Can we just geek out over "the era of TO?"

[ro9ue]

Definitely a really awesome change.

[clevin]

It's an MMO. If you play it as a single player, it will get boring.

I would know, I'm an actual shut-in.

Next time read the entire post for comprehension.

[melodramocracy]

GW2 is a great example of why the lack of "holy trinity" actually makes encounters less interesting. While this might be a neat side-show, I wouldn't want to see it become some main element of the game.

[Shakana]

I agree with you OP, I rarely play with a full team anymore, so this is a GREAT addition to the game for me.
I often work evenings, so I have to grind stuff alone in the morning/noon-hours. I always feel left behind because of that.

I loved the Mage towers, I hope this will have the same feel.

*Pats you*

I know what you mean, i barely have time to even have a mythic hardcore playteam cause my schedules are not even the same as the raids, then i need to do stuff with randoms or i just decide to not do them at all. (Mostly cause i have no patience for the wipes and rude comments on chat and it's bad for my raid atmosphere, i start question myself why do i force myself into being in such environment).

[buck008]

So, is this just greater rifts in WoW? Because I'm 100% for that. I got that impression from the announcement, but I haven't really read the various interviews and whatnot if there was a clearer picture given. I sincerely hope there isn't a limit put in, because this sounds exactly like the kind of content I would drop into frequently.

[Anoikis]

Players complain about to much grind.
Blizzard gives them an endless grind-tower and a complete grind-area (Maw) and people "hurray".
I don't get it.
No quest, no story.
Just hack and slay which is ok for a game like Diablo but for an MMORPG it's a bland, lazy, shitty game design

[hulkgor]

Players complain about to much grind.
Blizzard gives them an endless grind-tower and a complete grind-area (Maw) and people "hurray".

There's a huge, huge difference between 'grind', and 'replayable'.

Examples? Grinding AP on the neck... or replayable Mythic+. See? There's a difference.

Considering you have no clue on what to do on the Maw, or how the zone even works, and you also have no clue about the tower, or even how often you can run it, you're just spewing crap, for the sake of stirring shit.

But yea, great insight buddy, i guess.

[Amnaught]

I feel like if this goes over well, they can expand it to normal dungeons, like they already did from flex to normal/heroic raids. That is, you can queue for a normal dungeon, and can get thrown in with only three DD specs. Either it auto-scales to allow you to play any role, or it gives you bodyguard-styled healer and tank NPCs if you're missing a role. I'd 100% support that. X to Y players is awesome. If you prefer to play with other people, they're always there and you can always invite them to a group.

[tmamass]

If you're talking about that pve tower thing, I thought they said 1-4 players.

actually they said 1-5

[Lothaeryn]

If raid scaling is anything to judge by, there will be the best amount of players to run with and there will probably be instances where having more or less people will make the fight much harder. Also the whole "role does not matter" kinda stinks of "don't be a healer".

even worse, it may promote not bringing classes that cant self heal and dps/tank at the same time.

Or it could be a lie and be the complete opposite, where trinity rules still matter and you are putting yourselves at risk by not having 1 of the 3 roles present.

Overall, it seems like this system is going to have problems with its scaling; if it can be done with 1 person, fine, but if it scales disproportionately expecting particular roles to be present for 2+ groups, its likely to be a nightmare.

[Omedon]

If raid scaling is anything to judge by, there will be the best amount of players to run with and there will probably be instances where having more or less people will make the fight much harder. Also the whole "role does not matter" kinda stinks of "don't be a healer".

As excited as I am for Torghast and "the era of TO," I fully admit that WoW suuuuucks at enabling some classes to solo as well as others. I get around this by, well... basically not playing my priests or shaman or mages very far because, yeah... they suck at soloing in a world where tanks and pet classes are a thing.

Thing is... um... I have indeed adapted, so I'm not worried. I will lead shadowlands with solo friendly classes... and "sucks to be a priest I guess..."

Except... my priest's aesthetic is basically revendreth. Like I'm salivating to get that stuff for my priest... which I plan to do by having my warlock unlock everything, but I mean... that's not a fix.

This is where I think Blizzard would respond with "well, I mean you CAN bring friends so it's ok, right?"

I mean, it's not... but that I guess is a response, if a kinda crappy one.

Point is, yes, some classes will suck at this... which I imagine is why they allow you to bring friends. It's potentially expected that the soloist players will have gravitated to the soloist classes by now, like I have.

It's an ugly answer, and I'm not defending it. It does, indeed reek of "don't be a healer."

[Tiwack]

More flex and scaling is awesome when done and implemented right.

[Lane]

Mad respect for RIFT on so many different fronts! They were a major fallback point of high quality when we took a WoW hiatus from late Cataclysm to late WoD! We tried so many MMOs in that time, but RIFT was the closest to a second home... largely because of their housing and open world content as well as chronicles!

We also quit during Cataclysm and migrated to Rift. It was such a underrated game that not enough people gave a fair chance. It had quite a few features I wish WoW would've implemented and never did.

[Powerogue]

First it was scaling raids, which was an awesome convenience, now this, which seems similarly good. I look forward to seeing how it plays out.

[Kyphael]

What's the point of playing an MMO to play by yourself?

[Taeldorian]

I think this is probably the best thing they could do. Gives people the option to do whatever they want and I think in this case that’s a good thing. I think more multi-player focused content would be good as well but I’m also happy with the “1-5 players”.

- - - Updated - - -

What's the point of playing an MMO to play by yourself?

Then don’t. That’s why this system is great, you can play it either way. It isn’t promoting playing by yourself, it lets you do both. Personally I think that’s the best way to handle it, let players choose how they want to play. We’ve been missing that core philosophy from the game for a while now. I already have an idea of the 4 I’m gonna run with, hopefully it’s actually good content.

[Absintheminded]

It's an MMO. If you play it as a single player, it will get boring.

I would know, I'm an actual shut-in.

Not every activity needs to be a social thing. This is basically the next Islands Adventure where you're best off doing it for a weekly reward and then on to the next thing.

[StillMcfuu]

Role agnostic.

I'm kind of hyped for the flex gameplay of Torghast but I know that Blizz cant truly make it without roles.

I became intimately familiar with this issue in island where before we out geared them you still required a tank to hold and group. I'd queue and find myself in a group with 2 other dps or worst yet a healer, and you just cant play them as a team at that point, you just need to spread out and start dropping things in groups you can manage.

Healers are undervalued in that kind of system, they bring no damage and way too much healing, because by design the classes self healing/mitigation is all that's needed.

Unless they can find a balance for who is entering the tower, the "leaderboard" is going to look a lot like grifts in d3

[Fixxit the Gnome]

I really like that a core feature of the next expansion can be done by myself only. I love this game so much, but my friends only play it sporadically so I can't count on them for a lot of content.