View Poll Results: If you are currently unsubscribed from WoW, will you return to WoW: Shadowlands?

Voters
428. This poll is closed
  • Yes!

    145 33.88%
  • No!

    148 34.58%
  • Maybe? Not enough info

    135 31.54%
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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Kalistez View Post
    At this stage the only things that would get me to resub would be the removal of all Void related crap for Spriests, or a paid class change.
    I mean, a character boost is basically a class change; unless you are literally a 1/10,000 skill pvp player or you're absolutely adamant about not grinding old and worthless reputations a second time, everything is account wide now.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Craaazyyy View Post
    depends on how massive the unpruning is and on changes to loot system

    again i'm still subbed, but for Classic ofc
    There was never any mention of changing the loot systems? It's still all RNG; the only difference is that the M+ weekly chest won't pull from the ENTIRE pool of dungeon loot and seems like it will only drop things from the dungeon(s) you actually cleared that week.
    Cheerful lack of self-preservation

  2. #142
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    No. I don't like the Warlords/Legion/BfA flight model. However, for as long as it remains fun, I will stick to the classic server, so Blizzard at least will get my subscription.

    I still might buy Legion though. I kinda wanna do pet battle dungeons.
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  3. #143
    Need more info.

    Waiting to see how the un-prune goes and the Class > Spec focus.
    Secondly, waiting to see how the gearing system changes (if at all).

    Lastly, I absolutely despise Pathfinder and am at a loss for words they've decided to stick with it. As much I prefer flying, I'd actually rather NO flying over Pathfinder.

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by Nefarious Tea View Post
    I mean, a character boost is basically a class change; unless you are literally a 1/10,000 skill pvp player or you're absolutely adamant about not grinding old and worthless reputations a second time, everything is account wide now.

    - - - Updated - - -



    There was never any mention of changing the loot systems? It's still all RNG; the only difference is that the M+ weekly chest won't pull from the ENTIRE pool of dungeon loot and seems like it will only drop things from the dungeon(s) you actually cleared that week.
    they did mention that they're not sure about stuff like titanforging potentially being removed etc., they will also look at how their 8.3 corruption system will pan out

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Craaazyyy View Post
    they did mention that they're not sure about stuff like titanforging potentially being removed etc., they will also look at how their 8.3 corruption system will pan out
    Oh yeah fair. Titanforging is stupid. I like the OG +5ilvl warforging from Mists, though. It was nice to get a bonus like, ooh five ilvls! yay!
    Cheerful lack of self-preservation

  6. #146
    Wow, the poll thus far is almost equally split three ways. Interesting.

    Did anyone change their mind after the deep dive panel?

    Personally, nothing has grabbed my attention and confirmed a resub. At the moment I think it will be reliant on 'social' factors - do I have enough free time, do a lot of friends play etc.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Dakara View Post
    Lastly, I absolutely despise Pathfinder and am at a loss for words they've decided to stick with it. As much I prefer flying, I'd actually rather NO flying over Pathfinder.
    Yes I 100% agree. Pathfinder is atrocious, but it is just a way to keep people subbed and playing during an expansion that has little else to offer. I actually ground out the rep recently (despise Mechagon aesthetic too) and almost as soon as I completed it, I just stopped playing. I flew about the map for maybe 30 mins? But as soon as my 'goal' had gone, I stopped.

    I quizzed a friend about it. Their answer was 'flying is great for completing WQ's faster'. I think that answer sums up what BfA is.

  7. #147
    Yes, I'm considering skipping 8.3 but coming back for Shadowlands. No Sisyphean AP grind, less RNG, another pass for professions and classes, some form of solo progression content for when your friends aren't around, 4 "campaigns" so first 3 alts won't feel boring as fuck, seems like a good perspective.

    Didn't preorder so far, would rather get more info what are they planning with classes, and obviously there's the looming problem of faction imbalance in my region.

    However pretty stoked for the revamp of character creation and lots of new options and sub-races instead of new class / race that just distracts you from your main.

  8. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    Neither you or I are involved. We are bystanders. I used the term to describe the actual people directly connected to the situation: Blizzard, China, Blitzchung, the casters.
    That is something for those parties and people involved to solve, and not for any of us to solve or deal with.

    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    Where did I ever say that Blizzard didn't have the right to enforce their TOS and rules?

    There is a difference between what's legal, and what's moral. My view on the situation is that Blizzard was too harsh, and the reasons behind that harshness were motivated for all the wrong reasons. Because of that, and because of other actions they've taken in the past few years, it's established a patter of behavior that I don't want to support by buying their products.
    That you decided to stop buying their games because of other reasons is all fine.

    However, you do not even have a single idea why they acted the way they did. it is all speculation.
    And for most of the people currently boycotting Blizzard they are just not being objective.

    None of us knows exactly what went on into deciding the punishment.
    And thats once again were the TOS / T&Cs of the HS event come into play.

    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    Maybe you haven't looked deep enough into their actions. Maybe you don't care. Maybe you just want to sit down and have fun without worrying about any of this stuff(although that seems odd since you're grilling me about my decision, implying that you DO care about this issue). I don't know what your situation is, but I'm letting you and these forums know that I, and others who are also boycotting Blizzard, don't approve of how they've handled themselves.
    Well, if you read my earlier post properly, which you quoted a lot of stuff out right now:

    I do think they made some huge mistakes into handling the incident. Although i did my research and checked upon what were their options.

    Banning him and taking away his prize money was one of them, same goes for the caster part of it.

    Do i agree? It was way too harsh and should have been handled differently.
    Although they acted in ''the heat'' of the moment where as you and i could take a proper read through the of the events and make up our own opinion about it.
    Under such circumstances you can make bad decisions. Think we have all been there.

    So i cant stress this enough: Blitzchung KNEW he was taking a huge risk by following through with his actions.

    Do i care enough to boycot them? No not at all, since i still think they were right to act and they used a too harsh of a punishment but it was simply stated in the ToS / T&Cs that such a harsh punishment was able to be granted if you would break said T&Cs.


    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    I didn't say Blizzard should have done nothing. Please don't misunderstand or misrepresent me. All I'm saying is that Blizzard's response was too harsh, and too motivated by the wrong reasons.
    You never said that, thats correct however thats the other side of the discussion, IF they wouldnt have acted.

    Its the same about the whole Xpac discussion: if you dont get enough features they cant do a proper job, and if you get too much features its also a wrong move.


    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    The entertainment industry exists to make money. And any corporation that operates at the level that blizzard does MUST be aware of politics, and in fact that's what this entire situation is about: China using money to enforce their politics, and Blizzard choosing to sacrifice their reputation by chasing that money.
    Your source for this final piece of information?

    I would like to refer you to the earlier part in this message about making decisions and why Blizzard acted like they did. We both dont have any clue at all.

    So you dont get to decide on this topic if they acted outside of legal boundaries or even acted to get money from China for their games.

    Big companies have to deal with politics(due to licensing / support / whatever else), i get that. However politics shouldnt be practiced in a game tournament by players or casters.

    Down the line it all boils down to this:

    This whole HS / HK thing happened and people cant stop talking about it.
    Whatever thread you open right now on MMO-Champ there are multiple responses like: i wont do X because of HK. and the list goes on.

    TLDR: We got it, you dont like the decision that was made, lets talk about the game / games or topics that are being discussed in said threads instead of dredging up old cows and keep on yelling how they should have acted differently.
    Last edited by Augusta138; 2019-11-04 at 04:05 AM.

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by kieraTM View Post
    Hello!

    This is aimed at people who are, for whatever reason, currently unsubscribed from WoW.

    As a currently unsubscribed player, will you return to WoW: Shadowlands? Please tell us why/why not?
    The day blizz releases two classes at the same time, that would bring back most of their subs i think.
    The hunter hoe with the least beloe.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by Augusta138 View Post
    TLDR: We got it, you dont like the decision that was made, lets talk about the game / games or topics that are being discussed in said threads instead of dredging up old cows and keep on yelling how they should have acted differently.[/U]
    FFS man, I'm not yelling, this isn't an old issue, and I'm not saying they should have acted differently(although they should have now that you bring it up). I'm saying that because of the way they've acted, I'm not going to support them until they show a different pattern of behavior.

    Blizzard has been shit for quite some time now. Everything from laying off 8% of their employees followed by reporting a record quarter for earnings, tax evasion, misleading their customers about how tournaments are funded, banning Blitzchung, and a host of other things.

    I'm not going to do your research for you. If I hand you the answers it won't mean anything. Just do some google searches on those topics and decide for yourself. If you want to talk about other things and ignore these issues, by all means go do that. But don't try to convince me to do the same. Shutting up about these topics is the surest way to guarantee they keep happening. Meanwhile vocal outcry and criticism of them caused US senators and congress members to write a public letter to Blizzard, and got Brack to publicly apologize and make a statement about the situation promising to do better.

    So no, I'm not just going to roll over and move on. Not until I see a repeated pattern of behavior that proves they've actually cleaned up their act. And quite frankly, if you care at all about getting quality games instead of the entire market turning into a predatory dumpster fire of mobile games that sacrifice everything to hunt super-whales, you'll do the same.
    Last edited by SirCowdog; 2019-11-04 at 05:21 AM.

  11. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    FFS man, I'm not yelling, this isn't an old issue, and I'm not saying they should have acted differently(although they should have now that you bring it up). I'm saying that because of the way they've acted, I'm not going to support them until they show a different pattern of behavior.

    Blizzard has been shit for quite some time now. Everything from laying off 8% of their employees followed by reporting a record quarter for earnings, tax evasion, misleading their customers about how tournaments are funded, banning Blitzchung, and a host of other things.

    I'm not going to do your research for you. If I hand you the answers it won't mean anything. Just do some google searches on those topics and decide for yourself. If you want to talk about other things and ignore these issues, by all means go do that. But don't try to convince me to do the same. Shutting up about these topics is the surest way to guarantee they keep happening. Meanwhile vocal outcry and criticism of them caused US senators and congress members to write a public letter to Blizzard, and got Brack to publicly apologize and make a statement about the situation promising to do better.

    So no, I'm not just going to roll over and move on. Not until I see a repeated pattern of behavior that proves they've actually cleaned up their act. And quite frankly, if you care at all about getting quality games instead of the entire market turning into a predatory dumpster fire of mobile games that sacrifice everything to hunt super-whales, you'll do the same.
    Do all of us a favor then, leave the forums and return once all of the above happened so you can talk once again about the games being discussed here instead of repeating it over and over.

    Also, i dont need you to do research for me. I am 100% capable of that myself and i know about the things that happened.

    For everything you mention as a reason is a business decision behind it, you deciding not to buy a game or stop supporting the company anymore because of simple and plain business decisions (laying off staff / etc etc) will only increase the amount of people being laid off down the line.

    I am fine with you quitting and all others for the obvious reasons you state and other keep stating in all posts everywhere in this forum, but we know you disagree with Blizzard and the way they run their business.

    Let it be, quit, stop supporting whatever is related to Blizzard and leave the forums.

    And find a game to play where staff doesnt get laid off when earnings or revenue go badly. (Spoiler: you wont find any)
    Reporting massive earnings just after letting staff off is also not a weird thing, since staff is 70% of your costs in a business.

    I surely wont miss you on these forums and none will miss you in any game.

    Also i dont need you to tell me that i will do the same for the sake of a game you dont deem good enough anymore because you dislike the decisions made by a company.

    So i guess you also dont get Starbucks Coffee then? Since they mastered the art and craft of tax evasion.
    95% of their products needed to brew coffee / coffee cups etc are being either sold or ''licensed'' to their own company but within another country.

    Tax evasion is a thing till we change the rules in the 5 major countries (which the netherlands sadly is a part off)
    Last edited by Augusta138; 2019-11-04 at 05:35 AM.

  12. #152
    Unsubbed, don't plan to come back right now. Expansion looks pretty bad to be honest.

    That being said I'm open to being proven wrong. I'd like to like WoW again, but I just don't right now.

  13. #153
    I'm subbed for classic, but if they fix class design and make gearing better I can consider returning. The theme seems pretty good tbh.

  14. #154
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    It's going to heavily depend on what happens with Allied Race unlocks to be honest. I missed the majority of Legion, including Argus. I want to one day play Argus, I think I'll enjoy the story. What I didn't want to do was come back in BFA with an express desire to level a Void Elf and then have to fuck around in Argus on an alt for two weeks. Stupid system.
    Knowledge is power, and power corrupts. So study hard and be evil.

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by Wingspan View Post
    To its credit, there has been plenty of innovation in WoW... it just does not tend to be the innovation that people want though.

    Until we get a significant technology advance though, I don’t really think anyone is going to come up with any real industry-changing innovations... otherwise SOMEONE would have come up with something by now (even if it was by a competitor). MMORPG design has been pretty stagnant for a decade.
    What innovations you mean? Group tech? LFR/LFG, crossrealm, flexible raids etc? It was taken from other mmos afaik. For sure it's an innovation for wow, but the last one (flex raids) happened 6 years ago.

    I wonder why they don't do the quest choice route tbh. It would perfectly fit Shadowlands. Your quest deeds determine your covenant. Were you a good boy? Didn't just walk up to that guy and mercilessly slaughtered him, but tried to talk sense to him (first)? Go to Kyrian. Bad boys (terminator style killing machines) go to the Venthyr. And others in between. Smarter NPCs (from islands) could be a norm as well maybe in the more difficult areas. It would give these factions more depth, meaning, difference. Of course it would mean that some part of the questing experience would have 4 routes and outcomes...

    It's kind of worrying that even the casual endgame experience can't be about outdoor stuff, yeah surely we need one more endlessly repeatable instanced content, who doesn't like to go from one crammed dark instance to another one.

    Your mounts could learn abilities instead of the equipped shit. Horses (forsaken ones too) could learn a short sprint, kodos(? ) and goats climbing/jumping rocks, some of them to jump longer. You could have one mount out in the world following you and mounting it could be an actual animation (instead of mere cast time). When you go afk your mount could go graze nearby or hunt critters (sabercats, raptors) (maybe disable this in cities and rated bgs and arenas). ETC.
    Last edited by Lei; 2019-11-04 at 06:22 AM.

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Beatman View Post
    Less randomized loot
    Relevant profession gear with stats you can choose
    Ability unpruning
    Class fantasy > spec fantasy
    Admitting fuckups (ability pruning, sockets on benthic gear etc.)

    Looks pretty ground-breaking to me.
    So one, by one.

    1. Less randomized loot is not groundbreaking. Random loot has never been a problem until devs decided to make profession items have random secondaries for no reason at all. And the solution isn't exactly great either, not to mention profession gear will never remain relevant for long. As for the weekly chest, it's a good change overall, but again, it's one item a week. Far from ground-breaking or game-changing. Not to mention it presents a few problems - you will feel pigeon-holed into specific dungeon(s). What if you get a key for a different one? It will feel like a chore to go through it, especially if it's a high level one.
    2. Relevant? They said they want to make it relevant, but for now offered no real solutions, only said how they wish it'd work. I've heard that for the past 10 years.
    3. This one is fine, but it's done for the sake of hype-building and will be done to the most missed skills, not the ones that make most sense, i.e. the Eyes of the Beast. No new skills were confirmed either so... Great, we're back in MoP, 6-7 years ago. Feels good to know that half of game's lifetime has been a waste for class-design.
    4. That's not ground-breaking. I personally couldn't care less about my class fantasy in WoW. They are all limited anyway.
    5. They admit fuck-ups every patch and every Blizzcon and then they proceed to make the same fuck-ups...

    And as a bonus, 6. Connecting legendaries to professions will force everybody into professions. I hate WoW professions, I hate professions in general. They are fantasy-breaking to me.

    So I guess there are two ground-breaking changes (weekly chest and legendaries), but both are changes for worse. Again forcing players to do shit they may not want to do. The entire profession system is boring as hell, but they want to relate a huge chunk of player's power to it. WoW used have much more freedom and much more sandboxy feel. It's been lost long ago and devs seem hellbent on not bringing it back...
    Last edited by Huggykaze; 2019-11-04 at 06:28 AM.

  17. #157
    The game takes too much "dedicated" time. That means blocks of time whuch are scheduled and can't be interrupted by family.

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by hulkgor View Post
    Sure, steadily declines, for the past 10-11 years.

    BFA still broke the record for most day 1 sales. Go figure.

    The issue is that mmo-c is a cesspool for whiners and bashers that feel the need to trash everything about the game, like it's 'what the cool kids do', and they all end up with the same sort of 'ill not buy it', "im quitting for good", bla bla... yet you all buy the game and play day 1, helping the game you seem to hate to prosper.

    It's just laughable really.

    But hey, keep on being edgy.
    Uh ironically MMOC hates on this game less than the official WoW forums, which is far worse.

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    Reverse the ban on Blitzchung, the college team, and the casters.
    Remove/Rework Pathfinder.


    That's what it's going to take for me to resub or buy Shadowlands.

    I MIGHT resub for Classic TBC if Blitzchung's ban is removed. It remains to be seen if Blizzard screws up again in the meantime.
    Pathfinder is so damn terrible. I would rather pay 5000g a year and a half into the expansion rather do some terribly designed achievement.

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Lei View Post
    What innovations you mean? Group tech? LFR/LFG, crossrealm, flexible raids etc? It was taken from other mmos afaik. For sure it's an innovation for wow, but the last one (flex raids) happened 6 years ago.

    I wonder why they don't do the quest choice route tbh. It would perfectly fit Shadowlands. Your quest deeds determine your covenant. Were you a good boy? Didn't just walk up to that guy and mercilessly slaughtered him, but tried to talk sense to him (first)? Go to Kyrian. Bad boys (terminator style killing machines) go to the Venthyr. And others in between. Smarter NPCs (from islands) could be a norm as well maybe in the more difficult areas. It would give these factions more depth, meaning, difference. Of course it would mean that some part of the questing experience would have 4 routes and outcomes...

    It's kind of worrying that even the casual endgame experience can't be about outdoor stuff, yeah surely we need one more endlessly repeatable instanced content, who doesn't like to go from one crammed dark instance to another one.

    Your mounts could learn abilities instead of the equipped shit. Horses (forsaken ones too) could learn a short sprint, kodos(? ) and goats climbing/jumping rocks, some of them to jump longer. You could have one mount out in the world following you and mounting it could be an actual animation (instead of mere cast time). When you go afk your mount could go graze nearby or hunt critters (sabercats, raptors) (maybe disable this in cities and rated bgs and arenas). ETC.


    The quest stuff is an interesting idea but cant be used due to the MMO nature of the game... because rewards matter (relative to others) in an MMO.

    If you keep things equal and rewards are the same regardless of your actions, then your choices have no meaning.

    And if you make rewards differ, then they MUST be either perfectly balanced or easily swapped, because in an MMO the relative power of other players does matter. Since you can basically never depend on balance, they would need to be easily swapped (which leads right back into the problem where your choice does not really matter).

    Further complicating this is that rewards in MMOs get buffed and nerfed CONSTANTLY for balancing reasons, so even a good choice can go bad on you.



    I actually like most of the rest of your suggestions, but they would probably only appeal to a small segment of players... and almost no one would consider these things innovations. They are good flavor things for the RPG side of things, but even so, they are not really game changers.

    Keep in mind that WoW has had hundreds of these types of flavor and QoL things over the years, so if they aren’t enough to keep people happy, then these wouldn’t either.
    Last edited by Wingspan; 2019-11-05 at 12:30 AM.

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