Mega-Thread: Impeachment Proceedings & Inquiry of Trump

[Belize]

Sooo... Sondland brought how many busses to throw Trump under.

[kaelleria]

Sooo... Sondland brought how many busses to throw Trump under.

All of them.

[Breccia]

All of them.

All of them?

Previews from various sites suggest that Sondland will say "yes, there was a quid pro quo, yes, everyone knew about it, yes, Pompeo knew about it, here are some emails." Basically, it's very hard to throw the driver under the bus.

Today could be very interesting. Pack a sandwich.

[Captain N]

I see we're off to a facepalm worthy start with Nunes again. Everything is Fake News and Democrats are all on a Witch Hunt.

[Themius]

Lol Nunes reading all the shit and being like “no it’s all fake!”

[Santti]

All of them?

Breccia, I love you. <3

[Themius]

Bam, he said clearly there was a quid pro quo, now what?

[Thekri]

Haha, Sondland is in full "Save my own ass" mode.

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

Bam, he said clearly there was a quid pro quo, now what?

Oh how my political willy is growing, it's about to burst.

But we all know the deal, Trump is going to say Sondland is a "neverTrumper" and that "I hardly know him".
Giuliani and Giulianis thugs worked up a quid pro quo, Sondland said he and his co-diplomats were ordered to work with Giuliani and that Giuliani was working on the direct authority of President Trump. This is damning as hell, I can't wait to hear Republicans defend this...

[kaelleria]

Haha, Sondland is in full "Save my own ass" mode.

He's worth between $78- $185m dollars. The worst thing that could happen to him is he could go to jail. He reaaaaaaaallly wants to avoid that.

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

Haha, Sondland is in full "Save my own ass" mode.

Is it wrong to be giddy? I got such a smile on my face, I might even pop a 20yr old Bourbon!

[Thekri]

Oh how my political willy is growing, it's about to burst.

But we all know the deal, Trump is going to say Sondland is a "neverTrumper" and that "I hardly know him".
Giuliani and Giulianis thugs worked up a quid pro quo, Sondland said he and his co-diplomats were ordered to work with Giuliani and that Giuliani was working on the direct authority of President Trump. This is damning as hell, I can't wait to hear Republicans defend this...

Yeah, this is going to be hilarious. That never Trumper that donate $1 million to Trump's inaugural fund, and bought his ambassadorship.

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

Sondland is naming everyone that was in the loop of knowing what was going on, going to be so much fun to see everyone squirm in the next couple days as they make up their mind to bail or stay with Trump.

[Endus]

Haha, Sondland is in full "Save my own ass" mode.

I mean, if his testimony is truthful and complete (a necessary caveat), what he's describing isn't particularly unusual; he's a civil servant, and would have to subsume his personal opinions as to the right path forward whenever orders came down from above that went in another direction. It's one of the biggest issues with being a civil servant; you're an expert in your office, and you can make recommendations to politicians, but then the politicians can make a decision for unprofessional and self-serving reasons, and you've got to abide by them. The only exceptions are if those orders are illegal violations of the public interest somehow; they can't order you to accept a bribe, or something, for instance.

So sure, saving his own ass, but it's largely because his ass isn't responsible, and he was doing his job, and he wants the target to be properly painted on the asses who issued the orders he didn't agree with, rather than himself for swallowing his pride and following those orders.

[Ashina]

I want to take a moment to support our good friend Thwart who must be going through a very rough series of days. May your many infractions be spiteful and vengeful.


Infracted.

[Thekri]

I mean, if his testimony is truthful and complete (a necessary caveat), what he's describing isn't particularly unusual; he's a civil servant, and would have to subsume his personal opinions as to the right path forward whenever orders came down from above that went in another direction. It's one of the biggest issues with being a civil servant; you're an expert in your office, and you can make recommendations to politicians, but then the politicians can make a decision for unprofessional and self-serving reasons, and you've got to abide by them. The only exceptions are if those orders are illegal violations of the public interest somehow; they can't order you to accept a bribe, or something, for instance.

So sure, saving his own ass, but it's largely because his ass isn't responsible, and he was doing his job, and he wants the target to be properly painted on the asses who issued the orders he didn't agree with, rather than himself for swallowing his pride and following those orders.

True, but this testimony sounds very much like Sondland heard that the GOP was planning on pinning everything on him, and sell him out. And he decided to shoot first. He wasn't nearly this forthcoming in his previous testimony.

[Flarelaine]

Feeling giddy over testimonies is fair, but don't turn it into mocking, baiting or spite. Also still keep it on topic.

[Draco-Onis]

Bam, he said clearly there was a quid pro quo, now what?

Now they try to paint him as a never Trumper secretly working for the democrats, the category 5 tweet and rage storm will probably make things worse for Trump.

[Endus]

True, but this testimony sounds very much like Sondland heard that the GOP was planning on pinning everything on him, and sell him out. And he decided to shoot first. He wasn't nearly this forthcoming in his previous testimony.

The impression I'm getting is more "I want to get all the facts on the fucking record before these fuckbags hang me out to dry" than "oh shit oh shit I gotta save my ass", is all I'm saying. He's not really being sensationalistic (some of the content is sensational), just fairly matter-of-fact. He's not really trying to assign blame, just establish what the chains of command and his orders were, and let that speak for itself.

[Breccia]

The impression I'm getting is more "I want to get all the facts on the fucking record before these fuckbags hang me out to dry" than "oh shit oh shit I gotta save my ass", is all I'm saying.

I'm mostly in agreement with you. But bear in mind, this is not Sondland's first rodeo. He has had both time and dedication to plan this out, so that "oh shit oh shit" can be portrayed as, well, what we're seeing. Unlike Trump, he might actually be a good actor who can plan ahead. Might. Either way, saying both in public and also under oath "yes, there was a quid pro quo, yes, everyone knew" is especially damning. Like "quit my job and flee to Kansas" level of damning.

And just so we're clear: the second anyone thusly accused also take the stand in public and refutes these charges, we'll have to address that. For now, the people who have refuted this in public have not done so under oath, and the people under oath in public have not refuted them.