Blizzard - you can do better („Blizz hates healers”)

[Mirishka]

Just like in the case of m+ affixes, the corription debuffs seem to be a direct responsibility for the healers. Players will probably balance on the edge of survivalibity and guess who is going to have to handle all of the slows (and late escapes from sht on the ground and AoEs),aggressive tendrills, corrupted zones, chasing spawns.
Well - in a way everything affects everyone. I totally get it. But these ideas again and again (like in m+) affects healers directly: you get dmg. How about some other ideas? „Your next spell or hit has 10% chance to have 0 effect” or something. What do You think guys? Any early experience from PTR?
Long story short: dps players care for meters in the first place. Affect the meters directly, Blizz. Explains like: „too much corruption to handle for u, m8, here are the logs” are always difficult to discuss.
Best
ML

If you think that Blizzard is combing over this troll haven of a forum for feedback, you're laughably mistaken.

[Scrysis]

Mythic Plus affixes almost all seem to be designed around screwing over healers.

Bursting: Let's AoE everything down and blame the healer for not being able to out-heal a stacking, percentage-based debuff.
Grevious: Let's stand in mechanics or forget to interrupt, and then blame the healer for yet another stacking damage dot debuff, this time one that only goes away when healed to 90%.
Volcanic: Let's make the healer play dance dance revolution while trying to heal everything else.
Quaking: Let's deal guaranteed damage, AND keep the healer from casting!
Explosive: Let's ignore the orbs, then accuse the healer of being shitty when they can't heal the explosions on top of all of the regular, souped up dungeon mechanics.
Sanguine: Let's have everyone dance in and out of the really nasty red pools so that the healer can't catch a break between pulls.
Necrotic: Let's put a stacking debuff on the tank that they don't even realize until they're at 20% health and can't be healed. . . with a damage dot from necrotic itself.
Raging: Try and keep the tank alive when the DPS pretend that it's opposite day and suddenly you have a 6 stack mob beating on your tank like the wrath of god.

I want to see some affixes designed to punish DPS, not healers for once. Maybe a suppression affix that reduces dps by half unless you stand in some spawned circles. Or one like quaking except instead of damage to you, you're pacified for 10 seconds if you get hit by someone else's circle.

[mojusk]

If someone isn't avoiding damage they can avoid, I'm not healing them.

lets take the sharknado boss in freehold.
im gonna stand in that sharknado and dps for as long as my healer can keep me and everyone else alive.
and any good healer will be fine with it.
more dps, things die faster, better chance of completing in time.
of course there are scenarios where the damage taken/damage done ratio aint worth it.
but your attitude is garbage, and wont get you far.

[CrawlFromThePit]

Just like in the case of m+ affixes, the corription debuffs seem to be a direct responsibility for the healers. Players will probably balance on the edge of survivalibity and guess who is going to have to handle all of the slows (and late escapes from sht on the ground and AoEs),aggressive tendrills, corrupted zones, chasing spawns.
Well - in a way everything affects everyone. I totally get it. But these ideas again and again (like in m+) affects healers directly: you get dmg. How about some other ideas? „Your next spell or hit has 10% chance to have 0 effect” or something. What do You think guys? Any early experience from PTR?
Long story short: dps players care for meters in the first place. Affect the meters directly, Blizz. Explains like: „too much corruption to handle for u, m8, here are the logs” are always difficult to discuss.
Best
ML

Don't play with retards. I know this shrinks the potential player pool to group with by about 92% but at least you won't run into these issues.

[mojusk]

I want to see some affixes designed to punish DPS, not healers for once. Maybe a suppression affix that reduces dps by half unless you stand in some spawned circles. Or one like quaking except instead of damage to you, you're pacified for 10 seconds if you get hit by someone else's circle.

less dps, mobs alive longer, tank take more dmg, you heal more.
but dont worry about it, you seem to be a pain in the ass affix on your own, who punish your entire group by being a whiny obnoxious douche.

[ymn]

If someone isn't avoiding damage they can avoid, I'm not healing them.

Actually, that's one of the best ways to "carry" a group as a healer, and I've been added so many times by actually nice and good players to play with me again simply because I go out of my way to ensure everyone's gucci.

You're one of those tanks in leveling dungeons who rages when someone pulls a mob.

Unfortunately, such an elitist attitude won't get you that far.

[huth]

Actually, that's one of the best ways to "carry" a group as a healer, and I've been added so many times by actually nice and good players to play with me again simply because I go out of my way to ensure everyone's gucci.

You're one of those tanks in leveling dungeons who rages when someone pulls a mob.

Unfortunately, such an elitist attitude won't get you that far.

It's a matter of degree. If somebody accidentally messes up, that's one thing. If somebody needlessly stands in every puddle they can find, that's another, and you're not doing anybody a favour by coddling the latter.

[Marrilaife]

This guy gets it. So far, the blunt of any added difficulty is upon healers and tanks to deal with... and then everyone goes surprised_pikachu.jpg when tanks and healers are so few and between in the group finder.

I don't think the game is balanced around pugs.

And there isn't shortage of tanks and healers. There's just an overabundance of dps, because the notion in the community is that dps are absolved from any responsibility. I vented on some other forum how I'm disappointed with having dps barely outdps a tank and deplete a +16 because 2 of them did circa 25k dps each, and people jumped on me that I'm being a dick because if a dps didn't die from stupid shit and wasn't rude, then he's fine.

Nope, sorry, as a dps you're meant to actually do dps, not just move out of the fires and refrain from raging. You are also expected to use your interrupts, cleanses, purges, stuns, defensive cooldowns, offensive cooldowns on dangerous mobs / phases and so forth.

The difficulty is added to everyone, just the community is fast to blame tanks / healers and have elevated expectations towards them, while accepting low standards for dps.

There is a death recap, if you die from standing in corruption puddle or from being eaten by the "chase me ghost", then you should take the blame, not a healer who didn't babysit you through all these mechanics.

In organized group play, you should decide together how much spare healing the team has and whether it's worth getting extra corruption for the dps stats.

[Nefarious Tea]

Healers job is to heal. I mean if you don't like to heal then don't play a healer....

OP's complaint isn't that healers have to heal. It's that idiots will stand in bad, die, and blame the healer.

Even more than tanking, healing is a thankless job.

[Scrysis]

less dps, mobs alive longer, tank take more dmg, you heal more.
but dont worry about it, you seem to be a pain in the ass affix on your own, who punish your entire group by being a whiny obnoxious douche.

You clearly don't understand the ins-and-outs of healing and when it is stressful and when it isn't. I'm guessing that you don't heal. EVER. So please allow me to assist.


High stress for healers: High spike damage, unpredictable spike damage, not being able to cast.

Low stress for healers: Consistent, low hps damage and being able to cast.

So, to counter what you said, a DPS decrease would actually be easier for healers than, say, bursting. Damage on the party would stay consistent, and is MUCH easier than the large hps requirement for multiple stacks of bursting. Or when explosive orbs go off. There is only one mob that I can think of off the top of my head that would make problems harder the longer it is up, and PUG DPS normally ignore it and wipe groups anyways.

You might say, "Get better DPS!" And you would be correct! In the example I gave, a good dps would not have any dps loss, and the fact that you commented at all means you missed the entire point of my post.

What is the point? Easy. For mechanics that are reliant upon good play and organization by the DPS, such as explosive, raging, and bursting, it's the healers who deal with the fallout when mechanics are ignored or failed. And that is bad game design. That means you literally have dps that wander around not realizing that if they don't DPS those bursting orbs, the group is going to wipe. Or that if they don't single target mobs during bursting week that the group is going to wipe. Healers can compensate for some mistakes, but without a cause-and-effect understanding, a lot of dps just aren't going to understand what to do.

I kind of wish we had some basic tank/heal/dps trials with regards to M+ affixes these days.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't think the game is balanced around pugs.

And there isn't shortage of tanks and healers. There's just an overabundance of dps, because the notion in the community is that dps are absolved from any responsibility. I vented on some other forum how I'm disappointed with having dps barely outdps a tank and deplete a +16 because 2 of them did circa 25k dps each, and people jumped on me that I'm being a dick because if a dps didn't die from stupid shit and wasn't rude, then he's fine.

Nope, sorry, as a dps you're meant to actually do dps, not just move out of the fires and refrain from raging. You are also expected to use your interrupts, cleanses, purges, stuns, defensive cooldowns, offensive cooldowns on dangerous mobs / phases and so forth.

The difficulty is added to everyone, just the community is fast to blame tanks / healers and have elevated expectations towards them, while accepting low standards for dps.

There is a death recap, if you die from standing in corruption puddle or from being eaten by the "chase me ghost", then you should take the blame, not a healer who didn't babysit you through all these mechanics.

In organized group play, you should decide together how much spare healing the team has and whether it's worth getting extra corruption for the dps stats.

Thank you! I get so frustrated when dps don't use stuns or interrupts, especially when it is on a mechanic that will actively kill the group otherwise.

[TriggeredKid]

Shit post? Healers are extremely overpowered role wise.

[ID811717]

Mythic Plus affixes almost all seem to be designed around screwing over healers.

Bursting: Let's AoE everything down and blame the healer for not being able to out-heal a stacking, percentage-based debuff.
Grevious: Let's stand in mechanics or forget to interrupt, and then blame the healer for yet another stacking damage dot debuff, this time one that only goes away when healed to 90%.
Volcanic: Let's make the healer play dance dance revolution while trying to heal everything else.
Quaking: Let's deal guaranteed damage, AND keep the healer from casting!
Explosive: Let's ignore the orbs, then accuse the healer of being shitty when they can't heal the explosions on top of all of the regular, souped up dungeon mechanics.
Sanguine: Let's have everyone dance in and out of the really nasty red pools so that the healer can't catch a break between pulls.
Necrotic: Let's put a stacking debuff on the tank that they don't even realize until they're at 20% health and can't be healed. . . with a damage dot from necrotic itself.
Raging: Try and keep the tank alive when the DPS pretend that it's opposite day and suddenly you have a 6 stack mob beating on your tank like the wrath of god.

- Bursting: Few people will blame you after repeatedly extending high bursting stacks. On the other hand, it's a good chance for you to practice burst healing. Most bad situations can be saved if you anticipate and prepare for them.
- Grievous: You should have 0 problems healing grievous on everyone. But you have the right to complain that you lose most of your DPS because some damage dealer gets grievous once every 10 seconds.
- Forced movement away from Volcanic, and spell-casting interrupts from Quaking: both become trivial once you get comfortable with the game (learn dungeons, learn your spec, stop tunnel visioning and gain awareness). Very easy to avoid and to play around, with basically no HPS loss. Quaking is annoying for healers who deal damage in melee because healers should give more space to real damage dealers and lose their own DPS.
- Explosives: Few people will blame you even if they die from a single explosion. It's a very fun affix for MW monks and H paladins, as they can solo most of the explosives for the group. Other healer specs may rightfully find it annoying because they are less suited to deal with explosives.
- Sanguine: Whatever. You can keep doing damage and defer healing to a much later time, if no unavoidable incoming damage is anticipated.
- Necrotic: Has nothing to do with healing, and healing will never get blamed. But it's one of the affixes that forces you to learn more of your toolkit (Ring of Peace, Typhoon, Shining Force, and other utility).
- Raging (you meant Bolstering): Few people will blame you for bolstered mobs.

If people keep blaming you for Bolstering, Necrotic, Explosive and extended Bursting - consider joining a different group for the next dungeon. But first, finish the dungeon and try to learn how to carry a group that fails on all of these. If you mostly play a healer and you're not already a rank 1 player, trying to fix the emergency situations is how you learn to be a better player. You do learn a lot this way.

[Byleth]

If someone isn't avoiding damage they can avoid, I'm not healing them.

This. So much this.

You get one or two free passes, but if it becomes obvious to me that you're ignoring a mechanic, the healing is not coming your way. Probably at all for the rest of the run.

[ID811717]

This. So much this.

You get one or two free passes, but if it becomes obvious to me that you're ignoring a mechanic, the healing is not coming your way. Probably at all for the rest of the run.

That's a lot of drama and likely a longer run. Why would you punish yourself and the other 3 players in group just because of one bad apple?
I would never hurt myself just so I can hurt someone else.
The optimal solution is to carry the bad player to the end, and never play with them again.

[ecospherez]

Shaman here. Resto/Ele. Play both as much as each other.

Key is communication. DPS'ing is easier though, no doubt about it, responsibility just isn't as high as healer.

Depending on what week it is before we start i just hit a macro that says something along the lines of. 'Hey everyone, remember this week it's bursting, AOE down and then single target, don't get too many stacks' - Just saying little things like that go a long way.

Re Mojusk above who's talking about not moving out of bad things just so he can continue to DPS, he is the epitome of a bad dps. Probably highest on deaths, lowest on interrupts, most damage taken after a tank and chances are his dps isn't top because of the deaths.

[Byleth]

That's a lot of drama and likely a longer run. Why would you punish yourself and the other 3 players in group just because of one bad apple?
I would never hurt myself just so I can hurt someone else.
The optimal solution is to carry the bad player to the end, and never play with them again.

I'm a good enough healer that it wouldn't effect my group, and in the rare cases where it would, I just suck it up and block after.

Usually though, the others notice what is going on quickly and sort the DPS issue for me.

[ONCHEhap]

I feel the same as a tank. It seems like a lot of mechanics that are supposed to be for the dps, the tanks and healers have to deal with the consequences. Dps not killing mobs at the same time? Here, have some big extra mobs to deal with. Dps don't stagger mob kills? Here have some more healing. Dps take damage with grievous? Here, heal some more. There should indeed be more mechanics that punish dps players directly, like: Don't kill mobs at the same time? They take 10% reduced damage per stack. Got hit by a mechanic? Deal 50% less damage for 10 seconds. Give dps some mechanics to deal with.

DPS are the vast majority of players and are also more prone to whining than other roles,so Blizzard has to cater to them when they throw tantrums because they actually have to do something more complex than hitting 3 buttons

[Doffen]

I feel more responsible as dps than anything else really. If I fail I'll blame the healer of course, but if you as dps fail doing the dps you should do, you make it harder for your group.

Damage Dealers are the most important role these days. The more dps, the easier the fight becomes. Corruption is more dps. Most healers won't notice the difference. If someone takes damage, you fucking heal it.

Remember when people funneled gear to tanks back in the day? Hated it. My gear. Dps gear!

[gobio]

Get real. The core discussion is, do you want the GAME ITSELF to tell the group who is to blame. Or do you want the group itself to figure it out.

If the GAME is to babysit you, there are plenty of ways, instant kill a player if enough mistake is made, big ass graphics with a gigantic arrow on top of a DPS that trigger shit.

Otherwise the group is to figure out who to blame, there are 3 dps and 1 healer, what do you think the democratic conclusion is o.O

[Nnyco]

Taking extra dmg to deal extra dmg is totally fine as long as people dont die, any complains about that are just noise that youre too lazy to heal.