Diablo 4 to feature microtransactions

[lagiacrux]

People still cry about cosmetic microtransactions in 2019? It's pretty normal.

just because it has been normalized, doesnt mean its good for the consumer.

[lordlosh]

Even game like CS use P2P model and have plenty of MTX in it. It doesn`t matter if its a F2P initially or not. Its a time purchase anyway.
MK11 Game for example. Firstly you need to pay for PSN(this is for network/server support), you pay for the base game, then you have new characters add you need to paid for them as well, you have skin/crystal/etc mtx to pay if you like them. You also have DLC with new characters and or 3rd variation you also need to pay for it.

I would be against MTX if it was a single player game, where you play between 24h to a week and you finish the game and thats it, you move to the next one. You still paid 60$ for such game.

In Diablo case you pay for a game that have multiplayer and will play in years to come, not just a week for example. In orders the game to not get fill with cheaters and bots, someone has to support the game, as well as servers if they fall down or anything happen.
So its pretty normal Blizz to expect income for their service.

POE case, its not a free game, unless you want to play the campaing, and finish the game for a 2-3 days and move to the other. If you want to truly play, you have to paid plenty just for the stashes needed. And in orders the game to be supported, there is plenty and all kinds of MTX, which is the right way.
But still POE servers suc*****, the game engine su*****. Even if you are with a Desktop from the future, the game will lag in party and the sync will kill you many, many times, no matter how strong your comp is, you still going to experience s**** spikes/lags etc. And the game will load your PC hard.

Small company charge for the game and have a business model so they can support the game, but no people here want a big company, thats main goal is to earn money need to offer them a free services ....
Some people think everyone is in some kind obligates to them .....
And what really pisses me and other people off is that MTX is completely optional, and its way better than monthly fee or paid for every new content out there. And people still complain even tho it`s not interfere in the gameplay even a bit, and they are trying to make it like it is.
How your character looks doesn`t impact on the gameplay period.

For 60$ the game needs to offer you just a campaign. If you don`t like the MTX, play the campaign and move on. Its your choice.
For the standard game price, Diablo 4 doesn`t need to offer you more, and still it does. But no one is obligated to you, no much how money they earn(no one knows that, cause there is a lot of x and y there) to give you free support and constant new content after you paid the base price.

If you don`t get that the problem is all on you.
And if anyone once again said POE, and if you really think its a free, just go play POE for god sake. I played the game last year for almost a year and the money i spend on the game was around 200$.

[Jurwi]

just because it has been normalized, doesnt mean its good for the consumer.

Why is it not good? They make extra stuff and some people who wish to do so, pay for that extra stuff. Others can keep living their lives. I rather have the option to ignore it than basically be forced to pay more in form of more expensive base game.

[lagiacrux]

Why is it not good? They make extra stuff and some people who wish to do so, pay for that extra stuff. Others can keep living their lives. I rather have the option to ignore it than basically be forced to pay more in form of more expensive base game.

just a quick response during work, but consider the following:

- lets say they sell an extra pair of cosmetic wings for your charakter, price doesnt matter
- its available in the store at launch
- that means its content that the deliberatly decided not to put into the game, but to sell it to you (after you payed full price)
- the item is in the game, it was on the physical copy you bought in the store, but its not available

regarding your 2nd opinion, i doubt games get cheaper when they have mtx available.
if your game is f2p, i dont care. thats how you monetize, but if you demand full price for it and then add mtx, it irks me.

[lordlosh]

Zidler from Reddit.

But once you buy the game, what's their incentive to keep supporting it?

If I have $2 billion of capital in my company, am I going to invest that money in continuing to support something that gives me 0 return, or am I going to put that towards something that makes me money?

Mtx generate continuous revenue from your game. That revenue provides you with incentive to support the game, since you now have a financial interest in getting people to continue playing that game.

Without MTX, you have a Diablo 3 situation, where Blizzard has made their money from that product, and will use the revenue to work on their other projects.

[lagiacrux]

-snip-

if you want continuous support and give regular content updates for it, make you game f2p. or at least not full price.

[Dhrizzle]

They will make the good looking gear take way more time to get then it maybe would have with no cash shop. It's to push people that want to look good now to buy. So yes cash shops always make the game worse.

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They will make the game way more grindy then it needs to be to push people that want to look cool into the cash shop.

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I don't want that. Buying expansions every now and then is fine with me.

How can they make the game more grindy? Grinding is the game... if you run out of things to grind then you stop playing. Are you one of those people who pays to skip content so they don't have to play the game as much?

[lordlosh]

if you want continuous support and give regular content updates for it, make you game f2p. or at least not full price.

Sorry but this is b.s.
No big company will do that.
Look at the names i mention. Even game like Warhammer Chaosbane make you pay the base game, and then will tax you for new end game content.

Blizzard is not some small indy company that invest poor in the game, and put it for free, because no one ever heard of that game or the company itself, and when you new to the market you are only chance is to give better offer. Thats why POE was "free". But to be fair its not completely free, because you still need to give at least 60$ for all the needed stashes.

In POE there is how much workers ? In Blizzard there is like 50 time more employees, the salary, the budget, and the revenue they expect is a lot higher.

Blizzard obviously will invest a lot more for a game, compare to GGG, so its normal they want their money they put into the production of the game back.
How much profit they will make, has nothing to do with a future support of the game and to release regularly content and updates, simply because they will gain ZERO MONEY FROM IT.

I don`t know how old you are, but this is not how one big company operate. Just like what Zidler said in the quoted post.

If I have $2 billion of capital in my company, am I going to invest that money in continuing to support something that gives me 0 return, or am I going to put that towards something that makes me money?

Mtx generate continuous revenue from your game. That revenue provides you with incentive to support the game, since you now have a financial interest in getting people to continue playing that game.

Without MTX, you have a Diablo 3 situation, where Blizzard has made their money from that product, and will use the revenue to work on their other projects.

If you dont get that, the problem is all on you.

P.P. POE engines ***** and their server **** as well as the gameplay is from 99. You can`t compare indy company that makes such games with Blizzard.
If they want to success they need to put the game for free, otherwise no one will buy it, or the number will be too small and company will bankruptcy.
Thats why its free and they try to get as much ppl playing their game and they hope the income will come from MTX.
But you have to understand that these are small company and they do not invest even close to what Blizzard invest, and they don`t paid 5000 salary and so on.

[LanToaster]

just a quick response during work, but consider the following:

- lets say they sell an extra pair of cosmetic wings for your charakter, price doesnt matter
- its available in the store at launch
- that means its content that the deliberatly decided not to put into the game, but to sell it to you (after you payed full price)
- the item is in the game, it was on the physical copy you bought in the store, but its not available

regarding your 2nd opinion, i doubt games get cheaper when they have mtx available.
if your game is f2p, i dont care. thats how you monetize, but if you demand full price for it and then add mtx, it irks me.

Soo, you are also mad at the Farmers, because they only sell you part of their AppleHarvest For the Price of One Apple?

I mean, the Farmer grew an entire Tree, and you have to pay for each Apple? Outragous.

While it is for Games not as easy to Calculate how much "something should cost", there is still a Calculation in it.
If you build a Car:
You buy parts for X$
You pay workers for Y$
You pay your Facilities for Z$

Now you Add that up, and put some Additional value on top for Profit. Bam -> CarPrize
You dont expect the Car to have an Additional AC, or special Coating, unless you pay for it.

On Game Development it is not that much Different:
You need to Pay your Workers,
You need to Pay your Facilties
You need to have a Profit.

This all combines into a Budget. However big the Budget is, depends on how much they are Expecting to sell.

E.g.
More ways for Income == Bigger Budget

if you want continuous support and give regular content updates for it, make you game f2p. or at least not full price.

So you would like the game more, if D4 would stay as is, after Release. (No Seasons, no Updates, no new content)?

[Lahis]

Of course it fucking will.

Dead game already.

[lordlosh]

LanToaster, they don`t understand that POE is not fully free, cause you will pay more only on stashes, and POE invest 10x time less to production the game, compare to Diablo. That is also the reason POE gameplay is from 99, its engine and server simply ****.
And that when you are a name on the market that will earn you more money right away.
GGG was no one when they released POE, the only way the game to success was to be F2P.

If they make POE 2, and they invest, as Blizzard invest into their game, you can be 100% sure they will charge you for the base game and if you still want they to support the game, they will have to add MTX.

Some people just like to argue for the sake of it, even if its make zero sense and logic.

[Jurwi]

just a quick response during work, but consider the following:

- lets say they sell an extra pair of cosmetic wings for your charakter, price doesnt matter
- its available in the store at launch
- that means its content that the deliberatly decided not to put into the game, but to sell it to you (after you payed full price)
- the item is in the game, it was on the physical copy you bought in the store, but its not available

regarding your 2nd opinion, i doubt games get cheaper when they have mtx available.
if your game is f2p, i dont care. thats how you monetize, but if you demand full price for it and then add mtx, it irks me.

Well yea, usually games get finished and packaged etc. long before the release date. Usually that would be the end of the development. But in the current mtx world the developer can still have a small team working on that pair of cosmetic wings and have it ready in store just before the launch as well. It's clearly extra content since in the pre-mtx world they would not have done that work after the release package was finished. Heck those wings and all other cosmetic content might very well be made by some totally separate division that gets their income from only those cosmetic items, and as such is separate from the actual base game.

The way I see it, the cosmetic extras are just that, extras. They would not have existed back in the day at all. Now they exist and can be bought with (usually) small extra sum.

[Lorianus]

Without MTX, the game will be abandoned and let to rot like D3 after Reaper of Souls, no stream of revenue = no stream of development, the day the RMAH was patched out from D3 was basically the death of the games development.

[quras]

I miss the days when games were so good at launch that they sold really well just off how good they were and there was no need of MTX.

Diablo is a game where MTX just isn't needed and we all know where MTX in games goes with the best things behind that paywall, doesn't matter if it's cosmetic or not. Cosmetic just means it's a little more tolerable but has the massive chance of screwing up the reward element of just playing.

Just saying it's cosmetic only doesn't mean blizzard/activision wont screw it up. I'm seeing a Destiny 2 moment when corporate takes something players like and monetizes it all the while players get to watch it became less entertaining.

Time will tell but I have little belief blizzard/activision will get it right. I'm extremely skeptical of them and I'll be fairly pissed to see Transmogrification / Dyes with a price tag on it along with the AAA price on the base game to boot.

Without MTX, the game will be abandoned and let to rot like D3 after Reaper of Souls, no stream of revenue = no stream of development, the day the RMAH was patched out from D3 was basically the death of the games development.

Funny, that didn't happen with D2.

[Hyral]

If you want this kind of practices to fade away then don't purchase the game. It's just basically a D3 expansion being sold for full price anyway, you won't be missing anything.

[Rendark]

Then you obviously not played solid ARPG with MTX.
There is plenty of standard item in POE that`s look great. MTX have a totally different look. And MTX in a no way make the game more grindy.
And no one want a game that goes into maintenance mode just month after its release. MTX all the way.

Shakadam, just read that Borderlands 3 have MTX. So you lie about this one as well. Its obvious your point don`t stand real arguments and facts ....

Well seeing as every other game with a cash shop has been shit i think i'm right on the money.

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How can they make the game more grindy? Grinding is the game... if you run out of things to grind then you stop playing. Are you one of those people who pays to skip content so they don't have to play the game as much?

Ok so i'm done with the game. So i go play another game. People like you always go to extremes. If you say a game has to much grind then you must want everything for free right now!!!!

I'm not saying the game wont have you grinding for gear, that's fine. What i'm saying is any game with a cash shop will put in way more grinding then it needs to push people to buy from the shop.

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Without MTX, the game will be abandoned and let to rot like D3 after Reaper of Souls, no stream of revenue = no stream of development, the day the RMAH was patched out from D3 was basically the death of the games development.

The day the RMAH was patched out D3 became good for the first time.

[iosdeveloper]

"just cosmetics" means non-paid armor will look like shit

I guarantee you boys, we get a D3 reskin with mtx in atleast 3 years
Diablo Immortal for PC, basically

We can just go and make our own games, as main competitor RIP'd.

[Aliven]

Which means that price was inclusive of all those things, to begin with. You admit, yourself, that anything past what the price included would be extra.

Yes, so like expansions for a regular, full fledged game.

[lordlosh]

Well seeing as every other game with a cash shop has been shit i think i'm right on the money.

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Ok so i'm done with the game. So i go play another game. People like you always go to extremes. If you say a game has to much grind then you must want everything for free right now!!!!

I'm not saying the game wont have you grinding for gear, that's fine. What i'm saying is any game with a cash shop will put in way more grinding then it needs to push people to buy from the shop.

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The day the RMAH was patched out D3 became good for the first time.

Dare to explain how exactly MTX have anything to do with grinding for example in POE?
I`m listening. The 2 things have absolutely nothing in coming.

quras, how exactly they spport Diablo 2, outside of the server they allow you to play on? I`m listening. Diablo 2 received few patches and that was. The expansion was paid.
And to be fair the game was left with no real end game outside of PVP.
If you don`t know what new content and mechanics mean go look at POE and their mini-expansion.

[Coldkil]

Dare to explain how exactly MTX have anything to do with grinding for example in POE?
I`m listening. The 2 things have absolutely nothing in coming.

quras, how exactly they spport Diablo 2, outside of the server they allow you to play on? I`m listening. Diablo 2 received few patches and that was. The expansion was paid.
And to be fair the game was left with no real end game outside of PVP.
If you don`t know what new content and mechanics mean go look at POE and their mini-expansion.

Honestly, they added a bunch of stuff in D2 over time and development cycles were much slower, so it's not that the game was not supported.

However i agree, i don't see a MTX store as a threat for the game. They have stated already power won't be sold. If there are no lootboxes, then i'm good with it. Most people tend to forget how business scaled up a lot with much more increased costs and games still costing the same over the years. It's just natural that they need more ways to get revenue.

One can agree and spend money, or not agree and don't buy the game. We all know lost of people will buy D4 and most players will buy at least something in the cosmetic store. The concern to have worse systems in game to promote the MTX is real and we need to be aware of it, but since it's cosmetics and possibly statsh space, i don't see a problem here excluding a decrease in armor design level to promote better looking ones in the store.

But they're not needed to play the game.