that is what it takes to not be a maintenance expansion?

    Why on earth do you imagine that classes/specs get broken to start with? There's too many of them to effectively manage. I don't think that Blizzard can go back but I don't see much point in them going forward and adding on to the pile either.
    "...money's most powerful ability is to allow bad people to continue doing bad things at the expense of those who don't have it."

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Shakana View Post
    But you and other people are not considering someone like me that wants this expansion as it is. You might not agree with being a "maintenance" expansion and what they provide you this expansion, but they are the ones doing all the work. You can do all criticism you want ofc, but who actually works in it, and have all the work ain't you and you end up disregarding others that likes it. I wanted changes and i want them on a new expansion instead of bfa, that i actually want bfa to just end already.

    That's all i think, i think i feel all the criticism even well constructed as yours, just makes others feel underwhelmed by how bad the expansion has been welcomed, and tbh i like what they are offering in this expansion. Is it really necessary? No, but i know it's your hopes to change what you (and i know you're not alone) want, but there's also people that agrees with me that the expansion seems really good. Why don't we just wait and play it? And let them finish the content, that seems they still have loads of stuff in the works.

    Only complaint i have to do the most, is that they had no word on GCD's. That is something that literally almost everyone claimed to never ask for it or wanting it in the game.

    Don't get me wrong, i don't mind reading good texts and constructive criticism. And i enjoy yours, but when i hit the part reading "boring", i felt like i was reading another complain and i just felt the same thing i have been feeling on the forum so much that is, people seems like lost souls, on forums trying to make the game fun for them to play but not wanting to play, and basically making everyone stunned and not letting them appreciate the game. Not saying it's the case, but look in this way, maybe this is the first step for them to actually make it right in the future, if you forbid them to work, and make them feel they are not good enough to make those changes that people so want, because they will always feel they failed the community. All i'm saying is, i don't mind this, but it gets too much sometimes.
    See, I keep hearing people like yourself post about how they're happy with the expansion, but not what you are happy with. Classes got some old abilities back but are otherwise completely unchanged. Classes that arguably have felt terrible since Legion.

    I posted about what I don't like, but no one posting about liking the expansion are actually posting about what they DO like, just seems like a hollow retort. Some things are interesting in the expansion, like targeted legendary crafting, multiple choices from the weekly chests, the leveling experience, the tower (potentially) - but this is all content that you first have to have an enjoyable class to experience it through, and right now I don't feel like thats the case with a lot of classes.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Bennett View Post
    What would you rather have - them slapping more flashing lights onto a crumbling foundation - or fixing the foundations from the ground up? Everything about Shadowlands is telling me they have BIG plans for WoW in the future. I feel really good about the game's future
    My attitude exactly. Shadowlands seems to be trying to shore up major existing game issues like original races feeling lacking next to allied races, too much focus on spec over class identity, player agency in general.

    Basically we being offered an expansion of game breadth instead of depth and that sits fine with me and leads to a more lasting experience.
    “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”

    Quote Originally Posted by BatteredRose View Post
    They're greedy soulless monsters for not handing me everything for my 15 moneys a month!

  13. #73
    Spam Assassin! MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    Aw geeez, so now it's "maintenance", instead of "filler"?
    Jargon and catch phrases must evolve.
    "...money's most powerful ability is to allow bad people to continue doing bad things at the expense of those who don't have it."

  14. #74
    Elemental Lord Makabreska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    Jargon and catch phrases must evolve.
    "Filler" got ridiculed hard enough, so they needed a new phrase to label anything they don't like.
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    There are 10 or so ranged DPS specs already in the game. I don't see that adding another is going to bring anything unique to the basic mechanics of:

    • Stand out from the fight a ways.
    • Cast a spell. Shoot something or blow something up.
    • Cause damage.

    This is part of the problem. There are too many specs. Too many classes already. You can add new classes but essentially all they are are new skins on what already exists with different visual effects and renamed abilities. Are you really onboard for saying that adding that is what it takes to not be a maintenance expansion?

    Why on earth do you imagine that classes/specs get broken to start with? There's too many of them to effectively manage. I don't think that Blizzard can go back but I don't see much point in them going forward and adding on to the pile either.
    This is very closed-minded thinking. You're right if you think that that is all a ranged class is that there is no room for anymore. Just like every melee is auto attack the boss and press XYZ buttons.

    What you don't see is the capability to add game-changing mechanics to new classes. DHs got a small taste of that with something as simple as double jump.

    Lets take a necromancer class for example. You could implement a class that is totally reliant on its pets to accomplish anything. You don't even really cast anything yourself, you instead channel it through your pets. These are mechanical changes that make the class more than just "Stand 30 yds away and cast XYZ spells"

    Though I don't think a tinker fits thematically at all with this expac and so shouldn't happen, a tinker also has a lot of room for new mechanic introduction. A turret system for dps or healing or whatever. Throwable bombs that have varying effects similar to traps but with more direct impacts (a bomb that heals all friendlies in its radious on impact, for example).

    These are mechanical changes that separate these classes from all the other classes from Vanilla, which yes, are very "similar" to each other given the limited scope of development that was available for Vanilla WoW at the time.
    Last edited by Alcsaar; 2019-11-04 at 07:14 PM.

  16. #76
    Just came here to agree. The lore is pretty much lost at this point and they don't seem to doing great work on the classes either. No word about PvP vendors as well. At least I can transmog Shadowmourne on my Frost Dk that can't use 2h weapons now.

  17. #77
    I read they were considering whether or not alts could unlock the other Covenant transmogs, or if the transmogs would be locked to the character that earned them. If they lock them, that will seriously impede my care about the expansion. I play mostly for collectibles these days, and if I can't go earn the other stuff later on, whether on my main or on alts for account-wide unlock, I'll just not bother.

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Bennett View Post
    To me, the people mad about Shadowlands just aren't thinking long term.

    I would be more worried if they were adding a new class, and doing nothing to address the problems the game has - people calling this expansion lazy or a cash grab feels really backwards to me. This expansion feels like them taking a real risk and trying to bring WoW into the next decade, and I really hope it works
    Is it impossible to do both?

    Let me sum up the criticism of Shadowlands - reverting mistakes isnt a hook for an expansion. You may or may not agree with it, but that is the criticism.

  19. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    Just came here to agree. The lore is pretty much lost at this point and they don't seem to doing great work on the classes either. No word about PvP vendors as well. At least I can transmog Shadowmourne on my Frost Dk that can't use 2h weapons now.
    hey, theres always forums to post about the game you dont like. cheer up.

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Gloriandus View Post
    I read they were considering whether or not alts could unlock the other Covenant transmogs, or if the transmogs would be locked to the character that earned them. If they lock them, that will seriously impede my care about the expansion. I play mostly for collectibles these days, and if I can't go earn the other stuff later on, whether on my main or on alts for account-wide unlock, I'll just not bother.
    Exactly this.

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