How many of you would like to see pathfinder removed or changed?

[Mirishka]

As title suggests. I have a certain love-hate for pathfinder. I love having some challenge to fly, but i hate having too much challenge and time to wait until i have it. Would you like for blizzard for example, change pathfinder in a way that wouldn't take a whole grind rep but instead, just quest chains, that you can complete anytime you want and once that pathfinder part 1 is done, pathfinder 2 would then give you a rep to grind? Or the opposite, or just remove PART 2? What are your thoughts?

Edit: The hate part for it, it's about how long Pathfinder PART II takes to come out. Just want to clarify this for someone that reads this the first time.
The love part is that i actually like having challenge to unlock flying. It's a satisfaction sensation that you get.

Should just be 1 part. Finishing the zones, exploration. Bam, you can fly.

[Wildpantz]

Sure remove Pathfinder and flying such stupid thing too add

[Shakana]

/shrug Just playing the game will get you flying in little time tbh. We all want the game to be easier and easier but then it just leads to less of a game to play. I'm not a fan of flying to begin with but it's here to stay so it should require some effort to earn it. Could be rep grinds or a massive gold sink, either are viable but the gold sink will be a variable level of challenge to different people. Some have the hoards of gold to buy w/e they want, most probably don't. Rep grinds even the playing field by requiring X amount of quests/activities to do for every one.

I don't want the game to be easier, well i don't mind having a more normal gameplay without too much complexity, but i don't want it to be super easy otherwise i will not feel compelled to play it, i really will not.

More like, i'm working towards something, and i don't want to have it semi-finished. I want to work towards it and having my reward as soon as possible. In this case, the reward is flying, i take it! Do me all you want, i will even play 2 months no stop on a grind, but at least, if i have it, i don't want to wait an unknown time, to get flying, because it's literally unknown when they are going to release pathfinder 2 patch on the expansion.

[schwank05]

Yes, Remove it and go back to just give me X gold when you are at or close to max level to be able to fly in said zone.

- - - Updated - - -

You literally get 15% extra rep for an entire month right now. The worst possible time to complain.

But besides that, do the same work I did if you want the same reward. Actually, you already have to do less work.

I already spend Hundreds of thousands of gold getting and upgrading flying let me use what I paid for.

[Yamuri]

I like earning it, I also love ground mounts at the beginning. Keep pathfinder but keep it late game and based on exploration. Reputation walls are dumb, especially for people who don't have the time to grind it all. Had a friend quit wow since they are only on 2 nights a week and everyone had a HUGE advantage over them for something that will take them a couple months to complete.

[DarkAmbient]

Why i think they keep us on the ground:

- Because they have to create less content. A statistic i saw once about how much lower it was the quests needed on expansions that didn't had flying straight away once you hit max level, and it's loads of quests and content when you have flying. And reduced quests, therefore, content on the ones that you're on the ground.

Why they keep us on the ground by blizzard (official said this):

Because designers wants you to notice their hard work, and on a panel at Blizzcon 2019 they even talk about this little details on the designs like invisible walls being less and less now.

And it can even be a mix of both.

I think that's an excuse from Blizzard, tbh. If they tried, they could create a world where flying is incorporated into the design. They have the talent and imagination, but possibly not the inclination to make the effort.

[Shakana]

Should just be 1 part. Finishing the zones, exploration. Bam, you can fly.

Ye because you're not unlocking, for example, an allied race, that you need rep for.

You're unlocking a way to approach content and flying is a way of approaching that content, reps should have nothing related to it, even tho i don't mind them at all.

But it's about exploring. So, for that logic, it should be more related to a quest chain, and loremaster achievement.

[azka]

I'm O.K. how it works.

No, you know what? I would add a Mage-Tower mechanic as the last part of the Pathfinder, so only the really worthy could fly.

[Shakana]

I think that's an excuse from Blizzard, tbh. If they tried, they could create a world where flying is incorporated into the design. They have the talent and imagination, but possibly not the inclination to make the effort.

I would even like to understand why they don't want flying. Someone just literally said Ion does not want flying but to make us happy they delay it and gives us the most late possible. Like why? I need to google this! XD

- - - Updated - - -

I'm O.K. how it works.

No, you know what? I would add a Mage-Tower mechanic as the last part of the Pathfinder, so only the really worthy could fly.

Someone gave that idea, would be really fun!

[Aggrophobic]

As title suggests. I have a certain love-hate for pathfinder. I love having some challenge to fly, but i hate having too much challenge and time to wait until i have it. Would you like for blizzard for example, change pathfinder in a way that wouldn't take a whole grind rep but instead, just quest chains, that you can complete anytime you want and once that pathfinder part 1 is done, pathfinder 2 would then give you a rep to grind? Or the opposite, or just remove PART 2? What are your thoughts?

Edit: The hate part for it, it's about how long Pathfinder PART II takes to come out. Just want to clarify this for someone that reads this the first time.
The love part is that i actually like having challenge to unlock flying. It's a satisfaction sensation that you get.

Just make it unlockable right away without any timegating and remove or lower the rep needed so it's more or less unlocked at max lever or maybe 2-3 weeks after max level if you put some effort into it.

Having to wait for a year is just not fun. Flying is and has always been one of WoW core features and on of the best features for that matter. The game was made a LOT less fun in WoD when it was more or less removed. There is simply no point in having it after most players are done with the expansion.

[LiteTheWay]

You literally get 15% extra rep for an entire month right now. The worst possible time to complain.

But besides that, do the same work I did if you want the same reward. Actually, you already have to do less work.

2 months actually, event goes until January.

[united]

Why? If it's not current content, why do you need flying for it? You aren't going to be spending most of your time there.

Because in a year they release shadowlands, an expansion where you’ll be able to choose any of the previous expansions and level seamlessly there.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Pathfinder gone? Good riddance!

[Ange]

Why they don't want flying? It has been a thing for so long, why in wod they decided to not wanting it?

WoD draged the amount of active players down, you should know how empty the servers were if you played in WoD. Every change from WoD was a good one and LEGIONS/BFA success pretty much proved with subs and sheer /playtime that the new changes were good.

Thats one of the reasons why it is really hard to follow discussions about WoD features people want back, because it was clearly not wanted by the fast majority of the players, thats the whole reason the game had to change to survive.

[Ragedaug]

As title suggests. I have a certain love-hate for pathfinder. I love having some challenge to fly, but i hate having too much challenge and time to wait until i have it. Would you like for blizzard for example, change pathfinder in a way that wouldn't take a whole grind rep but instead, just quest chains, that you can complete anytime you want and once that pathfinder part 1 is done, pathfinder 2 would then give you a rep to grind? Or the opposite, or just remove PART 2? What are your thoughts?

Edit: The hate part for it, it's about how long Pathfinder PART II takes to come out. Just want to clarify this for someone that reads this the first time.
The love part is that i actually like having challenge to unlock flying. It's a satisfaction sensation that you get.

Pathfinder Part I:
Quest, Rep, Exploration Requirements can remain the same. (although I wouldn't be opposed to easing up the Rep req)
Remove time gate - flying is available as soon as Pathfinder is achieved
Only allows flying in the initial zones of the expansion

Pathfinder Part II+:
Quest & Exploration Requirements remain the same.
Rep requirement lowered to Honored (or removed)
- this would be to allow flight for any new patch zone.

One of the problem as I see it is the lack of compelling rewards to keep us engaged in repeat content. By the time we have flight, we already have whatever new world/quest gear is available, so it feels like there's not much left to do as the thing that kept us logging in was earning that flight reward. Make it part of the game and not a grind reward, then add something else for people to keep playing for, and they'll stay sub'd even after they earn flight.

[Aresk]

I personally would rather flying be less a luxury and more a requirement. BC, WotLK, Cata, and MoP had content that required flying. Netherwing Ledge was great, and I enjoyed the Ogri'la bombing dailies. Being forced to have aerial bases because the ground was so dangerous in Icecrown helped sell how impenetrable the path to ICC was. The serpent rider dailies were a lot of fun in MoP, and having pet trainers on ledges throughout the continent gave some cool exploration elements to MoP.

I don't mind reps being part of Pathfinder, since I farm reps anyway. I do mind the time gating and the fact that Pathfinder assumes that flying is not a core part of the gameplay for the expansion. I'd much rather have achievements linked to some current content (not unreleased content) that grants flying in that content, and then when new zones are introduced, part 2 of the achievement gives flying for that area.

WotLK had the correct approach to flying, everything since is a mistake.

What did WotLK do with flying that MoP didn't? I don't recall any real differences between them, but I may have just forgotten.

[Shakana]

Pathfinder Part I:
Quest, Rep, Exploration Requirements can remain the same. (although I wouldn't be opposed to easing up the Rep req)
Remove time gate - flying is available as soon as Pathfinder is achieved
Only allows flying in the initial zones of the expansion

Pathfinder Part II+:
Quest & Exploration Requirements remain the same.
Rep requirement lowered to Honored (or removed)
- this would be to allow flight for any new patch zone.

One of the problem as I see it is the lack of compelling rewards to keep us engaged in repeat content. By the time we have flight, we already have whatever new world/quest gear is available, so it feels like there's not much left to do as the thing that kept us logging in was earning that flight reward. Make it part of the game and not a grind reward, then add something else for people to keep playing for, and they'll stay sub'd even after they earn flight.

Well but, that's why the content should be more engaging too and should be worked in a way that keeps you occupied that is not just "do same content over and over", actually have a progressing system, in other things, (that are not just raids), like AP grind is boring, but there are things i like, on professions, on gear, on the world, make professions mess up with your gear again, being able to craft stuff. Make the content more engaging that doesn't involve unlock flying to appreciate it.
Flying is so nice. Saying that after having flying people have nothing else to do, shows a lack of content, imo.

- - - Updated - - -

I personally would rather flying be less a luxury and more a requirement. BC, WotLK, Cata, and MoP had content that required flying. Netherwing Ledge was great, and I enjoyed the Ogri'la bombing dailies. Being forced to have aerial bases because the ground was so dangerous in Icecrown helped sell how impenetrable the path to ICC was. The serpent rider dailies were a lot of fun in MoP, and having pet trainers on ledges throughout the continent gave some cool exploration elements to MoP.

Holy shit, that gave me a sudden nostalgic mood lol

As for

I don't mind reps being part of Pathfinder, since I farm reps anyway. I do mind the time gating and the fact that Pathfinder assumes that flying is not a core part of the gameplay for the expansion. I'd much rather have achievements linked to some current content (not unreleased content) that grants flying in that content, and then when new zones are introduced, part 2 of the achievement gives flying for that area.

It's exactly this right there.

- - - Updated - - -

WoD draged the amount of active players down, you should know how empty the servers were if you played in WoD. Every change from WoD was a good one and LEGIONS/BFA success pretty much proved with subs and sheer /playtime that the new changes were good.

Thats one of the reasons why it is really hard to follow discussions about WoD features people want back, because it was clearly not wanted by the fast majority of the players, thats the whole reason the game had to change to survive.

Ye i didnt play. But i know that at that time they swore they wouldn't bring flying but ended up bringing it but with loads of rep and pathfinder was then introduced.
Why is this tho? I need to do some research on blizz logic for not wanting pathfinder, like intensively.

[Enthusiastic Steward]

What did WotLK do with flying that MoP didn't? I don't recall any real differences between them, but I may have just forgotten.

The main difference was that for WotLK you bought a BoA book that you could mail to any character to learn as long as they were high enough level. In MoP each character had to physically go to the Shrine in the Vale to train it. So they were similar but MoPs was unnecessarily cumbersome, WotLKs was more streamlined. I would still take MoP over Pathfinder.

I would be more on board with Pathfinder if it was one part instead of two and all the requirements were accessible as soon as the expansion launched, with the only 'gating' being your own on how fast/rigorously you pursued it.

[Ange]

Make it part of the game and not a grind reward, then add something else for people to keep playing for, and they'll stay sub'd even after they earn flight.

What do you suggest? Flying is a casual reward and what else could be used but grinding in this genre of game? Blizzard cant offer flying for a WoW Token, because its more than a cosmetic. You have to do something ingame for it and the most casual thing is exploration and reputation.

[Shakana]

The main difference was that for WotLK you bought a BoA book that you could mail to any character to learn as long as they were high enough level. In MoP each character had to physically go to the Shrine in the Vale to train it. So they were similar but MoPs was unnecessarily cumbersome, WotLKs was more streamlined. I would still take MoP over Pathfinder.

I would be more on board with Pathfinder if it was one part instead of two and all the requirements were accessible as soon as the expansion launched, with the only 'gating' being your own on how fast/rigorously you pursued it.

I like how you articulate your words. And also, love your signature, embracing the new expansion ^^

And as i have been saying on other posts, i feel the same, your progress should be the thing that mattered instead of being timegated. The work you put into it, should give you the reward and the desire to pursue to your endings that gets put at stand-by for god knows how long.