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  1. #221
    Quote Originally Posted by Shakana View Post
    Youtubers that have a channel to flame Blizzard should stop having the rights to be youtubers. Like, you know for a fact they will try do minor or major flamings at everything they see, how can that be credible for starters even. Their credibility is resumed to their viewers, they don't really give af about wow. They use it to make "content" and nothing more. And if that wasn't enough, it spreads more negativity about it, as if we don't have already enough.
    Well, by that ruleset, most of YT would disappear. Making money on YT requires subs and clicks, to make ad money, so most channels end up clickbaiting and generating drama to do so - look at the feeding frenzy over Star Wars IX that happened. Taking away someone's "right" to have a YT channel isn't your call , it's YT's, and they make money off everyone, so don't hold your breath for your "punishment" of channels you don't like. You know what I do? I don't watch them. I used to watch Az's stream, but stopped a while ago, and just clicked "not interested" when he was recommended, and he doesn't show up anymore.
    There are channels that feed off drama, we all know who they are (coughTheQuarteringcough). Look at the sheer flood of "reacts" videos. I think they're pointless and boring, but I don't demand they "lose the right" to do them, because that's childish. Some people enjoy them - and enough that the people who make them profit off them. If I listed the channels I like, I know there would be massive shitposting from the "DON'T LIKE WHAT I DON'T LIKE" posters here. (which you pretty much are right now) And you know what? Nobody cares.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    I'm always going to advocate that people think for themselves and make their own decisions rather than listen to anyone here, on any other forum, or on Youtube about how to spend their money.

    What you get is what I think is a lackluster mount--others may think it's the greatest mount ever--but the price for subscribing for six months is less than month-to-month so if someone is planning on staying anyway, they might want to think about it since it saves some money.

    Some people want to try and make the rather dumb case that Blizzard is doing something sketchy by providing incentives to subscribe long-term. They can and should. It's a standard thing to do everywhere else. Only Blizzard is somehow evil by doing this. I mean if you really hate Blizzard and imagine they're only out to cheat people then by all means, delete the games, forget they and this place exist and stop thinking about them. Or start bothering that other game that charges a subscription (there is one) and has a MUCH larger cash shop.

    They should go play Fallout 76 and think Blizzard is bad in this regard.

  2. #222
    Quote Originally Posted by alosiboy View Post
    Doesn't anyone find it suspicious that he quit during Legion, but during BfA he started making WoW videos again?
    He got called out for a shitty video and ran away

  3. #223
    Quote Originally Posted by lockybalboa View Post
    Moochamp's favorite youtuber strikes again
    #1 WHO?
    #2 there is a video thread for your videos...

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    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    YouTubers are a plague. Fuck 'em. All of them.
    amen to that!

  4. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by callipygoustp View Post
    Every time blizzard gives me a mount simply because I have an ongoing sixth month subscription, I get soooooo angry!!!!!


    Grrrrr, fucking grrrr!!!!!
    These were my thoughts exactly.

    Like, who gets mad about this stuff? Unless you don't have money to pay 6 months at a time ( in that case, you shouldn't be playing an MMO ), why would you get angry about this? I do not understand it. It takes less than a week I bet to make a mount like this if that long from a developer standpoint. It isn't hurting the game at all.

  5. #225
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    But how do you know that those same artists would have created a mount to add to the game versus doing nothing?
    If they hadn't worked on that mount, they would've worked something else.
    Time is a resource as well, you can choose where to spend it.

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    What if they create things in their down time between projects?
    You seriously believe a mount that goes into the store is just a side project?
    Did you check the mount special for that one?

    This is not something that was created "inbetween".

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Blizzard belonging to a publicly traded company has no bearing on doing things that benefit their bottom line.
    Private owned companies and public traded companies are different.

    A private owned company is allowed to consciously make decisions that do not benefit their bottom line, if it goes their ideals as a company for example.
    People running a public traded company are getting in (legal) trouble if they do not act in the best interest of their shareholders.

    A private owned company can give China the middle finger if they feel like it.
    A public traded company can't do the same thing because China is a huge market and thus would hurt their profit.

    A private owned company can easily say: "we do not engage in MTX because these do not align with our vision of quality products"
    A public traded company needs to justify their decision based on revenue, meaning that they need to argue that doing MTX hurts their bottomline.
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2020-01-21 at 12:44 AM.

  6. #226
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    If they hadn't worked on that mount, they would've worked something else. Time is a resource as well, you can choose where to spend it.
    So you know that for sure? What is there is nothing else to work on? You honestly can not say that they are not side projects. They could be given specifically for busy work or as "practice" for the artists. Then when they are good enough or have a reason they are released. That is the thing. You don't know but you are acting as if you know for certain.


    A private owned company is allowed to consciously make decisions that do not benefit their bottom line, if it goes their ideals as a company for example.
    People running a public traded company are getting in (legal) trouble if they do not act in the best interest of their shareholders.
    Blizzard has not been a privately owned company for decades. All companies who wish to stay in business need to make decisions that benefit their bottom line. Because that is how you stay in business. Not all publicly traded companies make good decisions which some times impacts their bottom line. They do not face legal troubles other then going bankrupt. You are creating a mashup of different things by bring share holders into this. Even private companies have investors and share holders. They are just not listed on the stock exchanges. That is why it is publicly traded versus privately traded. And why companies sell equity to raise money.

    This is all moot as well since Blizzard is not this bastion of virtue and moral superiority that you are claiming they would be if it wasn't for the evil publicly traded companies that have held the reins. Blizzard has always tried to make money.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  7. #227
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    The fact that they are now baiting people into a 6 month sub
    Dude. Please. They've been doing six-months and twelve-month bundles for quite some time, now. Remember, during Cataclysm, Blizzard offered Diablo 3 for free + guaranteed access to MoP beta + Tyrael's Charger mount if you signed up for a 12-month subscription?

    Also, June, 2019: Blizzard offered the Sylverian Dreamer mount for free with a 6-month subscription. September, 2018: Dreadwake mount with 6-month subscription.

    Why are you acting as if Blizzard is starting doing this now?
    "Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons" by Varodoc
    "You sit in OG/SW waiting on a Mythic+ queue" by Altmer <- Oh, the pearls in this forum...
    "They sort of did this Dragonriding, which ushered in the Dracthyr race." by Teriz <- the BS some people reach for their narratives...

  8. #228
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    That is the thing. You don't know but you are acting as if you know for certain.
    Occam's razor, the simpler explanations are usually the right one.
    Companies first act in the interest of their bottomline, thus it is reasonable to assume that they cut resources to build it.

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    All companies who wish to stay in business need to make decisions that benefit their bottom line.
    The big difference is whether virtually any decision is made in favour of profit.
    A private company have freedom depending on their leadership and previous success, public traded ones don't in any case.

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    This is all moot as well since Blizzard is not this bastion of virtue and moral superiority
    Where did i claim they are or would be one?
    All i said that the decision in favour of more profit is even more likely in a public traded company than in a private one.

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    that you are claiming they would be if it wasn't for the evil publicly traded companies that have held the reins.
    Considering there have been a lot of reports over the course of last year(s) that Activision and by extension the finance department is having a greater influence on Blizzard than previously, that's not entirely unfounded.

    I'm not claiming everything would be sunshine and rainbows but the more extreme ends we are facing right were not as likely, i'd say.
    Because Blizzard hasn't resorted to these strategies in years before.

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Blizzard has always tried to make money.
    Yes and that's good, i am willing to pay them money for quality products.
    But i disapprove if they are conducting business practices that do not appear as a deal where you receive adequate compensation for you purchase.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Blizzard offered Diablo 3 for free + guaranteed access to MoP beta + Tyrael's Charger mount if you signed up for a 12-month subscription?
    Let's see:
    An entire game, Beta access and a mount for a 12 month sub vs. a Mount for a 6 month sub.

    Which one is the better deal?
    Not to mention, Diablo 3 incidentally came out during the content drought between Cata and MoP, so you did actually get something else to play while WoW wasn't receiving any updates.
    And could even play the MoP Beta at some point.

    I think that deal was pretty legit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Why are you acting as if Blizzard is starting doing this now?
    I don't, but if you would actually read my posts, you realize that in particular i highlight the fact that they're doing it now despite the fact that WoW won't receive any updates for another 8-10 months.
    And for the next major update, Shadowlands, you also have to pay.

    I mean, if you're doing this, i think you should at least offer people some sort of content to look forward to that goes live during the period you are subbed to.
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2020-01-21 at 01:40 AM.

  9. #229
    Merely a Setback FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tranzplore View Post
    Just pointing this out here before this descends into critics vs Blizzard argument.

    Heelsvvsbabyface is no one's consumer champion. God knows Blizzard deserve criticism sometimes but he is not the one to dish it out.

    First, he has the very warped perspective of someone who only ever plays wow to criticize it. He quit during the entirety of Legion because there literally wasn't enough to bitch about, and came back to BFA solely it seems because there were things to complain about. That is very, very strange and suggests a very cynical agenda.

    Second, and more seriously, I don't think people understand how much of the content he used to propel him into his current situation was information stolen from smaller youtubers. He makes Warcraft Bible look like a paragon of virtue.

    And don't tell me Blizzard are bad he makes a valid point...that is not the issue here. You need to find a better poster boy for intelligent criticism. There are a ton of better critics. I'm sick of people doing free promotional work for this black hole of cynicism and plagiarism.
    he also doesent give a shit if hes corrected, like when ythisens who was fired from blizzard called him out on his posts about how blizzard was deleting dislieks on youtube, and how htats not possible, and az just called him a liar, and that he was not important enough to know about how all the companies in the world have this super secret pact with yotube that allows them to delete dislikes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mosotti View Post
    Az did for WoW more than anyone bitching here, it used to be a guide channel with hundreds of pure entertainment videos. Criticizing the current WoW/Blizzard is actually passion, sucking Blizzard dick is just sucking Blizzard dick. Even Bellular, who used to suck Blizzard dick like a champ has completely turned against the soulless money machine.
    you know, until he quit the game cause he hated it, and made a video complaining that the new infernal is worse then the last.


    then he lost all his veiwers, so he came back to wow so he could have a veiwerbase again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by alosiboy View Post
    Doesn't anyone find it suspicious that he quit during Legion, but during BfA he started making WoW videos again?
    its cause he quit the game end of wod cause he hated it, but then lost all his veiwership and returned to start making money again.
    i used to watch him all the time, stopepd when he made the video complaining the old infernal is bertter then the new one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    YouTubers are a plague. Fuck 'em. All of them.
    hey my top 10's aint that bad...
    plus the history videos and villians corners are great looks back at the history of the game mechanics and lore of the franchise.
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    My ideas are objectively good

  10. #230
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Let's see:
    An entire game, Beta access and a mount for a 12 month sub vs. a Mount for a 6 month sub.

    Which one is the better deal?
    Not to mention, Diablo 3 incidentally came out during the content drought between Cata and MoP, so you did actually get something else to play while WoW wasn't receiving any updates.
    And could even play the MoP Beta at some point.

    I think that deal was pretty legit.
    That's not the point. You claimed that those "bundles" are being done now, when I showed you that they have been doing this for quite some time, now.

    I don't, but if you would actually read my posts, you realize that in particular i highlight the fact that they're doing it now despite the fact that WoW won't receive any updates for another 8-10 months.
    And for the next major update, Shadowlands, you also have to pay.

    I mean, if you're doing this, i think you should at least offer people some sort of content to look forward to that goes live during the period you are subbed to.
    You would have a point if Blizzard did such promotions only during content droughts, but this is the first time they did that.
    "Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons" by Varodoc
    "You sit in OG/SW waiting on a Mythic+ queue" by Altmer <- Oh, the pearls in this forum...
    "They sort of did this Dragonriding, which ushered in the Dracthyr race." by Teriz <- the BS some people reach for their narratives...

  11. #231
    Only criticisms I have is that it would be better if you got the mount if you stayed subbed for next six months regardless if it's six 1-month subs or one 6-month sub. That way people who can't drop 60e for a 6-month sub, but can stay subbed for one month at the time would still get the mount.
    Last edited by Darkke; 2020-01-21 at 02:03 AM.

  12. #232
    For those who aren't up2date with his hipocracy:

    1) Criticize (not mock/insult) him on twitter for his mannerisms -> get instantly blocked for the first tweet.

    2) Post critical comments in his (Youtube) comment section -> get muted in said comment section.
    I had to figure this out via observing comment appearance while logged out. You can read your own comment but nobody else will be able to, also can't read his comments.
    I probably posted a dozen comments on a few videos over the years and at some point he double-checked his block-list and added my YT account.

    3) He constantly rants against censorship while censoring all his online platforms. His Youtube comment section could be seen as the most vetted/cleaned up safe-space. You will have to search for a long time to find any comment being actually critical of his points of view while scrolling trough a complete circle-yerk of self-affirmation. This echo chamber might be close to perfection compared to most YT channels.

    4) Every now and then you might stumble upon gems like 2 commenters non-jokingly talking about "someone needs to kill off Ion Hazzikostas". Sure he will dismiss it etc but his entire appearance attracts these kind of lunatics.

    5) General Highlight of dealing with his presence online: Quick peak into his pre-Blizzcon Twitch stream - while he is at prime slacktivism sitting in a Winnie-Pooh costume - randomly getting a gifted sub which I never thought about using since it seems useless talking to him about anything he doesn't agree on as long as you don't bring a large audience.

    If you are still a loyal follower: Sit down for a bit and think about his double standards.
    Last edited by Nightstalker; 2020-01-21 at 02:41 AM.

  13. #233
    Quote Originally Posted by Shakana View Post
    Youtubers that have a channel to flame Blizzard should stop having the rights to be youtubers. Like, you know for a fact they will try do minor or major flamings at everything they see, how can that be credible for starters even. Their credibility is resumed to their viewers, they don't really give af about wow. They use it to make "content" and nothing more. And if that wasn't enough, it spreads more negativity about it, as if we don't have already enough.
    Advocating for the removal of free speech is never good.

    Just because you don't like what the youtube is saying isn't ground for removing their voice. If you don't like what they're saying...DON'T FUCKING WATCH THEIR VIDS!

    I don't even agree with most of what Az has been saying lately. I feel like his channel went from actually talking about sort of interesting things going on in WoW, to just constantly complaining about everything, and making fun of SJW woke idiots.

    But that doesn't mean he should be shut down completely. Consider the famous quote carefully next time before you suggest something so offensive.

    "I Disapprove of What You Say, But I Will Defend to the Death Your Right to Say It." -Evelyn Beatrice Hall

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    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    The basis of it seems to be that you and others think that most people are too stupid to resist. That's insulting and as bad as the YouTubers who incite this bullshit to up their views.

    Seems like I'm on a quote binge today. George Carlin said it best: “Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.

    I'm not suggesting that's everyone. Obviously the opposite of the quote is also true: There are plenty of smart people who will buy things after careful consideration, even the 6 month sub.

    But Blizzard is absolutely doing the math on this. They know that there are enough players out there that absolutely WILL buy things without actually thinking about it, and that's what this "Deal" is targeted at. And the fact that Blizzard is taking advantage of that purposefully is something everyone should sit up and pay attention to(not that this is the first time they've done something like this, but each case is important to note).

    Could Az have done a better, less offensive way of articulating this point? Absolutely! In my last post I just said I dislike the way he's been going about things lately, and the video in question is one of the reasons why.
    Last edited by SirCowdog; 2020-01-21 at 02:47 AM.

  14. #234
    Quote Originally Posted by SirCowdog View Post
    I think this hits the nail on the head.

    We've already seen this line be crossed with EA and the Battlefront 2 lootbox fiasco, resulting in massive backlash against EA in particular, and lootboxes in a general(and sometimes legal) sense.

    But I also think Activision/Blizzard are being a bit more intelligent about how they approach this. They're easing into it over long periods of time instead of shocking the consumer-base with a massive push. The "Boiling Frog" effect applied to micro-transactions and monetization.

    Sadly, I think at this point the current playerbase is largely either too invested, or too desensitized to these types of methods to really notice. And so I think Blizzard is going to be able to keep pushing, and worse....anchoring the expectations of players. So even if there is an eventual push-back against the business model, it will still be to a spot further along than I feel is healthy for consumers.
    Lots of fuss was made over mounts. Unfortunately it took the helms that resulted in players griefing other players who bought the helms that had Blizzard take halt. That was some time ago and I am not sure if the community would have the same response.

  15. #235
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkke View Post
    Only criticisms I have is that it would be better if you got the mount if you stayed subbed for next six months regardless if it's six 1-month subs or one 6-month sub. That way people who can't drop 60e for a 6-month sub, but can stay subbed for one month at the time would still get the mount.
    pretty sure they can count those 6months in the next quarter reports for investors. Boost numbers in the short term, especially if they think they need to look good in that particular quarter.

  16. #236
    All that rant about that mount don't realize one thing: It's free. If you had a six month subscription for the previous store mount you can get this one and still cancel in time (or switch to monthly).

    I was kind of meh not my kind of mount gonna cancel, then I realized I had it in my mail already, squeaked, and cancelled anyways because content draught is imminent.

  17. #237
    Quote Originally Posted by nekobaka View Post
    Lots of fuss was made over mounts. Unfortunately it took the helms that resulted in players griefing other players who bought the helms that had Blizzard take halt. That was some time ago and I am not sure if the community would have the same response.
    That's sort of what I meant by "Anchoring". Blizzard has gotten players used to the idea of store mounts, so it's no longer a question of "if", but "how many".

  18. #238
    Elemental Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heavens Night View Post
    Excellent post, I couldn't agree more. Finally somebody with some sense.

    "You Tubers" like this guy are a stain on the platform, as is the money this idiot makes off the poor saps on there that pay him to bitch and steal other people's content.
    the only reason he did that video was because Batwoman hadn't aired yet this year and he needed something to bitch about. dude is toxic, hardly epic

  19. #239
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    So the only reason why it is bad to offer optional content is because it might have gone into the game for no additional charge? That isn't a good enough reason. There is no indication that the stuff added to the game for base cost are suffering in quality because of the store. This is also no indication that the store stuff would be in the game if the store did not exist.

    What ifs are not a good reason to deny something.
    its like going to a restaurant for a lunch each day, and DEMANDING that you get the dessert for free, even though its not a part of lunch menu, and when you dont get it for free, ranting that they should stop selling desserts, and give them free, bcs you already pay for lunch

    so, entitled whining basicaly by Karen
    ... i mean Kralljin

  20. #240
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    Fuck 'em. All of them.
    So this is how you really feel when you are free from the shackles of being a Moderator. Welcome home my child.

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