Tier Sets: "You think you want them back... but you don't."

[klaps_05]

Just because you dont like azerite powers doesnt make Tier sets better as a gearing system. Tier sets were only good because you got a unique look rather than all Cloths looking the same.

1. mandatory 4 slots locked with specific secondary stats which Blizzard arbitrarily picks
2. try to find the combination of the 4 tier items and random 5th item which will give you the least worst possible stat combination.

or

Get the specific traits combinations you want and fill your other slots with stats you actually WANT. BIS gearing was always boring - 0 incentive to do anything after obtaining it. This is an MMO - you are supposed to have something to do all the time. Currently, by the time a season ends, you can still be grinding the last 1-2 items you are missing with perfect stats.

[Ophenia]

You can add that GCD madness was in the April Fools Patchnote 2006

[Outofmana]

The worst feeling about a tier set is when you get an non-set upgrade and can't use it, because tier set bonus is that powerful, so, yeah, i don't miss them and don't want them back

What upgrade, an ilvl upgrade of 1-2? Because that's what upgrades these days are, lousy main stats. At least with tier sets you could actually get a substantial one, either changing your entire gameplay or having a large benefit, something to work towards.

[123youshowme]

What upgrade, an ilvl upgrade of 1-2? Because that's what upgrades these days are, lousy main stats. At least with tier sets you could actually get a substantial one, either changing your entire gameplay or having a large benefit, something to work towards.

Changing your entire gameplay like an azerite trait?
Lol like, most of the one and done azerite traits are literally tier set bonuses of expansions past.

Igneous potential would be a set bonus for shaman in years gone. Synapse shock would be a set bonus in years gone. Every azerite trait for the most part, would be a set bonus.

[Monster Hunter]

I want the class based appearances back.

I don't want the set bonuses back, mostly because of how blizzard has used set bonuses over the last few expacs as a cop out for fixing under performing spec's. The "ur class is only good once it has 4 set" bollocks was not a good or fun situation, it's not nice knowing your being carried at the start of tier then suddenly jumping from bottom to top of meter due to a set bonus, to me that just felt really sucky.

[kranur]

Depends how you look at it.
If you think like, "oh a cool looking set with bonuses" it all sounds awesome, then the reality hits with bad rng where you don't get to complete your set because it doesn't drop, situations where multiple very good items drop but you can't use them because you break your set, where pieces of a new tier drop but again you can't use them yet because you break your previous set.
Overall IMO it was an unneeded hassle and it sucked balls to not have your set pieces drop or to not be able to equip slot upgrades because of bonuses. And there are ways to keep the gameplay altering bonuses without the sets, like add a special socket to trinkets in which you can place a special gem that grants you the bonuses.
As far as appearance goes, I see no reason not to have class sets that you get when you complete all encounters of a raid, or can have unlocks per specific bosses, whatever.

[Holdodlig]

I don't think people actually want tier set, but they definitely want more appearances in raids which was provided by raid sets.

Even if it's a good item design to have few items (maximum of 4 imo was good in WoW) linked together, I don't think high level gearing should be designed around them. Items like the Waycrest Manor set are cool because they don't take too much slot. The main issue here is that you don't have anything else. And that was the problem with them.

The azerite system is actually better in this way, because you will have the choice. The issue from this system is the weak balance between azerite traits on armor, and the fact the community is in a min / max mindset.

If you really were able to have different build on your class (let's say for example a full nature damage moonkin druid with a talent, or an arcane burst / fire burst, sets would be cool. Or having a set that boost your pet damage VS having a set that increase the number of pets. But that's what azerite does already.

I'm totally for more armor skin in raid, because what we had in BFA was just lazyness (seriously, 4 armor for both PvP AND PvE ?), but I don't think set bonuses should still be a thing. The itemization in BFA is in my opinion one of the few things to keep. I'd just add more gem slots back and more slots to improve, but that's a profession issue.

[Zarvel]

I don't think they should return. getting 4 set was often a complete pain in the ass. I remember back during HFC I was stuck at 3 piece for ages because my guild had killed Gorefiend 4 times for the quest and so would skip him; and his piece was the one I needed to complete the 4 set because I had bis gear in the other spot.

if they remove titanforging completely I can see it making a return. nothing sucked more than having to not use a piece that was 20ilvl better than what you had because you would break tier set.

I call bs on this.
No matter what difficulty you were raiding, obtaining a tier piece from 1 difficulty lower would still be worth the item level gap from a non-set piece that came from a higher difficulty. If you were a mythic raider who was skipping gorefiend but didn't bother to pug it to fill that 4th tier slot, it was your own damn fault.
Having 4 set bonus active always felt better than wearing some randomly named off-set piece with higher ilv because you could clearly see the difference in gameplay and power.

Item level seekers like you are exactly why wow's gear system is in the shambles it is today. Blizz is appeasing customers just like you by giving you shitty higher item level "azerite gear" that are nothing but knock-off tier sets. In-fact, they're so much like tier sets/bonuses that it's borderline traumatically hilarious.
You'd prefer to wear a lower ilv piece of azerite gear over a non-set/azerite piece 30-40 ilvs higher even now, wouldn't you? See the irony in that?

There's a reason people loved tier sets for the first 12-13 years of wow's life cycle. It gave classes special identity each tier, and a worthy goal to chase after in "farm" raids.

Even now, most of the items i mog my characters to were parts of some tier set or another, on all of my 13 110-120s. They were just that cool and memorable. Heck, I still run tomb of sargeras and antorus on my plate and cloth wearers so i can complete their awesome looking sets. Can't really say that about Uldir, Crucible and EP can I? BoDA was the only raid with good looking sets. That's 1 raid out of 4 in an expansion where blizz said "having raid zone themed sets will allow us to make sets that look cooler". Kill me now please.

I'd love to see who that person will be who fondly looks back on azerite armor and essences with nostalgia.

[PenguinChan]

It will absolutely destroy non-mythic raiding as a gearing avenue.
Grats on having to go pug raids on all your characters to not be completely irrelevant.

Honestly no matter what you do with the gearing process it'll affect someone down the line if they add some kind of fix to the system. In the end - someone gets the short end of the stick, and it seems the raiders always do.

[Caprias]

The idea of the dev. team was right, the execution was lacking.

What is it the playerbase loves about tier sets?

The visuals for each class? Sure.
The altering and advancing of your playstyle every tier? Sure.
The idea of a powerfull collectible bonus to progress? Sure.
A bit of immersion stuff? Yeah okay.

The lock on the slots making any further progress there impossible or hoping for titanforges? No.
High M+ pushing players needing to raid mythic for tier sets? Nah.

We don't need t-sets, we need the positive stuff i highlighted up there with a good progression system.

[Rafalga]

they should just go RIFT way of things and make tier set bonuses some sort of token you equip. Would add instant depth to the game (mix-match them with previous tiers) and no more locked slots for armors.

[Biggles Worth]

Do you think such a thing applies here? Do you think if we just stick with World of Warcraft long enough, Ion will eventually "move on", and when the new boss takes over, tier sets will return?

In some ways you can look at Azerite Gear as customizable tier sets in a way.

[Amenophis]

I want class sets back, not the tier bonuses.

That works for me

[Aristai1723]

Why does everyone seem to agree on that locked gear slots are bad? Being able to always upgrade every slot also facilitates burn out.

Eternal palace was one extreme of the spectrum, but in the past it felt good to have slots you didn't need to worry about for the rest of the raid tier.

[Sunseeker]

I miss each class getting their own distinct visual style every raid patch, even if I didn't like them all every time.

It sure as hell beats all the shitty 'armor type' sets we've been getting. They said that eliminating 12 sets and only doing 4 would allow the armor sets to look even better but thusfar the sets all looked pretty average/subpar.

Yes there were problems with itemization and getting upgrades but the set bonus being too powerful, ect. But I'd take that over the garbage system we have now any day of the week.

This is my main issue with it. Yeah the bonuses could be a pain, but a visual identity to each class really made raiding worthwhile to me. Now I'm just "Generic Armor Guy #5" and its really boring.

[123youshowme]

This is my main issue with it. Yeah the bonuses could be a pain, but a visual identity to each class really made raiding worthwhile to me. Now I'm just "Generic Armor Guy #5" and its really boring.

you were always generic armour guy #5 because your gear was 90% a mashup of dk/paladin/warrior lookalikes.
So you always had a clownsuit, outside of T1

Before transmogging, anyway

[glowpipe]

I believe it won't come back, due to now they only have to create one leather/cloth/plate/mail set per raid. instead of one per class

REAL-ID: "Forced real names on the WoW forums. By forcing players to post with their real name, this would reduce toxic behavior and lift the quality of discourse."

this would actually have been a good change, one that could be applied to the entire fucking internet. Anonymity creates toxicity. Thats no secret.

[Blackmist]

The problem with tier sets is you had no choice but to use them, but the problem with no tier sets, is that your rotation is exactly the same all expansion long.

Things like instant Aimed Shots were great.

Of course now we have Benthic items, which you also have to use to be competitive. It's not an improvement.

[Zenfoldor]

I really do want tier sets back. They worked fine the entire time I played the game up until the end of Legion. Suddenly they are a problem? Okay....

What we have is a correlation vs causation problem here. Did tier sets being removed just correlate to the game's state in BFA, or did they cause it? In my opinion, the answer is a little bit of both.

[123youshowme]

The problem with tier sets is you had no choice but to use them, but the problem with no tier sets, is that your rotation is exactly the same all expansion long.

Things like instant Aimed Shots were great.

Of course now we have Benthic items, which you also have to use to be competitive. It's not an improvement.

I mean, 3/4 of yall that complain about benthic items wouldn't be competitive anyway *shrug*

Most of the tier bonuses were bland and did very little to change the way you actually played. Not to mention that a significant portion of yall who reference HFC hunter set got it #monthsbehind and weren't competitive anyway.

Also, if you have been paying attention, many specs have changed since the start of the expansion as far as "rotations" go. Essences, trait combos and strength of secondary stats dictate a change.

Staying on hunters, you went from chim/crows to toth/owtp and a complete remapping of secondaries.

Do you even?

- - - Updated - - -

I really do want tier sets back. They worked fine the entire time I played the game up until the end of Legion. Suddenly they are a problem? Okay....

What we have is a correlation vs causation problem here. Did tier sets being removed just correlate to the game's state in BFA, or did they cause it? In my opinion, the answer is a little bit of both.

Your answer is wrong because tier has always been a hot topic. Did you not read any of the whine posts in wod wrt lfr tier, or in legion wrt lfr tier? How druids were "LiTerAllY unPlaYablE" because ToS tier sucked for bear and resto?