[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[Elegiac]

and thats why Brexit happened, you gave the very angry people a chance to stick it to london and then they did. now were all trying to fix that shit as well as stop it happening again. if the south / london keeps ignoring the anger in the rest of the UK it will be the end of the UK and the end of England, mark my words.

Kay. I'm not sure what you think how pointing out the North cut off its nose to spite its face is supposed to make me feel, but it isn't "sympathetic".

And I've already pointed out that Brexit stands a very real chance of representing the final breakup of what was ultimately just an English empire, so waving that threat around also doesn't work.

[caervek]

Jeremy Corbyn , leader of the Labour party, is a remainer now?

It doesn't matter, he leads a remain pro-EU party. If they arte elected to government then any renegotiated deal will result in a confirmatory referrendum, which would return a Remain vote.

Less than 1 in 5 want to stay in the EU. An overwhelming majority for leave that, you can't spin it any other way.

You don't need to spin it because it's not true.

The only reason Leave won in 2016 was due to skewed turnout, more Leave supporters voted than Remain supporters, it's a feat impossible to repeat hence the high ranking Brexiteers being totally against any confirmatory vote (despite claiming they would win it).

To put it in perspective, if there was another vote tomorrow, and everyone voted as they felt in 2016 Remain would win simply due to the amount of young Remainers who have become old enough to vote plus the the old Leavers who have died since 2016 being enough to reverse the tiny Leave majority. Factor in the swing to Remain from Leave voters who realised they were lied to in 2016 ("leaving the EU doesn't mean leaving the customs union or the single market", etc) and the end result of a confirmatory referendum would be a firm Remain victory, hence Farage/Boris/etc being vehemently against one despite claiming they would win.

[Monster Hunter]

Kay. I'm not sure what you think how pointing out the North cut off its nose to spite its face is supposed to make me feel, but it isn't "sympathetic".

And I've already pointed out that Brexit stands a very real chance of representing the final breakup of what was ultimately just an English empire, so waving that threat around also doesn't work.

its not a threat or ment to gain sympathy its stating what the state of play is and whats going to happen unless southerners get there heads out of there arseholes and change there attitude, and sacrifice there monopoly on wealth and power to bring the rest of the UK in line with the south.

its not an english empire, its the empire of Wessex, the north was conquered just as the welsh were, the rumblings of breaking up England have already started https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...nt-sajid-javid

if we keep going down the path of ignoring the concerns and issues of the rest of the UK, Brexit will be just the beginning and by the time im old and grey the UK and quite possibly England will be just names in a history book.

[Kallisto]

Jeremy Corbyn , leader of the Labour party, is a remainer now? See I have those latest polls that are clearly for the remain side, Lib Dems and Greens, sitting at 19%. Everyone else either doesn't care or is for Brexit.

Less than 1 in 5 want to stay in the EU. An overwhelming majority for leave that, you can't spin it any other way.

Now let's get Brexit done, Vote Tory!

Everyone except Corbyn and a couple of no name back benchers have taken a remain position with second vote as means to get there. Labour is pretty much default remain position now.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics...-19-nov-update

Funny how 41% still wanting Brexit is the same as 4 in 5. My 2-year-old niece has better Math skills than you.

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its not a threat or ment to gain sympathy its stating what the state of play is and whats going to happen unless southerners get there heads out of there arseholes and change there attitude, and sacrifice there monopoly on wealth and power to bring the rest of the UK in line with the south.

its not an english empire, its the empire of Wessex, the north was conquered just as the welsh were, the rumblings of breaking up England have already started https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...nt-sajid-javid

if we keep going down the path of ignoring the concerns and issues of the rest of the UK, Brexit will be just the beginning and by the time im old and grey the UK and quite possibly England will be just names in a history book.

Honestly, I say bring it on. Bring in regional parliaments that better serve the north than London Centric one can. I say this as someone from the home counties. The North has been done over as badly as Scotland. Split up England, give the regions their own say, have the taxes taken from the regions stay in the regions.

I mean people harper on an English parliament, where would that be in? London, it will just be a lower level of parliament that basically will usurp westminster much like Yeltsin did Gorbachov in the last days of USSR if it came out.

[Monster Hunter]

Everyone except Corbyn and a couple of no name back benchers have taken a remain position with second vote as means to get there. Labour is pretty much default remain position now.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics...-19-nov-update

Funny how 41% still wanting Brexit is the same as 4 in 5. My 2-year-old niece has better Math skills than you.

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Honestly, I say bring it on. Bring in regional parliaments that better serve the north than London Centric one can. I say this as someone from the home counties. The North has been done over as badly as Scotland. Split up England, give the regions their own say, have the taxes taken from the regions stay in the regions.

I mean people harper on an English parliament, where would that be in? London, it will just be a lower level of parliament that basically will usurp westminster much like Yeltsin did Gorbachov in the last days of USSR if it came out.

it would start with a northern assembly some where like Leeds or manchester, and thats something there already talking about doing, that will grow like it did in scotland into a parliament of our own in the north, still under Westminster just as the Scots are, but free enough that an independence party can gain the power it needs to grow, referendum will follow after that and keep coming ever so often till the north breaks away and England ends, by then id expect scotland to have long gone and wales to have recently left as there further along.

and as per, the dirty southern toffs will sit and blame every one else, whilst the rational would know that if only the representatives had done there jobs properly instead of towing the london centrist party lines Brexit and everything after could have been avoided.

[dribbles]

It doesn't matter, he leads a remain pro-EU party. If they arte elected to government then any renegotiated deal will result in a confirmatory referrendum, which would return a Remain vote.



You don't need to spin it because it's not true.

The only reason Leave won in 2016 was due to skewed turnout, more Leave supporters voted than Remain supporters, it's a feat impossible to repeat hence the high ranking Brexiteers being totally against any confirmatory vote (despite claiming they would win it).

To put it in perspective, if there was another vote tomorrow, and everyone voted as they felt in 2016 Remain would win simply due to the amount of young Remainers who have become old enough to vote plus the the old Leavers who have died since 2016 being enough to reverse the tiny Leave majority. Factor in the swing to Remain from Leave voters who realised they were lied to in 2016 ("leaving the EU doesn't mean leaving the customs union or the single market", etc) and the end result of a confirmatory referendum would be a firm Remain victory, hence Farage/Boris/etc being vehemently against one despite claiming they would win.

We are having a confirmatory vote/peoples vote/general election call it what you will on 12th Dec. It took our Boris 4 or five attempts to corner chicken Jeremy to stop him running away and get it agreed through parliament so it could happen. It's the people who are voting, not squirrels on Dec 12th = a peoples vote.

Gifted to remainers by brexiteers for one last chance at staying in the EU.

And the only clear option for remainers is to vote Lib Dem which if the polls are correct, less than 1 in 6 will do so. It's no democracy at all if 15 or 16% get to overrule the 85% who will not vote to remain in the EU at the December peoples vote Brexit General Election.

[mojojojo202]

Honestly, I say bring it on. Bring in regional parliaments that better serve the north than London Centric one can. I say this as someone from the home counties. The North has been done over as badly as Scotland. Split up England, give the regions their own say, have the taxes taken from the regions stay in the regions.

I mean people harper on an English parliament, where would that be in? London, it will just be a lower level of parliament that basically will usurp westminster much like Yeltsin did Gorbachov in the last days of USSR if it came out.

If we are going to do this can we split London out from the rest of the South of England please.

London is going to dominate over anything in it's vicinity, it's needs are very different to the rest of South East England let alone, East Anglia or Cornwall for example.

[Monster Hunter]

Labour has not been in power since 1979 unless you count New Labour, which was in many ways more right-wing than the current Tory government. Of course they didn't do anything for the north, they were tories with some flowery rhetoric about social justice.

just like labour to make excuses, they wore the labour badge, were selected by the labour party, you either own them or admit you made a deal with the devil for power and cant be trusted.

[Calfredd]

We are having a confirmatory vote/peoples vote/general election call it what you will on 12th Dec. It took our Boris 4 or five attempts to corner chicken Jeremy to stop him running away and get it agreed through parliament so it could happen. It's the people who are voting, not squirrels on Dec 12th = a peoples vote.

Gifted to remainers by brexiteers for one last chance at staying in the EU.

And the only clear option for remainers is to vote Lib Dem which if the polls are correct, less than 1 in 6 will do so. It's no democracy at all if 48% get to overrule the 52% who will not vote to remain in the EU at the December peoples vote Brexit General Election.

Fixed for you.

[Kallisto]

If we are going to do this can we split London out from the rest of the South of England please.

London is going to dominate over anything in it's vicinity, it's needs are very different to the rest of South East England let alone, East Anglia or Cornwall for example.

I should have added that as yes London should be split from rest of South East. I mean if you're making regional parliaments. Having an area with population of Scotland/Wales/N.Ireland combined being within a greater area is insantiy.

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We are having a confirmatory vote/peoples vote/general election call it what you will on 12th Dec. It took our Boris 4 or five attempts to corner chicken Jeremy to stop him running away and get it agreed through parliament so it could happen. It's the people who are voting, not squirrels on Dec 12th = a peoples vote.

Gifted to remainers by brexiteers for one last chance at staying in the EU.

And the only clear option for remainers is to vote Lib Dem which if the polls are correct, less than 1 in 6 will do so. It's no democracy at all if 15 or 16% get to overrule the 85% who will not vote to remain in the EU at the December peoples vote Brexit General Election.

A) You know that's not how FPTP works which you love so much.

B) Even if true 40% which the Tories will likely get should not out vote 60% who will vote against BOJO and co.

[JohnBrown1917]

just like labour to make excuses, they wore the labour badge, were selected by the labour party, you either own them or admit you made a deal with the devil for power and cant be trusted.

Do you know that a parties leadership can change? Just wondering..


Would be funny if they did not though, labour parties all over europe would still be socialist, that would actually be nice. A tad undemocratic and i'm not sure how zombies can rule, but eh, whatever.

[Monster Hunter]

Do you know that a parties leadership can change? Just wondering..


Would be funny if they did not though, labour parties all over europe would still be socialist, that would actually be nice. A tad undemocratic and i'm not sure how zombies can rule, but eh, whatever.

You do know that the leader is elected by the members right?

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So what exactly are you proposing? Sulk pathetically for another few decades while the Tories screw you over some more?

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Wow if only Labour had held a referendum on Northern independence in 2004. Oh wait, they did, and it was rejected by 77% of the population.

Do you know anything? It is like talking to a teenager.

You k ow that was 15 years ago, and befor the recession times have changed, sentiments have changed. It also wasn't independance, or all of the north, just a vote for a Yorkshire assembly.

[Mayhem]

Wow if only Labour had held a referendum on Northern independence in 2004. Oh wait, they did, and it was rejected by 77% of the population.

Do you know anything? It is like talking to a teenager.

Damn, you know you can google this shit, it wasn't a vote on independence. Can't figure out the difference between decentralization and independence?

[Kronik85]

Ok guys it's time to see quite how exactly Jeremy "RUIN THE ECONOMY!" Corbyn's manifesto will RUIN THE ECONOMY!! Will it be realistically costed? Will it contain a pledge for free ice cream? I don't know but I do know one thing, no matter what it contains it will definitely promise to RUIN THE ECONOMY!!!

[draykorinee]

Corbyn wants to raise taxes and increase spending. He wants to destroy the economy.

Boris wants to cut taxes and increase spending. Tumbleweed.

Corbyn and Labour clearly a vote against leaving, maybe not a true remain party, say they'll have another referendum, so dribbles can fuck off with that shit.

[JohnBrown1917]

Corbyn wants to raise taxes and increase spending. He wants to destroy the economy.

Boris wants to cut taxes and increase spending. Tumbleweed.

Corbyn and Labour clearly a vote against leaving, maybe not a true remain party, say they'll have another referendum, so dribbles can fuck off with that shit.

You clearly can't have a proper economy without focusing on the rich and ignoring the working class.

[Kronik85]

Corbyn wants to raise taxes and increase spending. He wants to destroy the economy.

Boris wants to cut taxes and increase spending. Tumbleweed.

Corbyn and Labour clearly a vote against leaving, maybe not a true remain party, say they'll have another referendum, so dribbles can fuck off with that shit.

Well someone is obviously not up on their Reagonmics! Tax cuts actually mean more revenue for the Government, just check across the pond for the fantastic job Trump's tax cut has done in reducing the US deficit.

Corbyn plans to "RUIN THE ECONOMY!!!!" by shamelessly attacking our Monarchy when asked whether paedophiles should go to jail.

Nobody is above the law

[draykorinee]

I have to apologies to Diane Abbott, this interview is worse than anything she's done.

Well someone is obviously not up on their Reagonmics! Tax cuts actually mean more revenue for the Government, just check across the pond for the fantastic job Trump's tax cut has done in reducing the US deficit.

Lol indeed.

[Mormolyce]

And the only clear option for remainers is to vote Lib Dem which if the polls are correct, less than 1 in 6 will do so. It's no democracy at all if 15 or 16% get to overrule the 85% who will not vote to remain in the EU at the December peoples vote Brexit General Election.

Take your pick:

Twice as many people now think it would have been better never to have held a referendum on Brexit than believe it was a good idea, according to the latest Opinium poll for the Observer.

Asked to consider the difficulties the government has had in reaching an agreement, 57% of UK adults surveyed said that they believed it would have been better not to have had a public vote in June 2016.

This compares with 29% of voters who believe it was right to hold the referendum on whether the UK should stay in or leave the EU.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ad-over-labour

To leave the EU 41%
To remain a member of the EU 47%

https://whatukthinks.org/eu/question...ld-you-vote-2/

Almost half (47%) said they wanted a public vote on a final deal, as opposed to a third (34%) who said they did not. Once don’t knows are eliminated there is a 58% majority for a second referendum.

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/p...9-10?r=US&IR=T

Or better yet, look at a meta-analysis:

The YouGov analysis for the Evening Standard of 300 surveys shows “concrete” evidence that the country shifted against quitting the European bloc in the year after the June 2016 referendum and has steadfastly stuck to this position ever since.

One of the most striking findings is that 204 out of 226 polls since July 2017 have shown Remain ahead, with just seven for Leave, and 15 ties.

So far this year, just one poll in the series has put Leave ahead, compared to 74 for staying in the EU.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/poli...-a4257476.html

[Monster Hunter]

How the hell are you going to get to full independence without a sitting parliament, dopey? Your contingency planning is worse than the Tories.

The assembly was rejected by 77%. No one wanted it. The other referendums that were supposed to take place in the north polled even lower support levels. That has not changed. There is no support for northern independence. If such a thing should ever emerge it would only ever happen under a Labour government.

You are making no sense at all. Everything you say is poorly constructed from ill-thought tribalism, you are esentially a Brexiteer with a whippet.

So just like Scotland a couple decades ago?

Wanna keep chatting or you gonna help promote the north having equal opportunity's? Then they don't follow the same path as Scotland and Wales.