4th person in ICE custody dies in 2020 fiscal, which started last October

[Edge-]

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article...ration-customs

A 40-year-old French man died in US Immigration and Customs Enforcement custody at a New Mexico hospital on Sunday — the fourth person to do so since October, according to a person with knowledge of the matter. The man had been in ICE custody since Nov. 12.

He was jailed at the Otero County Processing Center until Dec. 11, when he was taken to the Torrance County Detention Facility. The next day, staff at the Torrance County facility sent him to the hospital for treatment. He died at the hospital on Dec. 29, according to the person with knowledge of the matter.

The man is the fourth person to die in ICE custody in the 2020 fiscal year, which began in October. Eight people died in ICE custody in the 2019 fiscal year.

ICE has expanded the number of people it detains to record levels under President Donald Trump. The peak came this summer, when around 55,000 immigrants were in custody in local jails and private prisons across the country. As of mid-December, the agency was detaining nearly 42,000 immigrants in custody.

ICE officials did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

ICE officials have long said that it is dedicated to providing timely and comprehensive medical care to immigrants in its custody, noting that they have access to a daily sick call and 24-hour emergency care. The agency has publicized that it spends more than $269 million each year on health care services.

The medical care in ICE detention has come under scrutiny by congressional officials in recent weeks.

Earlier this month, the House Oversight and Reform Committee announced it had opened an investigation into the medical care of immigrant detainees in the wake of a BuzzFeed News investigation that revealed a series of allegations of substandard care from a whistleblower.

The congressional committee issued letters demanding a series of documents from the Department of Homeland Security and ICE officials.

BuzzFeed News first reported the memo and documented how it contained reports of detainees being given incorrect medication, suffering from delays in treating withdrawal symptoms, and one who was allowed to become so mentally unstable he lacerated his own penis and required surgery.

If ICE and the detention centers they contract with can't ensure the safety and survival of detainees, they should not be detaining individuals until they have processes and facilities capable of doing so without killing them.

This is an average of one death per-month. I'd expect that from third world countries without adequate funding/infrastructure to care for detainees, not the richest country on the planet.

[Endus]

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article...ration-customs

If ICE and the detention centers they contract with can't ensure the safety and survival of detainees, they should not be detaining individuals until they have processes and facilities capable of doing so without killing them.

This is an average of one death per-month. I'd expect that from third world countries without adequate funding/infrastructure to care for detainees, not the richest country on the planet.

This should be very simple.

Identify the cause of death. If it's treatable illness, then ICE is criminally responsible for negligence leading to death, at a bare minimum. Also potentially breaching laws against torture, inhumane treatment, denial of human rights, and so forth.

If it's specific agents responsible, fire them with cause and put them in prison for 40+ years for their horrendous crimes.

If it's institutional policies or procedures, then ICE itself is responsible, and that means decision-makers should be facing conspiracy charges on these grounds, the institution itself should be facing 8- or 9-figure penalties in lawsuits from the victim's families, etc.

One preventable death is unacceptable. A pattern means you're choosing to kill people.

[Citizen T]

US death rate is 8.7 per 1000 annually. Let's call this 8 to make easier math.

Ice detention has a daily average of about 42000. Let's call this 40K.

This would mean that 320 people would die annually out of that 40K so for a 4 month period rather than annual that would make about 110 deaths. So ICE having four seems to me that the detainees are almost 30 times safer than the average person in the US.

or

we can look at prison death rates which are lower than the average US population at 2.75 per thousand which would show about 37 deaths for the same size population. this makes detainees almost 10 times safer than prisoners.

Guess what? people die and there is nothing we have yet to discover/invent to prevent this.

[Edge-]

Guess what? people die and there is nothing we have yet to discover/invent to prevent this.

Except this is a new pattern that, there were never this many deaths, especially of children, in detention. And base on reporting, it's often due to ICE and the detention centers they contract with not adequately caring for detainees and waiting too long to provide medical treatment for them.

The US death rate is for people out in the open, where there are a lot more risks to your safety. These people don't face those risks as they're in detention, so they're not going get into a car wreck and die or be murdered. They're dying because they're not receiving adequate care and live in awful conditions. Period.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/02/u...detention.html

The government even confirmed this in a report.

[Vanyali]

Ahhh, Thwart. Always here with the "well people die, nothing we can do about it".

Except... they're not dying of natural causes. Which is where your "death rate" largely pulls from. They're dying as children (so pull your deaths from there) from the flu. While being prevented from being treated from said flu. So you can take your death rate and shove it elsewhere with your false equivalences because it's utterly irrelevant and misleading crap.

[Mayhem]

US death rate is 8.7 per 1000 annually. Let's call this 8 to make easier math.

Ice detention has a daily average of about 42000. Let's call this 40K.

This would mean that 320 people would die annually out of that 40K so for a 4 month period rather than annual that would make about 110 deaths. So ICE having four seems to me that the detainees are almost 30 times safer than the average person in the US.

or

we can look at prison death rates which are lower than the average US population at 2.75 per thousand which would show about 37 deaths for the same size population. this makes detainees almost 10 times safer than prisoners.

Guess what? people die and there is nothing we have yet to discover/invent to prevent this.

Thanks for uhm I don't know, anything you want to contribute to the topic? Also, is it by chance that you ignore age in your "death rate is way higher outside ICE custody"-math lesson?

[Crissi]

US death rate is 8.7 per 1000 annually. Let's call this 8 to make easier math.

Ice detention has a daily average of about 42000. Let's call this 40K.

This would mean that 320 people would die annually out of that 40K so for a 4 month period rather than annual that would make about 110 deaths. So ICE having four seems to me that the detainees are almost 30 times safer than the average person in the US.

or

we can look at prison death rates which are lower than the average US population at 2.75 per thousand which would show about 37 deaths for the same size population. this makes detainees almost 10 times safer than prisoners.

Guess what? people die and there is nothing we have yet to discover/invent to prevent this.

What are the demographics? Because If its young people dying in the camps from preventable shit like the flu while the national death rate is mostly older people or people with terminal diseases or other uncontrollable factors...its not comparable at like fucking all.

[Kontinuum]

More death is always welcome.
[Infraction]

[MasterK]

What are the demographics? Because If its young people dying in the camps from preventable shit like the flu while the national death rate is mostly older people or people with terminal diseases or other uncontrollable factors...its not comparable at like fucking all.

And this is why Thwart has a point: without knowing anything, assumptions are being made and threads are created to rile up people (which is against forum rules even).

[Crissi]

And this is why Thwart has a point: without knowing anything, assumptions are being made and threads are created to rile up people (which is against forum rules even).

No, his point was "people die, who cares / the death rate is lower" without looking at demographic specifics, which is just silly. Although doing the math on just flu deaths in general, I think the national rate is still higher than the camp rate.

Then combine with that camps are a controlled environment and stuff like refusing doctors who want to vaccinate because "well technically the people who are here aren't supposed to be here long but sometimes oopsies happens", outrage is going to happen and in regards to completely preventable stuff like the flu, is rightful.

Frankly, should the camps even exist at all should also be argued. Either deport immediately if caught at the border, let them stay in the US if they really want asylum, or just leave them the fuck alone if theyve already been in the US for yeras without causing problems.

[I Push Buttons]

No, his point was "people die, who cares / the death rate is lower" without looking at demographic specifics, which is just silly. Although doing the math on just flu deaths in general, I think the national rate is still higher than the camp rate.

Then combine with that camps are a controlled environment and stuff like refusing doctors who want to vaccinate because "well technically the people who are here aren't supposed to be here long but sometimes oopsies happens", outrage is going to happen and in regards to completely preventable stuff like the flu, is rightful.

Frankly, should the camps even exist at all should also be argued. Either deport immediately if caught at the border, let them stay in the US if they really want asylum, or just leave them the fuck alone if theyve already been in the US for yeras without causing problems.

That's not legal, they have to go through the immigration courts.

And the backlog for immigration court is up to a million cases at this point.

https://www.justice.gov/eoir/page/file/1060836/download

[Endus]

US death rate is 8.7 per 1000 annually. Let's call this 8 to make easier math.

Ice detention has a daily average of about 42000. Let's call this 40K.

This would mean that 320 people would die annually out of that 40K so for a 4 month period rather than annual that would make about 110 deaths. So ICE having four seems to me that the detainees are almost 30 times safer than the average person in the US.

or

we can look at prison death rates which are lower than the average US population at 2.75 per thousand which would show about 37 deaths for the same size population. this makes detainees almost 10 times safer than prisoners.

Guess what? people die and there is nothing we have yet to discover/invent to prevent this.

In addition to what everyone else has said about your willfully dishonest approach to this, you're also misrepresenting some basic precepts.

People in custody are to be protected by those holding them. That means that deaths (or injuries) due to;

1> Accident
2> Malfeasance by other detainees or officers
3> Preventable or treatable illness or injury
4> Suicide
5> Drug/alcohol abuse
6> Probably others, I'm not trying to describe every possible option here,

Deaths by any of those, while in custody, are the fault of the custodians, and those custodians should be facing serious investigations into how they allowed these things to happen.

And those are some of the higher entries on the list, outside of things like cancer and heart disease (which make up nearly half the figures in the death rates), which aren't the deaths we're even talking about here.


Also, no idea where you got your data from, but this mortality report from the CDC puts the total mortality rate for the entire population at 7.3/1000, for 2017; https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db328.htm

[MasterK]

No, his point was "people die, who cares / the death rate is lower" without looking at demographic specifics, which is just silly. Although doing the math on just flu deaths in general, I think the national rate is still higher than the camp rate.

Then combine with that camps are a controlled environment and stuff like refusing doctors who want to vaccinate because "well technically the people who are here aren't supposed to be here long but sometimes oopsies happens", outrage is going to happen and in regards to completely preventable stuff like the flu, is rightful.

Frankly, should the camps even exist at all should also be argued. Either deport immediately if caught at the border, let them stay in the US if they really want asylum, or just leave them the fuck alone if theyve already been in the US for yeras without causing problems.

Yes, I agree with you. But now check what -Edge is saying. Not even knowing the cause of death, directly coming to conclusions. 1 death per month? Calculated of the last 4 months? Maybe the 8 months before had no deaths at all (I don't know), but then it would be 1 death per 3 months. Just an example. Calling it a pattern is just idiotic.

[Edge-]

Calculated of the last 4 months?

Because it's fiscal year 2020, which starts in October.

Maybe the 8 months before had no deaths at all (I don't know), but then it would be 1 death per 3 months.

https://www.ice.gov/death-detainee-report

Fiscal year 2019 report by ICE themselves. 16 deaths, 9 adults and 7 children. There were deaths, you just have to do a simple google search.

[MasterK]

Because it's fiscal year 2020, which starts in October.



https://www.aila.org/infonet/deaths-...ention-centers

September 12, 2019
July 25, 2019
July 1, 2019
June 3, 2019
May 6, 2019
April 4, 2019
December 3, 2018
November 26, 2018
November 2, 2018

9 in the previous fiscal year (there were no deaths between July 26 and November 2, 2018), so this is actually a worse start than last year, which had seen only 3 deaths at this point and the 4th happening on April 4, 2019.

This information isn't difficult to find.

Did you read the cause of death for all those cases? Tell me, how could they prevent "self-inflicted strangulation" or "cardiac-related natural causes"? What pattern do you see? Or are you claiming the press releases by ICE are not truthful?

[Machismo]

Did you read the cause of death for all those cases? Tell me, how could they prevent "self-inflicted strangulation" or "cardiac-related natural causes"? What pattern do you see? Or are you claiming the press releases by ICE are not truthful?

Yeah, don't toss them in prison.

[JohnBrown1917]

Did you read the cause of death for all those cases? Tell me, how could they prevent "self-inflicted strangulation" or "cardiac-related natural causes"? What pattern do you see? Or are you claiming the press releases by ICE are not truthful?

The ol' Epstein method.

[Xjev]

Going to America is not worth losing life for. I don't like encouraging people with risky/illegal ways of immigration. All you will end up in America in being slave to a corporate, and your hard work will just make american billionaires richer.

[Stormspark]

Because it's fiscal year 2020, which starts in October.



https://www.ice.gov/death-detainee-report

Fiscal year 2019 report by ICE themselves. 16 deaths, 9 adults and 7 children. There were deaths, you just have to do a simple google search.

And this is before they outright start gassing people. Which they definitely will if Trump "wins" this year. If that happens I will be telling people "I told you so" when the concentration camps become outright death camps.

[Pannonian]

people die and there is nothing we have yet to discover/invent to prevent this.

Makes one wonder why this line of defense didn't work for Himmler in Nürnberg...