Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Aldo Hawk]

Not sure why it seems to be a hard concept to grasp for some of the people in this thread.

They totally understand it.

The problem is that they still create trouble about it because it's mildly complex so they can continue some kind of an argument.

It's one abuse of the logos after another endlessly.

[Ielenia]

Not sure why it seems to be a hard concept to grasp for some of the people in this thread.

There is already a name that encompasses all the high elf, blood elf and void elf groups: Thalassian elves.

But the anti-high-elf arguers refuses to use that name because, as far as I can understand, using said name may be akin to admitting that high elves and blood elves are not the same group anymore. Which is why (again, in my opinion) they need to hammer on this "blood elves are high elves" thing because it's the entire foundation of their grievances against the pro-high-elf requests.

Without it, most, if not all, of their arguments end up with basically no leg to stand on.

[Alanar]

Yup and these also aren't Blood Elves and have never been

- Vereesa Windrunner
- Alleria Windrunner
- Auric
- Silver Covenant
- Highvale elves
- High Elf Shieldbearer (Pally Order Hall)
- 7th Legion Battle Mages/Shieldmages
- Various other named NPCs like Yvera Dawnwing/Frostfencer Seraphi/that mage trainer in SW/ etc etc

These are the High Elves being asked for on the Alliance. Most pro High Elf peeps don't give a fuck about Blood Elves.

It'd be like trying to tell someone who only loves Zandalari Trolls "hey! Darkspear exist too! Hey Darkspear are getting new customizations!" that does fuck-all for someone who only loves Zandalari Trolls.

Not sure why it seems to be a hard concept to grasp for some of the people in this thread.

Oke, but they look exactly the same and should be besides the side effect of green eyes from past teachings. One thing that is quite weird you said is : most fans dont give a fuck aboit blood elves? high elves entire herritage and story is all high/blood elf, I mean everything is a copy of blood elves, but with the color blue. Maybe I am just confused to what this is about atm.. but this is in general with the high elf thread for most people.

Zandalari troll /darkspear look differnt as they should be.

Nothing is wrong here I guess working as intended

All blood elves are high elves, not all high elves are blood elves goes the saying.

[FlubberPuddy]

Oke, but they look exactly the same and should be besides the side effect of green eyes from past teachings. One thing that is quite weird you said is : most fans dont give a fuck aboit blood elves? high elves entire herritage and story is all high/blood elf, I mean everything is a copy of blood elves, but with the color blue. Maybe I am just confused to what this is about atm.. but this is in general with the high elf thread for most people.

These responses are by sentences.

1) Kul'Tiran looked exactly the same until the expansion in which they were focused on. Meaning: Blizzard only decides to change things when its relevant to what they want to use currently.

2) While Blood Elf/High Elf history was the same, they've diverged from that for a long while. Since WoW came out we've had so many developments happen within a few game years, High Elves that have stayed within the Alliance (which by the way this group of Alliance High Elves has existed before WoW even came out, per WC3) that their culture/values/personality traits/and looks will be different from Blood Elves.

2a) Another point is that different groups within a racial shared history doesn't mean much, Void Elves for instance share history with everything Blood Elves did AND High Elves did, that doesn't mean Void Elves are relegated and/or beholden to their past, just like with the Darnassians that left Teldrassil and over the course of a boat ride changed to Thalassians.

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Everything is in place for Blizzard to go ahead and make more changes to Alliance High Elves if they pursue the path toward making them playable on Alliance.

What is so strange is people acting as if Alliance High Elves cannot change in any way, shape, or form when there's plenty of examples over the course of the game of changes happening to groups within instants.

Kul'Tirans are the most blatantly relate-able one that knocks down the "but they look exactly the same and can't be different" because it only took Blizzard 1 expansion to suddenly come up with a different design for Kul'Tirans. It's also a society that shows "regular human builds" (aka Stormwind kind that we play) as amongst that particular society as well.

Nothing's stopping Blizzard from doing the same to Alliance High Elves, which is why it's strange when people act as if a racial group cannot change at all ever. Blizzard can never do it indeed, I just don't get the mindset that appears to show Alliance High Elves must stay in some sort of stasis when they've been evolving their story differently than the Blood Elves at WoW's inception.

Key moments have been

1) Being amongst the Alliance as allies and enemies of the Horde
2) Feuding against the Blood Elves
3) Budding friendships with Draenei and Dwarves (and Humans but that always existed)
4) Being called out by Elisande separately from the Blood Elves (she speaks to High Elves and Blood Elves there with differing mindsets, 'I thought you of all groups would understand my approach' to the Blood Elves because the mindset of survival/power is with them, 'You don't deserve to call yourself High Elves' to High Elves because of how intercultural they are)
5) A sect of High Elves who chose to forgo using magic at all, something a Blood Elf would never dream of doing (could even be capable of?)

There's a lot that has happened since the High Elf/Blood Elf divergence and again I remind that Kul'Tiran suddenly looked different because Blizzard wanted it so and their reason was "due to the environment" and idk about you but I'm sure the super infused with magic environment of Silvermoon is way different than the portions of the EK where Alliance High Elves reside.

- - - Updated - - -

I think more people need to read this summary of High Elf relations in regards to Blood Elves from the Wowpedia.

While high elves and blood elves are physiologically the same race,[10] high elves generally do not get along with their blood elf brethren. This is owed in part to differing allegiances, as most modern high elves remained loyal to the Alliance following the Second War, disobeying royal edicts from their reclusive masters to return home.[7][49] The blood elves are primarily loyal to their own, and remained in Quel'Thalas, later forming an alliance with the Horde. Other high elves are exiles, having been banished from Quel'Thalas after the return of Grand Magister Rommath from Outland. The practice of draining arcane magic was considered immoral by these elves, who opposed its use. Unwilling to lead a nation divided, the newly-named regent of Quel'Thalas, Lor'themar Theron, chose to exile the dissenters.[11]

Kael'thas's teachings caused some moral contention between the two peoples. By embracing them, the blood elves prioritized their survival, health, and well-being; they believed this strength was needed to see Quel'Thalas restored, as the kingdom had remained a wasteland while the elves were weakened by their addiction.[50] By refusing, the high elves prioritized their pride and personal ethics, even to their own detriment; they believe this was the moral choice.

With the betrayal of Prince Kael'thas and the restoration of the Sunwell, Lor'themar has taken steps to re-establish cordial relations between the blood and high elves. However, these efforts have had mixed results. Aethas Sunreaver, Halduron Brightwing and Tae'thelan Bloodwatcher have also expressed an interest in mending relations between the children of Silvermoon, though to what extent appears to vary depending on the individual. The high elves, or at least Alleria's high elves, have been granted a representative at the Sunwell in the form of Auric Sunchaser. While he does not consider himself a blood elf, he seems to have little quarrel with the sin'dorei, whom he calls the "children of Silvermoon".[51]

Although the only physical difference between blood and high elves is their eye color - blood elves have glowing green eyes - this is not an indication of their quarrel. Fel magic played no apparent role in the elves' splintering; in fact, its use was hidden from most of the blood elves.[8] Glowing green eyes is the high elven body's natural reaction to spending time around fel magic,[52] which was used in the Magisters' rebuilding efforts in lieu of the destroyed Sunwell's power.[53] Like the orcs, any high elf who spends enough time around fel magic will acquire glowing green eyes.

The feud between high elves and blood elves is most visible in the conflict between the elven factions of the Kirin Tor, the Silver Covenant and the Sunreavers.[54]

https://wow.gamepedia.com/High_elf

Almost by nature, if you're a fan of wanting to play a High Elf you would despise Blood Elves (not playing one, but in terms of their nature, like how Orcs are opposed to Night Elves and wanna get their trees, etc).

That's why it's even more weird to continue suggestions of "just play a Blood Elf" cuz it's like telling someone of an opposing Sports Team to go cheer for the rival team.

[Obelisk Kai]

No.

Blood Elves are't High Elves anymore.

They discarded this name and lost the right to pretend that they are High Elves. They are not. The High Elves largest population centers are Dalaran and Quel'Danil, and they are loyal to the Alliance, not the corrupt nobility and rulers of Quel'thalas, and have proven that they have severed their ties with their former brethren entirely.

Saying that Blood Elves are High Elves is akin to say that if you want to play an Eredar (as in, from the Legion, a man'ari), you must play a Draeneï. It is dumb as fuck, because beyond their physical appearance, the two groups have next to nothing in common in values, belief and character.

Blood Elves are High Elves. Blood Elf is pretty much synonymous with thalassian elf now, they are the overwhelming component of the race. It used to the phrase 'High Elf' was synonymous with thalassian elf, but now what a high elf is making a political point. That is all the name means, it is politicised and devoid any further differentiation.

The high elves did not sever the relations either, as their pilgrims at the Sunwell made very clear.
Dalaran is a human city that plays host to a few high elven exiles.
Quel'Danil is a hut. To define it as a population centre is akin to me describing my local supermarket as a population centre because there are people there.

And the Eredar/Draenei comparison falls flat because an Eredar and a Draenei are actually meaningfully differentiated. The Eredar are fel corrupted Demons, the thalassian counterpart to an Eredar would be a Felblood Elf. A Draenei is an uncorrupted Eredar. The real comparison is between Humans in Stormwind and Humans in the Defias Brotherhood, who are physically identical (just as Blood Elves and the exiles are) but divided by political allegiance.

[Aldo Hawk]

Blood Elves are High Elves. Blood Elf is pretty much synonymous with thalassian elf now, they are the overwhelming component of the race. It used to the phrase 'High Elf' was synonymous with thalassian elf, but now what a high elf is making a political point. That is all the name means, it is politicised and devoid any further differentiation.

The high elves did not sever the relations either, as their pilgrims at the Sunwell made very clear.
Dalaran is a human city that plays host to a few high elven exiles.
Quel'Danil is a hut. To define it as a population centre is akin to me describing my local supermarket as a population centre because there are people there.

And the Eredar/Draenei comparison falls flat because an Eredar and a Draenei are actually meaningfully differentiated. The Eredar are fel corrupted Demons, the thalassian counterpart to an Eredar would be a Felblood Elf. A Draenei is an uncorrupted Eredar. The real comparison is between Humans in Stormwind and Humans in the Defias Brotherhood, who are physically identical (just as Blood Elves and the exiles are) but divided by political allegiance.

Yes we all know that.

High elves are not Blood elves. High elves are not playable. That is what is not understood here.

[Thalassian Bob]

Encountered another noble high elf exile this morning who I hadn't seen before. It appears she is a member of a proud and downtrodden group - the Unethical Adventurers.

[FlubberPuddy]

Encountered another noble high elf exile this morning who I hadn't seen before. It appears she is a member of a proud and downtrodden group - the Unethical Adventurers.

Interesting, and they're all Alliance races it appears

[Thalassian Bob]

Interesting, and they're all Alliance races it appears

Hehe! That they are! I'm not someone who denies that likely the bulk of high elves still left alive in Azeroth are either Alliance-leaning or full-blown patriotic supporters of the organisation. I just think that those who advocate for the introduction of Alliance-aligned high elves as a playable group need to remove their rose-tinted spectacles regarding the morality of these Quel'dorei stragglers.

[FlubberPuddy]

Hehe! That they are! I'm not someone who denies that likely the bulk of high elves still left alive in Azeroth are either Alliance-leaning or full-blown patriotic supporters of the organisation. I just think that those who advocate for the introduction of Alliance-aligned high elves as a playable group need to remove their rose-tinted spectacles regarding the morality of these Quel'dorei stragglers.

Agreed. Even in the wowpedia page I linked it describes both the separate paths the Blood Elves and High Elves took in neutral ways.

Because it really is a point of view with no inherently “correct” “incorrect” “false” “true” “bad” “good” decision. It just is what it is.

[Thalassian Bob]

Agreed. Even in the wowpedia page I linked it describes both the separate paths the Blood Elves and High Elves took in neutral ways.

Because it really is a point of view with no inherently “correct” “incorrect” “false” “true” “bad” “good” decision. It just is what it is.

Yeah, just like in the real world people make decisions based on their own circumstances and taking into consideration the people and things that are important to them.

I don't want to linger on real-world politics, but I actually think the Thalassian schism has a lot of parallels to the recent European Union membership referendum in my own country (UK). People on both sides of the argument had noble and not-so-noble reasons for choosing the way they did. In the end, people had to way up the pros and cons, pick a side, and hope that their decision would work out best for them and theirs.

[Frenchvince]

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comment...wlands_darker/

This is really the kind of personalization that the blood elves should have, at least it will not encroach on the identity of the "high elves of the alliance".

[Aldo Hawk]

https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comment...wlands_darker/

This is really the kind of personalization that the blood elves should have, at least it will not encroach on the identity of the "high elves of the alliance".

I would love these.

Red, green, and/or golden runic tattoos, it's just so fitting yet they didn't added them for over a decade, damn...

This way you add even more layers onto the Blood elf theme while allowing a potential High elf AR to have another kind of tattoos. With other more fitting colors such as blue, silver and/or purple, with different shapes and meanings.

There is just so much that can be done... Saying it's imposibble it's just lack of imagination and close mindedness.

[Frenchvince]

I would love these.

Red, green, and/or golden runic tattoos, it's just so fitting yet they didn't added them for over a decade, damn...

This way you add even more layers onto the Blood elf theme while allowing a potential High elf AR to have another kind of tattoos. With other more fitting colors such as blue, silver and/or purple, with different shapes and meanings.

There is just so much that can be done... Saying it's imposibble it's just lack of imagination and close mindedness.

I had never noticed that Rommath had tattoos on his arms. It is a different tattoo style, which we have not seen on other NPCs, a bit like those of Alleria, probably a tattoo to mark his blood elf transition.

As you say, it would be a good base, reserving tattoo colors, it will allow to further differentiate the theme of blood elves and high elves.

[Aldo Hawk]

I had never noticed that Rommath had tattoos on his arms. It is a different tattoo style, which we have not seen on other NPCs, a bit like those of Alleria, probably a tattoo to mark his blood elf transition.

As you say, it would be a good base, reserving tattoo colors, it will allow to further differentiate the theme of blood elves and high elves.

Yeah, color differentiation is cool but I was also talking about different designs, which would make for a more complete differentiation between them.

[DeicideUH]

The Old Wizard's Almanac found in-game lists Alliance races: human, dwarf, gnome, night elf, draenei and high elf.

[Ielenia]

The Old Wizard's Almanac found in-game lists Alliance races: human, dwarf, gnome, night elf, draenei and high elf.

Dude, great find! I guess people can't say that high elves are NOT an Alliance race now, then.

[Frenchvince]

The Old Wizard's Almanac found in-game lists Alliance races: human, dwarf, gnome, night elf, draenei and high elf.

Thank you, I feel like I'm in a police investigation.

It is interesting to see that for the horde it is the taunkas the 6th race.

[Obelisk Kai]

Dude, great find! I guess people can't say that high elves are NOT an Alliance race now, then.

Some High Elves are a part of the Alliance. Nobody ever said there were zero high elves in the Alliance. Archmage Yvera and Frostfencer Seraphi are two of the rare examples.

The Silver Covenant remains a neutral militia composed of partisan high elves within Dalaran who still didn't participate in the war and who are clearly not a part of the Alliance because otherwise they would have fought for it. As that organisation represents the majority of the remaining high elves, whatever high elves left in the Alliance may as well be just Archmage Yvera and Frostfencer Seraphi.

[Frenchvince]

Some High Elves are a part of the Alliance. Nobody ever said there were zero high elves in the Alliance. Archmage Yvera and Frostfencer Seraphi are two of the rare examples.

The Silver Covenant remains a neutral militia composed of partisan high elves within Dalaran who still didn't participate in the war and who are clearly not a part of the Alliance because otherwise they would have fought for it. As that organisation represents the majority of the remaining high elves, whatever high elves left in the Alliance may as well be just Archmage Yvera and Frostfencer Seraphi.

Vereesa took part in this war, she's their leader, it's huge I think, isn't it?

Some leaders of "playable races" were not there.


I'm talking about the 4th war, the most recent.