Good News! No More Infinite AP Grind in 8.3

[themaster24]

Because then AP-Grind would actually matter again, and no thanks, i want it to stop. Since it grows exponentially, you can still do it, but you can also watch paint dry and would be as effective. So yes, while your system would make it better, i like it that way, since then you don't need to grind at all.

I honestly don't want any system where we can keep leveling the neck, at least for power. If anything, I'd rather see levels beyond a certain point be purely for cosmetic rewards. Maybe a couple FoS that give a title or transmog or something, perhaps it gives a currency that can be spent on a variety of things.

I think he means the minor, that's actually a passive and increase your mastery and therefore your dps, but even if it was a passive increase that not getting nerfed in the next patch, i still simply do not matter. You can easily get an increase in much smaller timeframe, and you still get naturally AP, so an infinite progression just for the 2 ilvl on a neck piece that's a minor slot + empowerment of essences is simply not worth the time. Compared to the infinite trait that reduce corruption this simply doesn't matter at all.

Technically, Vision's minor increase both the CDR (~.3% per level) and the SUPER TINY versatility (96 at HoA 69 for reference) you receive with each level. The catch is, the CDR caps out at 25%, and at 70, you're already at 21%. After your heart reaches 80, you're already at 24 out of 25%, and you're done in another 3-4 levels. After that, you only increase the versatility, which goes up at an incredibly slow rate.

You will hit the 25% CDR cap easily and naturally, and beyond that, the Versatility increase is so minor you wouldn't even notice.

This, but that being said i lvld a few alts with korraks, and now the neck is completely useless until i get 40 or so lvls into it... any catch up mechanism there? or just the regular grind so its gonna take forever to equip any sort of decent azerite armor? What a shit system, i sure asf hope they bring nothin like it to shadowlands

Once you do the quest chain to unlock the Essence system and get your first essence, your heart is automatically boosted up to 35, as well as giving you all the Ilvl's that Champs rep used to give you. At 35, until around the early 50's, you only need ~1k Ap for a level.

[Revamp Man]

There is no "compared to" it was both, now it's just one, so they didn't remove the endless grind they just nerfed it.

No there's compared to
The new system compared to the old system

IDGAF about the grinding needed for a 2ilvl increase when I would rather spend that time on getting resistance for bigger gains

Compared to

I need to grind the 700k AP before progression so I can equip the corrupted piece that is a 5% increase that's been in my bag because resistance is sooooo trickled down and I need it for the next mythic boss

[analmoose]

I honestly don't want any system where we can keep leveling the neck, at least for power. If anything, I'd rather see levels beyond a certain point be purely for cosmetic rewards. Maybe a couple FoS that give a title or transmog or something, perhaps it gives a currency that can be spent on a variety of things.



Technically, Vision's minor increase both the CDR (~.3% per level) and the SUPER TINY versatility (96 at HoA 69 for reference) you receive with each level. The catch is, the CDR caps out at 25%, and at 70, you're already at 21%. After your heart reaches 80, you're already at 24 out of 25%, and you're done in another 3-4 levels. After that, you only increase the versatility, which goes up at an incredibly slow rate.

You will hit the 25% CDR cap easily and naturally, and beyond that, the Versatility increase is so minor you wouldn't even notice.



Once you do the quest chain to unlock the Essence system and get your first essence, your heart is automatically boosted up to 35, as well as giving you all the Ilvl's that Champs rep used to give you. At 35, until around the early 50's, you only need ~1k Ap for a level.

oh damn, where do i find this quest chain, which is it?

[themaster24]

oh damn, where do i find this quest chain, which is it?

When you hit 120, Nathanos(Not sure of the alliance counterpart) should have a quest for you to start the Nazjatar chain (Send the Fleet). After your get into Newhome/Mezz and open the portal back to Dazar'alor/Boralus, Magni will pop up and tell you meet him back at the Chamber. That questline will be what you're looking for.

[Powerogue]

Did they somehow make it endless in the early 8.3 builds? Cause last I checked the AP grind ended effectively at 65.

[analmoose]

When you hit 120, Nathanos(Not sure of the alliance counterpart) should have a quest for you to start the Nazjatar chain (Send the Fleet). After your get into Newhome/Mezz and open the portal back to Dazar'alor/Boralus, Magni will pop up and tell you meet him back at the Chamber. That questline will be what you're looking for.

Beauty thx

[themaster24]

Did they somehow make it endless in the early 8.3 builds? Cause last I checked the AP grind ended effectively at 65.

In early 8.3 builds, in addition to unlocking a new minor essence slot at 75, you would unlock another bonus at 85. This bonus increased your Corruption Resistance by 1, and every level you after 85 added further resistance to the bonus, similar to Concordance. This presented as the primary means to push your Corruption Resistance beyond what your finished cloak and possibly new essences would provide, which would allow you to equip even more corrupted gear without the downsides.

[Nosgoth]

You literally shouldn't play an MMO if you find all reward systems to be a grind. It's literally bad for your health. Literally.

Don't strawman what I say.

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Sorry but you are so wrong: Do you know how many people do try to get their bloodsail buccaneer-reputation to revered just for an hat? The hat simply doesn't matter, but it's presige for them. As here, the ilvl on the necklace really doesn't matter. People do simply different things, even unlogical one, simply because they can do it.

Another example: think of Doubleagent: ever expansion he grinds his way up in the Pandaren starting zone; something that simply doesn't matter at all. But he's still grinding this stuff.

So yes, some people like grinding stuff that doesn't matter, simply because they can.

But for the progression it simply doesn't matter.

Apples and oranges.

[Corroc]

oh damn, where do i find this quest chain, which is it?

Its Nazjatar quest chain, when you unlock the quest hub you get a quest to go to hearth of azeroth.

[ecospherez]

Here's an idea, if you don't need to/want to do it, simply don't do it.

Mythic raider here. I don't even have my neck up to cap atm, i am 1 level off. If you cap the neck and feel you NEED to keep grinding +2 Ilvl's then that's up to you but i think you need help as it isn't needed for any of the content.

People in this thread like to complain about how this makes people grind endlessly but no one is actually saying they are doing that? so why are you so concerned?

Is anyone actually going to keep grinding the neck after the cap?

[Blackmist]

I wasn't going to do it anyway...

[Velerios]

Technically, Vision's minor increase both the CDR (~.3% per level) and the SUPER TINY versatility (96 at HoA 69 for reference) you receive with each level. The catch is, the CDR caps out at 25%, and at 70, you're already at 21%. After your heart reaches 80, you're already at 24 out of 25%, and you're done in another 3-4 levels. After that, you only increase the versatility, which goes up at an incredibly slow rate.

You will hit the 25% CDR cap easily and naturally, and beyond that, the Versatility increase is so minor you wouldn't even notice.

Thanks, i didn't know that the CDR caps out at 25%; Since 8.3 softcaps at 85; it's not even necessary to nerf anything just because of the point in versatility here and there. This shows even more that any grinding beyond 85 simply do not matter at all beyond what you already get naturally on AP. So in the end it's still just 2 ilvl, and that on a minor slot like the neckpiece.

Logically it doesn't matter at all, but here people stand on their principles: theoretically it's possible: WE NEED TO ENDLESS GRIND AP, EVEN IF IT'S NOT LOGICAL TO DO SO, BUT 2 ILVL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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People in this thread like to complain about how this makes people grind endlessly but no one is actually saying they are doing that? so why are you so concerned?

Because it's theoretically possible. Nobody will do it for progression, and there's no reason to, but just the theoretical implication makes people totally flip out because it's possible. Yes, that's easy to understand^^

Is anyone actually going to keep grinding the neck after the cap?

Oh, you can be sure that there will people who do it just because they can do it. But this does not matter at all, because they just do it for prestige. I'm sure that if the grind is endlessly, there will be a race to look how to get world first level 100 on it and maybe in a few years level 150 (but if the increase is exponential, every level will take ages, so i don't know if someone even managet to get this as high) and so on.

The question in the end is: will people grind endlessly: FOR SURE. Does it matter: NO.

[PaladinBash]

Soooooo a bunch of try-hards are going to still endlessly grind islands and shit for 2ilvl on their neck? And they're going to get maybe 1-2 levels ahead of me? Lol okay. Let them.

[ecospherez]

snip

It was more a question to everyone on this forum who has a problem with it, will they endlessly grind this neck?

If the answer is yes, then firstly, why? If it's because you have an urge to grind arbitrarily then you do you but don't complain about it. If the answer is because you need to, then you're wrong and you don't.

If the answer is no, then stop worrying about what everyone else does as it does not concern you.

My point was people get angry about some system in place that they aren't even doing them selves. They just think others are and it gets them angry which is just weird.

[Velerios]

If the answer is no, then stop worrying about what everyone else does as it does not concern you.

This is the logical answer, but don't forget, this is also the mmo-champion forums. Logic and mmo-champion contradict each other very often. Because there actually is the chance that you cannot get theoretically a group because they require neckpiece on ilvl 90 instead of 89. You are pulling down the group because you miss out 2 ilvl on a minor slot of a neckpiece, that's insane.

And yes, some idiot might require in on the retail-server, as they always require 15 ilvl higher than anything the content drops; that's group finding in a nutshell. But this will not change whatever happens. And yes, i think that it does not affect anyone at all here, but just the imagination that someone have maybe 2-4 ilvl more on the neckpiece makes them flip out, just because it's possible. It does not matter at all, but the theoretical implication it's possible is mind boggling for them.

[Doffen]

This is the logical answer, but don't forget, this is also the mmo-champion forums. Logic and mmo-champion contradict each other very often. Because there actually is the chance that you cannot get theoretically a group because they require neckpiece on ilvl 90 instead of 89. You are pulling down the group because you miss out 2 ilvl on a minor slot of a neckpiece, that's insane.

And yes, some idiot might require in on the retail-server, as they always require 15 ilvl higher than anything the content drops; that's group finding in a nutshell. But this will not change whatever happens. And yes, i think that it does not affect anyone at all here, but just the imagination that someone have maybe 2-4 ilvl more on the neckpiece makes them flip out, just because it's possible. It does not matter at all, but the theoretical implication it's possible is mind boggling for them.

Well said. Just a little example, before reset I tried to find a group for my newly dinged warrior, 390 ilvl, neck 37(O M G). Surprisingly, I got invited to a 4 KR. And the whole group was "undergeared". Usually if it's just after reset, people "really need" 420+ min for a +4. We 3-chested it with average 400 or so.

It's a tiny story for the player-base, but great step for mankind.

[Zeek Daniels]

They agreed that the endless grind need to stop somewhere.

Its not an endless grind if it ends. There was always a cap to the max amount of AP you could get per raid tier.

[owbu]

It was more a question to everyone on this forum who has a problem with it, will they endlessly grind this neck?

If the answer is yes, then firstly, why? If it's because you have an urge to grind arbitrarily then you do you but don't complain about it. If the answer is because you need to, then you're wrong and you don't.

If the answer is no, then stop worrying about what everyone else does as it does not concern you.

My point was people get angry about some system in place that they aren't even doing them selves. They just think others are and it gets them angry which is just weird.

I think there is a certain type of player that just likes to finish stuff. So they are asking blizzard to put more grinds with a clear endpoint into the game.
Which I think is pretty rational. It just doesn't feel as rewarding to reach the "meh, I quit, because it's good enough" point of a grind. The finish line is what is fun to reach in a game.

There is other types of course (the ones who like sandbox games I assume) who are perfectly fine with picking their own goal and I can see how this will look confusing to them.

[Trend]

Don't strawman what I say.

I didn't. You should not dodge what you said by pretending nonexistent argumentative devices were used. AP has been a light-touch continuous reward system (up until the too easy to reach cap.) If you're going to intimate that AP is or has been or could be expected to be some horrible grind, then I think you're playing the wrong kind of game.

[themaster24]

Thanks, i didn't know that the CDR caps out at 25%; Since 8.3 softcaps at 85; it's not even necessary to nerf anything just because of the point in versatility here and there. This shows even more that any grinding beyond 85 simply do not matter at all beyond what you already get naturally on AP. So in the end it's still just 2 ilvl, and that on a minor slot like the neckpiece.

Logically it doesn't matter at all, but here people stand on their principles: theoretically it's possible: WE NEED TO ENDLESS GRIND AP, EVEN IF IT'S NOT LOGICAL TO DO SO, BUT 2 ILVL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

Technically the soft cap is 80 now that they are making this change, but I feel that ultimately, none of this matters. If they cut out leveling after 80, giving you a 24% CDR, 1% more CDR is what, 1.5 seconds off the CD? Plus, like we've both noted, the 1-2 versatility you get every couple levels is pointless. Not to mention that the Heart gains something like 1-2 secondary and maybe 3-4 primary stat per level. When I noticed this early on in BFA it made the heart very VERY underwhelming.

This is where the Legion Weapon operated much better. Every level unlocked something more tangible. At max, you would upgrade a stat proc, which generally you could feel the increase of. You improved the weapon power with relics (instead of the AP increases) that gave not just big Ilvl boosts, but extra perks within the artifact itself (NLC drama notwithstanding). HoA levels feel totally hollow, and the only reason we ever want to level it is because of these arbitrary break points that are being held hostage. Prior to 8.2 it was unlocking your traits, and post 8.2 it's about unlocking your essence slots. But once you get 65 right now, the next 5 levels might as well not exist.