Alterac Valley Adjustments

[aeuhe4yxzhds]

all of these are good ideas and very finely tuned.

- allowing groups of 5 to queue allows for playing with friend / guild mates
- removing #ed AV instances prevents premade spam
- reducing diminishing returns makes WSG relevant again

Discord didn't exist in Classic, and premade groups never had this level of coordination. Eliminating the ability to spam premades balances out the AV experience, making it much more like Vanilla was back in the day.

Glad they took their time with this. Carefully considered tuning, but it will help keep AV relevant moving forward.

As an Alliance player I'm happy I no longer have the choice of a) guaranteed loss in a PUG, or b) find a group via discord to serially queue within for mindless wins.

And AV wasn't rushed to the boss yet it is and its the wrong version of it. So when is that getting changed?

[thatmikeguy]

What is the point of this Fake Vanilla exactly? As a launch player, I don't understand what the draw is, as it was never like vanilla anyway. I'm guessing it's mostly seeing the old quests again, or for the first time? But the overall experience was never remotely possible, because almost two years if patches (including content) had gone by before that patch, and it's running on today's engine. At this point anything they do with Fake Vanilla will only anger people.

[popewaxGhost]

#bestchanges

#nochanges

[Queen of Hamsters]

Love that even this, Classic fans blame on REEEEtail...

It's Classic players complaining that's prompting these changes, nothing else.

[Hinastorm]

What is the point of this Fake Vanilla exactly? As a launch player, I don't understand what the draw is, as it was never like vanilla anyway. I'm guessing it's mostly seeing the old quests again, or for the first time? But the overall experience was never remotely possible, because almost two years if patches (including content) had gone by before that patch, and it's running on today's engine. At this point anything they do with Fake Vanilla will only anger people.

Personally, i'm not playing for nostalgia, classic is actually a good mmo. It's warty, and some parts could use improving (certain specs being pointless, some balance issues) but with the state that the mmo industry is in, classic is one of the best options right now.

[Voidwielder]

What's the point of this if people are going to have itemisation of AQ by the time BWL is out?

[Hinastorm]

What's the point of this if people are going to have itemisation of AQ by the time BWL is out?

What does that have to do with breaking premades in AV?

[Spazlord]

I'll take it, these are some good changes. Queue as a party, and removing the BG # from the AV queue pop.

Thanks!

[Majestic12]

This breaks AV premades which never existed in vanilla. AV premades existing is a change.

If you unironically respond to these changes with #nOcHaNgEs, you are...I want to use a word, but lets just say, dumb.

AV premades still exist. Have you seen the premade discords? Hundreds of people queing at the same time in 5 man groups will still pop new games and see several groups together.

People have already tried Blizzard's approach on private servers, it's not new and didn't solve anything.

[Katchii]

Did you intentionally misunderstand his comment?

No, I've seen a couple posts talking about stealth buffs to BWL and was just wondering where the rumors are coming from. Found it a bit coincidental that BWL buffs would get brought up in a thread about Alterac Valley.

[Relapses]

bUt SlIpPerY sLOpE iS nOt rEaL!!!11111. oh look another change since you retarded idiots ask for them. in about 2 years classic = bfa in terms of mechanics and fixes

Yes, because removing AV premades makes Classic WoW exactly like retail.

I really struggle to understand how people who think like this operate. Do you scream at your local grocery store when they stop carrying your favorite brand of mayonnaise?

[lukkoth]

Ah yes, another change to placate the braying cries of the horde player base. They need to have AV too.

[Fancydress]

It definitely looks like BWL buff is coming now. Blizzard are not afraid to adjust how players consume Classic WoW content.

[Arakakao]

Who were expecting a note about the original AV coming back, at least during weekend events?

[relaxok]

This breaks AV premades which never existed in vanilla. AV premades existing is a change.

False. I ranked in 1.12 and my guildies and I were on voice comms and joined the same AV by number, we usually all got into it.

[edw]

You can't fix this if you still have engraved in your brain #nochanges whatever the band-aide may be.

[Kayze]

What is the point of this Fake Vanilla exactly? As a launch player, I don't understand what the draw is, as it was never like vanilla anyway. I'm guessing it's mostly seeing the old quests again, or for the first time? But the overall experience was never remotely possible, because almost two years if patches (including content) had gone by before that patch, and it's running on today's engine. At this point anything they do with Fake Vanilla will only anger people.

I'm sure quite a few just wanted to experience original WoW in some way, but most want it for...

Slower pacing and all levels/zones are relevant - Less urge to get to end game, more enjoying of the journey.
Less meaningless rewards - Gives a stronger sense of accomplishment than retail's 4-5 rewards per LFD run.
Somewhat challenging combat - Unlike retail, you can't pull a bunch of mobs and still guarantee a win. In fact it's the opposite. Classic forces more strategy in pulls and resource management.
Resource management - Actually having to think about how you spend your resource adds more strategy, regardless of how trivial it might be, in all parts of the game. In retail, this is only true for maximizing DPS meters in a raid or pvping. For most classes, food and drink items are a joke in retail, but vital in classic.
One class with multiple tweaks - Retail has 2-4 different classes based on its parent class. It's not bad but it does feel less like you're the actual class and much more a hyper focused specialization with loose ties to the class. Classic is more about being stronger with some abilities/playstyles but is ultimately still one class.
A sense of community - Retail has no real social reputation because realms are all connected. You may never see nor interact with the same character again. Ninja loot? Who cares. Realm first? Meh. Top pvper of your realm? /golfclap. All these things matters when the population of a realm was consistent. You would be forced to name change if you had a bad rep on your realm.
Stronger progression feels - Despite lower power progression compared to retail, accomplishing goals takes more investment and there's no purchasable content skipping (level boosts). I've lost the connection with my characters on retail as they're all disposable. I mean, the 120 boost is only $60 and equips the character with gold, bags, and ilvl 385 gear; Or free for expansion purchasers.
Too many catch up mechanics - What's the point of even doing raids outside of LFR if the gear will be obsolete by the next major patch? I mean, You can get ilvl 380 gear in less than a week in Nazjatar, so what's the point in grinding Dazar'alor for 370/385 gear? Or if Mythic for 415, you can get 420 in Nazjatar far faster and easier.

I point all these out while having only really played retail for the last couple of months. The main draw to Classic is that the more reasonable pain points or challenges you have, the more rewarding something feels. It's basic game design. Retail is the result of extreme tweaking due to player feedback being taken literally towards trivial barriers like learning abilities at a class trainer or manually forming a group to complete a dungeon.

Retail ends up feeling less like a MMORPG and more like a theme park. Fun in its own right, sure, but less for the reason WoW was successful to begin with. Hopefully Shadowlands fixes this a bit.

[Niku]

AV premades still exist. Have you seen the premade discords? Hundreds of people queing at the same time in 5 man groups will still pop new games and see several groups together.

People have already tried Blizzard's approach on private servers, it's not new and didn't solve anything.

Less 35+ man pre mades roflstomping horde teams in under 5 minutes = happier horde players.

These 5 man pre mades getting more spread out into alliance pugs increasing the pugs chance att winning = happier alliance players.

People who want to play with friends can now easily queue for the same AV = Everybody with a friend happy.

Solid changes Blizzard, thank you.

[DechCJC]

Oh god I’m going to love reading posts from the nochanges crowd

[Nnyco]

This thread just proves once again what a cancer the classic community is.