Horrific Visions and Healer

[Caradras]

You call it bad design because a heal spec can’t do it as effectively as a dps

So by that logic leveling and all quests are bad design

You are comparing 2 different things. Quests and leveling are not on a timer. If the timer is to be removed the worst part would be fixed. imo ofc.

[Revamp Man]

I agree with the OP here and many are being jerks about his point of view. My main is a holy priest so i totally understand his point. If there wasnt a timer i wouldnt mind if it takes me longer than a dps to kill stuff, afterall iam not a dps. If the visions are easily ignored like the mage tower it would be fine aswell. However these visions are a big part of this patch and a very powerful item is locked behind it and they are on a timer! So i cant really ignore it or take my sweet time with it.

Personally i think its a bad design by blizzard to: put a timer in it, could also just have mobs that get gradually harder. Make it sort of mandatory (for raiders at least) and have it made with just 1 role in mind, dps. Any of these point could have easily been designed differently. But go ahead, keep telling healers they are playing the wrong class and are basically useless.

Healers always kill things slower

You can upgrade the cloak to r5 easily as just heals and the tech tree adds dps

To go higher you have to do things differently

If I wanna solo raid bosses in uldir I have to go tank spec

If I wanna solo some rares I need to go tank

You play a hybrid spec and say “I’m doing it In dps but will it become too much once my gear becomes outdated” yes yes it will....at rank 9+ but that rank is really unnecessary unless you are a heroic+ raider in which case you gear up your OS anyway

[Caradras]

Healers always kill things slower

Like i said, killing slower is not the problem. The scenario being on a timer is. A healer cannot use its class to heal himself and wittle down the mobs with low dps because the insanity will run out.

[Revamp Man]

You are comparing 2 different things. Quests and leveling are not on a timer. If the timer is to be removed the worst part would be fixed. imo ofc.

So the problem is the timer

So on my warrior that is about 430 with fuck all for weapons or essences I got the rank 7 relatively closely

Had 30% left on boss

Now let’s say you wanna get as much as possible out of the timer. You will grab 4 people.

Let’s say you wanna solo it well if you play the game and get gear you are already more geared. You use consumables and you do dps.

I think resto shammy is lowest dps right now and fairly certain they can do it

Besides the timer is not super important since as long as you kill side bosses they drop the items.

The tech tree also saves you

[endorus]

I mean, is this not a "trial" of sorts for Torghast in shadowlands?

Large part of next expansion is focused around 1-5 man scaling content (not timed but still why take 4 hours when you can take 1).

You're concerns are valid, I'd get them heard before you're stuck with this system for 2-3 years

[Caradras]

I dont see what your warrior has to do with anything since we were talking about healers?

The timer is the limiting factor here since it takes healers more time to kill stuff and they cant clear as far into the vision as a dps can. So they dont be able unlock the tech tree as fast and get the objectives to upgrade the cloak in a single run. Meaning that playing as a healer in this case is punished by blizzard because of the way its designed.

Dps also gets gear and consumables so thats not some special advantage a healer has?

Playing in a group isnt really helping if the talents for solo play were chosen in the tech tree.

[Gestopft]

I dont see what your warrior has to do with anything since we were talking about healers?

I think his point about his warrior was probably that you don't need to optimize at all to keep up with progression as a DPS. There's no indication yet that you'll need to run visions with any masks on in order to max the cloak at rank 15, so even a non-optimized DPS spec should be more than sufficient to maximize your cloak in the long run (especially since we won't be able to max it until mid-march)

[GreenJesus]

Healing specs are not meant to solo. Stop moaning and go find a group or switch to your dps spec. I, as a mage, have gear for all specs, you should too.

??? All your specs are ranged DPS and can use the same stats and weapons and trinkets.. lol

[Dziubla]

??? All your specs are ranged DPS and can use the same stats and weapons and trinkets.. lol

For the purpose of visions, that applies to every class and spec (well, with some minor exceptions of course, at least in case of weapons). Visions aren't raids, where you need all your stats optimized and perfected and need to fight for every 0.001% dps. You can play them just fine with shitty stats, wrong trinkets, and even wrong azerite traits if you want to. As long as you play them in dps spec. Sure, you probably won't do a full clear, you won't be as efficient as optimized dps, but you will be much more efficient than playing it in a healing spec.

Which is why I absolutely don't understand the problem some people have with switching, and find these complaints to be simple complaining for the sake of complaining. I'm a resto shaman, and I can switch to enh. Why can't you?

[GreenJesus]

For the purpose of visions, that applies to every class and spec (well, with some minor exceptions of course, at least in case of weapons). Visions aren't raids, where you need all your stats optimized and perfected and need to fight for every 0.001% dps. You can play them just fine with shitty stats, wrong trinkets, and even wrong azerite traits if you want to. As long as you play them in dps spec. Sure, you probably won't do a full clear, you won't be as efficient as optimized dps, but you will be much more efficient than playing it in a healing spec.

Which is why I absolutely don't understand the problem some people have with switching, and find these complaints to be simple complaining for the sake of complaining. I'm a resto shaman, and I can switch to enh. Why can't you?

Why is that? Do visions normalize stats or something?

[schwarzkopf]

Two words: Ghastly Goulash. Thank me later.

2%/second doesn't help much when I'm getting 50% chunks ripped off me in the medium area.

[Dziubla]

Why is that? Do visions normalize stats or something?

Let's assume it's not a troll question.

No, they don't. And yet, depending on what your goal is for them, what I said in previous post still applies, at least to the "I REFUSE TO SWITCH TO DPS" crowd. I'm assuming such crowd isn't exactly planning on doing full runs with 5 masks asap. They probably want to upgrade their cloaks, get some mementos, upgrade the tech tree, and work on it slowly. And, guess what - they can, even with gear completely fucked up. IF they don't stubbornly refuse to switch to dps. DPS spec with fucked up gear will still be ahead of fully optimized gear with a healer spec. Which one you choose is ultimately up to you, but intentionally gimping yourself, and complaining about "hurr durr bad blizzard" is...dishonest, in my opinion.

And if my assumption is wrong, and these people want to do full runs with 5 masks...then they should know the game enough by now to know that off specs are somewhat mandatory to any competitive player, and being hellbent on sticking to one spec only (especially a spec NOT designed for soloing) will bite you in the ass, sooner or later.

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2%/second doesn't help much when I'm getting 50% chunks ripped off me in the medium area.

If you're getting 50% chunks ripped off you then you're standing in avoidable shit. No mob in there hits for 50% hp with unavoidable hits.

[schwarzkopf]

No mob in there hits for 50% hp with unavoidable hits.

They do if there isn't a tank to take the hit and you are a soft squishy, and there are 4 mobs whacking you.

PS: As a reference point, the very very first run I did (the freebie) - I ended up at 10% health and 80% sanity.
Subsequent runs, I never lasted long enough to even use the sanity resets... the health was always the limiting factor.

[Dziubla]

They do if there isn't a tank to take the hit and you are a soft squishy, and there are 4 mobs whacking you.

PS: As a reference point, the very very first run I did (the freebie) - I ended up at 10% health and 80% sanity.
Subsequent runs, I never lasted long enough to even use the sanity resets... the health was always the limiting factor.

Again, they don't, not with normal, unavoidable attacks. I only run solo, never a tank spec, plenty of squishies, not an issue.

I will switch to arcane just for you, to prove that you are the problem, and not the class.

Hell, even my 417 warlock can clear 2 corrupted areas and Alleria without much issue.

[schwarzkopf]

Again, they don't, not with normal, unavoidable attacks.

Again - they do, with normal unavoidable attacks....

, even my 417 warlock

Be surprised if it couldn't - after all they have a pet tank and self heals

I know it isn't me that is the problem because if I was standing in shit I'd be running out of sanity ... which never goes low enough to even need to use the sanity reset even once.

[Dziubla]

Again - they do, with normal unavoidable attacks....



Be surprised if it couldn't - after all they have a pet tank and self heals

I know it isn't me that is the problem because if I was standing in shit I'd be running out of sanity ... which never goes low enough to even need to use the sanity reset even once.

Only mini bosses+some elites drain sanity with attacks (and most of those attacks are avoidable) - normal trash does not. So your "proof" is invalid.

Other than that, I wrote a lengthy reply with some pointers, but honestly...the fact that you supposedly can't even use sanity orbs is just...I don't know. I will just say this - if you're not trolling, or exaggerating (and I really hope you are) then...it is you. Pull fewer mobs, learn what to interrupt and dodge, get goulash, and it's literally impossible to die, even for the squishiest of classes.

[schwarzkopf]

Only mini bosses drain sanity with attacks (and most of those attacks are avoidable) - normal trash does not. .

You were referring to standing in shit ... not normal trash, which just hits normally and is as I said the problem that exists.

Anyway - I just tried to help the OP, and you start full nonsensical bulldog mode - so I'm outta here.

[Dziubla]

You were referring to standing in shit ... not normal trash, which just hits normally and is as I said the problem that exists.

Anyway - I just tried to help the OP, and you start full nonsensical bulldog mode - so I'm outta here.

You were refering to health problems, not sanity, and standing in shit that normal trash does will, indeed, cause health problems.

And no, I wasn't going into any "bulldog mode", I was trying to help you But I guess I'm wasting my time, since every single one of your posts about mage in visions for the whole week kinda proves you're beyond help So I guess I'm outta here too.

[Yayeet]

Then forcing healers (and tanks to a lesser extent) to have to group up is just poor design IMO.

Visions are either a group content or a solo content. If it is a solo content, then it needs to be viable solo content for everyone (not just DPS). If it is a group content, then make it a proper 5 man content with 1/1/3 setup like dungeons.

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There's a problem with that as well. I dunno if the talents can be swapped at the Chamber. So people will need to commit to either picking all the grp ones (right side of tree) or the solo ones (left side of tree). At least early, you just wont get enough orbs to level both at the same time.

It's a you problem not a design problem, stop being so fixed on blaming the developers for your lack of trying to play a dps offspec.

Every healer class has a dps offspecs, no excuse.

[Jetstream]

Are they doable as a healer. Or go offspec DPS or GTFO ?

I did this currently on DPS offspec on both my healers. But at present I have the offspec gear to support this. But as we go deeper and as my DPS gears falls behind (trinkets etc for Nyalotha), my healing gear will always be superior.

So, if healers have to go DPS for this, unless they maintain a good DPS set, they will go behind in cloak level of DPS mains who actually gear for DPS.

I run it as a Holy Priest. It's fine.