Diablo 4 to feature microtransactions

[Segus1992]

Called it on 11/02! ^_^

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...7#post51812287

Congrats. Are you also gonna brag about predicting there would be another WoW expansion?

I can't imagine anything more obvious in terms of game development, and honestly players should be happy D4 will feature MTX. Unless they're the freaks who want a repeat of D3 (ie stupid people).

[Tabrotar]

There's no such thing as "double dipping" at play, here. You're never paying twice for the same thing. It's an objectively false claim. That's the point.

Comparing to other companies, or past products, is completely irrelevant. It doesn't mean their monetization model is "wrong". At best, it means you, personally, don't like it.

In which case, don't buy it. Nothing's forcing you to. Feel free to not bother with Diablo 4. Your decision to play something else does not mean what Blizzard is doing is "wrong", in any objective way whatsoever.

And they aren't making you pay multiple times for the same product. That's flatly false. I understand what you're saying, but it's as wrong as those who claim that being taxed on income and capital gains is "double taxation". It isn't. The claim is simply wrong.

Really Endus how pathetic can you be always defending the big video game companys no matte rwhat they do and if someone call you out for it you just brush it off and say that you always said if they would do this or that it would be bad.

[Beefhammer]

Really Endus how pathetic can you be always defending the big video game companys no matte rwhat they do and if someone call you out for it you just brush it off and say that you always said if they would do this or that it would be bad.

I seem him as being logical and seeing both sides of a situation. Most against are just cynical about Blizzard or using feels to fuel their argument. He is correct, you are paying for the base game. MTX are extras not included (we assume they are not, but they could be in the game and MTX is just a way to speed up collecting them), so purchasing them is not double dipping. I fail to see how this stance is defending a big game company.

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The food joint comparison is awful, but lets roll with it:

The fast food joint used to sell me [a burger, fries and a toy for children] for 5 dollar. A profitable business model, the franchise is doing extremely well.

Now after some research they come to the conclusion that they could charge me 4 dollar for the [burger] and then another 3 dollar for the [fries and the toy], if they sell them seperately! Sure they could just keep selling the 5 bucks bundle and be well off, but why not double dip if you can? The Burger tastes great, it's the best on the block, and who stops at one burger anyway? Got to have some fries with it!

Now, after some more research, they come to the conclusion that the toy for children isn't what a lot of people visit the restaurant for, they just want to fill their bellies with delicious fast food. Sure it's nice to have, can even bring a smile to an adult's face, but you can do without.
*Some* customers do care a lot for the toys though, especially those with kids. They might even pay 20 dollar or more if it means they can complete the collection of the year! Sure the business was already doing great when they sold the 5 bucks bundle, but why not take that third dip if you can?

Now, after even more research and triple dipping, it turns out the stupid toy can potentially earn them even more money than their core business: selling food. So, why not adapt to that? The burger packaging should be used to aggressively advertise the toys, hell they can even build their restaurant's playzone for kids around it! That's it! Kids should see other kids play with the toys!

___________________________________________

Anyway, this awful comparison shouldn't be necessary to understand what is meant by double and triple dipping. You don't only judge the product in a bubble, you judge the company and how they acted in the past and how it compares to other companies it competes with. And compared to other companies they are double and triple dipping, they let you pay for things that other companies don't charge for. Because they can, at least in WoW.

Currently we can only compare Diablo 4's business model with POE's, which charges absolutely nothing for the burger and the fries, but charges more for the toys and even an extra seat at the table if you need one. The problem is that their burger and fries taste like shit though, so the only hope for a more consumer-friendly behavior is good competition.
This would be on the top of my wishlist, good competition for Diablo 4. This alone would fix a lot of the greed that a lot of people welcome with open arms (for reasons that are not entirely clear to me when you are the consumer and not a shareholder, but whatever).

Dipping, as in double, triple, quadruple... has always meant buying the game multiple times, typically on the different platforms it is release on. This is pretty common knowledge.

[Aliven]

You seriously have to ask why in 2019 rolling into 2020?

What triple A package game doesn't have microtransactions these days? I honestly can't think of one.

God of War.

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This is not an argument that has any merit. There is no "double and triple dipping".

The base game price entitles you to the content contained in the base game, only. Not any expansion content. Not any benefits or features that have an additional price tag at launch via microtransactions. None of those are included in the original purchase price. Buying those is not "double dipping" in any sense of the word; your original payment did not buy those things.

It's like arguing that a fast food joint is "double dipping" by making you pay extra for fries and a drink, when you already bought a burger. It doesn't make a lick of sense in any way whatsoever.

Kinda bad comparison. More accurate would be that you buy a dinner but then they have you pay extra for water because well, we love money.

[Beefhammer]

God of War.

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Kinda bad comparison. More accurate would be that you buy a dinner but then they have you pay extra for water because well, we love money.

Not water but a desert or glass of wine.

[McNeil]

I was already on the edge of not buying this game, and this just made my decision a whole lot easier. I do not support games being sold at full price that have microtransactions, which is simply a matter of principle. The one and first time I did this was with Dead Space 3, and it was apparent how much they have ruined the game with how much the shop had an impact on it. This was also the case with the BMAH in Diablo 3.

I’m completely fine with having shops in free-to-play games, its the only way they can earn money without overloading you with ads. But having shops in games you already paid full price for feels like a robbery. It makes the money you pay for the game feel less worth the price, it makes goals in the game feel less rewarding when there is better stuff on the store, and it sometimes affects the loot system like it did in DS3 and D3.

I guess its the norm to have microtransactions in every game now, which is probably why I barely even buy new games these days.

[mvaliz]

Congrats. Are you also gonna brag about predicting there would be another WoW expansion?

You're one of those kids who failed the "Read the entire page before you answer all the questions" test in grade school, didn't you?

Because you seemingly missed this part:

...admittedly, I don't feel like I won anything I should be proud of. =/

...I also should admit it's like predicting McDonalds would unveil a new fattening food item... =/

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D3 has micros, kinda in the way of 'account upgrades', why wouldn't D4?

They're called "expansions". You might be to young to remember, but it was kinda the norm between the early 2000s and now, before MTX.

Also, I think most people just fear/worry that the game is being designed around MTX, and not around just being a stand-alone game by itself and then a handful of MTX developed post-game-release - especially after last years debacle with trying to sell a Chinese-Produced Mobile Whale-Hunting game as a legit installment of the Diablo franchise.

[Hekazi]

"It's an opportunity to have more options available"

How about you just put all of the options in the fucking game?

That would cost, and the purchase price would increase and will force you to buy the cosmetics, if that's to your liking
They're giving you a choice.

[mvaliz]

You seriously have to ask why in 2019 rolling into 2020?

What triple A package game doesn't have microtransactions these days? I honestly can't think of one.

Pretty much any Sony AAA game for PS4.

God of War currently has none

Horizon: Zero Dawn has one traditional full expansion, which people don't count as MTX because a) it's not micro, and b) seriously expands the game in every way, almost like a sequel.

Spiderman for PS4 has one traditional expansion.

Same with Detroit: Become Human

Death Stranding currently has no MTX either, or at least it was developed without MTX in design.

It's funny how much people seem to believe Nintendo and such are "True Companies", and yet - here's Sony leading the charge on just developing Rock-solid AAA games with NO Microtransactions, and nobody even bats an eye at them for some reason. =/

[Segus1992]

You're one of those kids who failed the "Read the entire page before you answer all the questions" test in grade school, didn't you?

Because you seemingly missed this part:

I mean, you did still brag about it - enough to bring up the post. It literally is as unimpressive as predicting that a fast food chain will produce fast food, yes. Players should be happy about MTX, you'd have to be pretty stupid and shortsighted to not understand how it's good for players to have MTX that aren't harmful to the game.

You're also doing the naive comparison of comparing games today to games decades ago, as if that's relevant at all.

There were extremely few updates to D2. Would you be happy with that amount of updates, just because you can't resist wasting money on non-egregious MTX?

[Tabrotar]

I seem him as being logical and seeing both sides of a situation. Most against are just cynical about Blizzard or using feels to fuel their argument. He is correct, you are paying for the base game. MTX are extras not included (we assume they are not, but they could be in the game and MTX is just a way to speed up collecting them), so purchasing them is not double dipping. I fail to see how this stance is defending a big game company.

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Dipping, as in double, triple, quadruple... has always meant buying the game multiple times, typically on the different platforms it is release on. This is pretty common knowledge.

Just look up his comments in the Fallout 76 thread and him defending Bethesda there.

[mvaliz]

I mean, you did still brag about it - enough to bring up the post. It literally is as unimpressive as predicting that a fast food chain will produce fast food, yes. Players should be happy about MTX, you'd have to be pretty stupid and shortsighted to not understand how it's good for players to have MTX that aren't harmful to the game.

I honestly can't tell if you're just trolling at this point with such an unbelievable statement like that. =/

There were extremely few updates to D2. Would you be happy with that amount of updates, just because you can't resist wasting money on non-egregious MTX?

Oh wow, somebody's going to learn a lesson about Diablo 2 fans...

/puts on rain poncho and splatter-guard plastic cover

I think I'm going to walk away now and just watch the D2 fans proverbially pelt you with rotten eggs and yellow snowballs stuffed with razor blades for that one.

[PedroloGeo]

So you are greedy. You admit that there are huge benifits to buying a model but you want it for free. This isn't the Soviet Union.

Yeah sure Marx and whatever. If a game comes with cool models as a reward for playing the game people engage more with it. If cool models are payed then players have less content and the game has lower players.

For the company it is better. Not for the game. Looks like you are a shareholder so grats you are gonna reap the benefits.

Or maybe you are just a gamer who will get less content for his game.

[Beefhammer]

Just look up his comments in the Fallout 76 thread and him defending Bethesda there.

Has no relevance to what was said here. Maybe he was defending something there. My comments are to what Inhave read here only.

[Segus1992]

I honestly can't tell if you're just trolling at this point with such an unbelievable statement like that. =/



Oh wow, somebody's going to learn a lesson about Diablo 2 fans...

/puts on rain poncho and splatter-guard plastic cover

I think I'm going to walk away now and just watch the D2 fans proverbially pelt you with rotten eggs and yellow snowballs stuffed with razor blades for that one.

So you are one of the people who don't understand finance even in the slightest sense.

I never said D2 was a bad game, would be pretty stupid of you to think that's what I said. It definitely had few updates though, which resulted in certain skills being OP, followed by a wide update trying to fix all issues that instead made said skills worthless. See: Fire Wall, Nova, Frozen Orb (though less so than the other two), Guided Arrow, Frozen Arrow, etc.

MTX means companies will stay invested in their games, because with MTX they still make money from a game's continued longevity. The alternative is that you get what is released, and every update post launch is a bonus or paid for. I didn't think it took a genius to understand that, but maybe it does.

[Endus]

Really Endus how pathetic can you be always defending the big video game companys no matte rwhat they do and if someone call you out for it you just brush it off and say that you always said if they would do this or that it would be bad.

It's almost like my position is based on facts and reason, not some useless side-based gamesmanship.

I'm not "defending big video game companies no matter what they do. These specific things aren't "bad", in any appreciable sense, and the outcry against them is ridiculous. Don't like paying for microtransactions? Just . . . don't. Problem solved. Their existence does not hurt you in any way.

Show me a case of a company selling pay-to-win upgrades through microtransactions, and I'll agree that's a bad gameplay model for consumers, but this is really specific to cases where you need to pay to win, not for cosmetics and not for "pay to progress faster" things like XP boosts. This also isn't the case with Diablo 4, as far as we know, and people have been arguing against the very concept of microtransactions as a monetization model, not pay-to-win mechanics.

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Has no relevance to what was said here. Maybe he was defending something there. My comments are to what Inhave read here only.

They like to hold grudges. My position early on in the FO76 thread was always that the launch was rocky, but I liked the core game they'd released. They want to attack me over that liking what they don't like thing, because I wouldn't get on the knee-jerk hate-train.

That I don't particularly like what they've done recently with Fallout First and haven't posted in that thread basically in months because I stopped playing 76 ages ago seems to just slip their minds.

[mvaliz]

So you are one of the people who don't understand finance even in the slightest sense.

I never said D2 was a bad game, would be pretty stupid of you to think that's what I said. It definitely had few updates though, which resulted in certain skills being OP, followed by a wide update trying to fix all issues that instead made said skills worthless. See: Fire Wall, Nova, Frozen Orb (though less so than the other two), Guided Arrow, Frozen Arrow, etc.

MTX means companies will stay invested in their games, because with MTX they still make money from a game's continued longevity. The alternative is that you get what is released, and every update post launch is a bonus or paid for. I didn't think it took a genius to understand that, but maybe it does.

So you're one of the people who don't understand that fun games make long-lasting impressions that continue making more sales over time before MTXs existed.

Again, all the D2 fanboys will read your stupid and I'll let them deal with you. Those of us how REALLY understand economics (in regards to selling to humans, not logic-based robots) will just sit by and eat popcorn and watch you learn your lesson or not. ^_^

[RobertoCarlos]

Every blizzard game has MTX but people thought d4 would be different? What a pointless thread

[Yayeet]

What's the problem about cosmetic effects being for sale? EVERY recent game does it.

[Nefarious Tea]

You seriously have to ask why in 2019 rolling into 2020?

What triple A package game doesn't have microtransactions these days? I honestly can't think of one.

"because they all do" is a garbage reason.

You and I both know that the ONLY reason games have microtransactions is greed, pure and simple.