Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Elegiac]

Well, things are not looking stellar for Trump's close friend and fellow criminal Netanyahu.

First, he gave up on seeking total immunity from the law just before it was taken away by force, and was immediately indicted for bribery and corruption.

Second, while Netanyahu was preparing to immediately annex West Bank homes with Trump's blessing, he might want to step back from that. While we STILL don't know what's in the now farcical Middle East peace plan, we do know the WH has urged Netanyahu to wait -- because such annexation would sour other nearby Arab countries (especially Jordan) from signing on, immediately tanking the deal and making Trump look bad.

Thirdly, I still don't think Israel has a proper government. There's an election March 2.

The Middle East peace plan is due shortly. Trump enters into it with his closest ally unable to help and also indicted, one of the primary signatures vehemently opposed to the whole thing (and, again, could possibly lose even more by Israeli annexation), and souring feelings from former allies such as Iraq. Yet another of Trump's signature deals is about to burst into flames in public.

You wanna go in on trademarking "Bye Bye Bibi" merch, as an aside?

[Breccia]

Once again, it's time for Guess the Speaker!

The Fed should get smart & lower the Rate to make our interest competitive with other Countries which pay much lower even though we are, by far, the high standard. We would then focus on paying off & refinancing debt!

"One ten...one twenty...Trump?"

Correct.

"Um...isn't intentionally weakening the dollar to game interest rates with other countries literally currency manipulation, the thing he accused China of doing?"

You know how Trump do. That which he does, he accuses others of.

"Um, didn't Phase One, found here say and I quote, that the US 'shall refrain from competitive devaluations and not target exchange rates for competitive purposes, including through large-scale, persistent, one-sided intervention in exchange markets'?"

Why yes, yes it does.

"Will the Fed listen?"

Probably not. As I posted mere hours ago, the Fed is running short on money because, well, some jackass tanked the economy. Lowering rates won't help them make it back up. Trump has used QE and other options and the Fed has burned through about half their assets just trying to keep things on level ground. 2020 isn't looking to be any better. There's minimal effect the Fed could have without blowing their entire load before the climax. It happens to a lot of fatasses.

- - - Updated - - -

In another conveniently-timed double header, Warren announces a plan to help the CDC fight nasty infectious diseases while this former CDC head said in an interview that the coronavirus transmits easier than SARS.

Again, I do hope the existing protocols, tools, and training of the US keep this from actually killing people. It's just that, well, when world markets are reacting and CDC-cutting Trump just says "everything's cool" his track record with the truth and success are cause enough for people to be concerned.

[Edge-]

Trump: CHINA IS THE WORST, THEY MANIPULATE CURRENCY!

Also Trump: THE FED SHOULD LET ME MANIPULATE CURRENCY FOR ME RE-ELECTION!

This is why the Fed controls monetary policy, not administrations. Because it leads to terrible short-sighted decisions rather than sustainable long term ones.

[Breccia]

Trump: CHINA IS THE WORST, THEY MANIPULATE CURRENCY!

Related: the UK signed a deal with Huawei and now Trump is threatening them because of it.

[Edge-]

Related: the UK signed a deal with Huawei and now Trump is threatening them because of it.

I mean...at least he has a point with this one given the ongoing questions around Huawei. But considering what I've read of how they're using the tech it doesn't sound like it would connect with any government communications channels.

[Breccia]

So Trump unveiled his peace plan. It's a two state solution --

"The Palestinians don't care."

That gives them more land --

"The Palestinians don't care."

And a capital in Jerusalem.

"The Pale...wait, what?"

Yes, a capital in east Jerusalem.

"But...Trump gave Jerusalem to the Israelis!"

He did, and still does.

Under this vision, Jerusalem will remain Israel’s undivided — very important — undivided capitol

"But that means the Palestinians won't have a capital there!"

No, it does. It's both! Also he said it would end Palestine's dependency on foreign aid.

"Oh, so the Arab countries aren't giving money anymore?"

No, that's still part of the plan. Also this will end any security risk to Israel by Palestinians.

"...how?"

Because reasons. Also, there's going to be a Wall built between Jerusalem and the West Bank.

"Then how do the Palestinians get to their own capital?"

Through the tunnel!

"Then why have a Wall?"

Also, Israel gets the West Bank. Like, all of it. Palestinians are also to immediately demilitarize and hand over all security to Israel. You can find this and more information from FOX News so there will be no blaming Fake News today!

"But half of this stuff contradicts the other half! They get Jerusalem but they don't, there's a Wall and a tunnel under the Wall, they give up their weapons and expect Israel not to immediately evict them from the West Bank?"

Well, this is what you should expect when a deal is made with only one person present. You know, the one under indictment for corruption. Who might not even be in charge. I especially like the part where, if Palestine rolls over like a good little doggie, Israel might maybe reduce their armed security patrols if they feel like it. Oh, and the Palestinians get a resort area. Because that's what Trump thinks will solve the issue in the Middle East: a hotel.

And this just in: the Palestinians have rejected it! Also courtesy FOX News, no blaming Fake News today!

I admittedly did not expect Trump to unveil "Schroedinger's Jerusalem" but honestly, this was burned to ashes before even being planted.

Palestinian prime minister: Trump peace plan meant to 'finish off' Palestinian cause

Palestinian Prime Minister Mohammad Shtayyeh said on Monday that President Trump’s not-yet-released Middle East peace plan is meant to “finish off the Palestinian cause."

“We reject it, and we demand the international community not be a partner to it because it contradicts the basics of international law and inalienable Palestinian rights,” he said at a Cabinet meeting in the West Bank, according to Reuters.

“It is nothing but a plan to finish off the Palestinian cause,” he added.

(From yesterday)

We also know Trump's dollar figure: $50 billion. Which will somehow come from other countries. At time of writing I can find no country that has volunteered to pay for any of this -- but if you find it, please let me know. I'm really interested in seeing how much, say, Saudi Arabia is willing to pay for this, because that was the whole point.

- - - Updated - - -

The federal budget deficit is estimated by the CBO to average $1.3 trillion per year this coming decade.

The 2020 deficit is expected to surpass $1 trillion for the first time since the four-year period following the Great Recession. The highest deficit on record was in 2009, reaching roughly $1.4 trillion.

After a decade, the debt-to-GDP ratio would hit $36 trillion, or 98 percent of GDP, the highest ratio since World War II, and double the average level of that time period.

I want everyone here, including the rabid fanbase, to actually go back and ask "what did Trump promise about the deficit and the debt when he was running?" Failure to ask yourself that question is only allowable if you admit you already know the answer.

[Belize]

-snip-

Wow, the Peace Plan is even dumber than I could have foreseen. This is some next level idiocy.

[Paranoid Android]

.ERNST: "IA caucuses are this next Monday evening. And I'm really interested to see how this discussion today informs and influences the Iowa caucus voters, those Demcaucus goers. Will they be supporting VP Biden at this point?"

H/T @JaxAlemany https://t.co/tYYkSPuIDY

https://twitter.com/alanhe/status/12...004799488?s=19

Shh! You shouldn't admit what you are trying to cover up for Trump is the actual truth, to hurt Biden politically.

[Breccia]

Wow, the Peace Plan is even dumber than I could have foreseen. This is some next level idiocy.

See...here's the thing. I actually think it's better than expected. It looks like Trump actually tried to come up with something the Palestinians might actually want.

He was just really wrong. Because he projected. The Palestinians don't just want more land if they're forced to move from their homes. They don't just want a farm if they have to give up their guns to get it. And they definitely don't want money and a hotel to legally give up their claim on land that is sacred to them.

There's a point in Dragon Age 2 when one of your party members gets in a big huff because her starting shield, given to her by her husband, is sold off for gold. And I'll bet fucking everyone was like "Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh wow, right, what the hell were we thinking?" Because to the average player, the NPC's love of her husband wasn't a factor.

Trump just treated Jerusalem like an NPCs white-quality shield. "Yeah, but this one has better stats!" I've seen players ragequit over transmog. Maybe that's excessive. But now, do the same thing, only with holy land.

Trump praised his own plan for an hour by how many details it had. But they weren't details that mattered to the Palestinians. They were details Trump assumed mattered to the Palestinians. Because he never asked them. And he projected his own values -- I mean, I could stop right there -- onto people risking their lives every day because of their religion. And he came up with "I'll give you double the land if you give up your ability to fight back, while digging a tunnel directly to the country that wants you dead the most. PS they're also your police and army now."

And yes, I hit "refresh" first this time, there's more!

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said on Tuesday that a U.S. peace plan envisages the proposed Palestinian capital be located in Abu Dis, a neighborhood on the outskirts of Jerusalem.

After U.S. President Donald Trump presented his peace plan, Netanyahu told reporters the United States recognizes Jerusalem as Israel’s undivided capital, “by which I mean, within its fences,” an apparent reference to municipal boundaries.

The right-wing leader, who faces a new election in March, said he would bring a proposal for applying Israeli jurisdiction to the Jordan Valley, the northern Dead Sea and West Bank settlements for Cabinet approval at its next session, probably on Sunday.

“Israel is offering the Palestinians, at the end of the process, conditional, limited sovereignty,” Netanyahu said.

Palestinians were absent from Trump’s announcement and Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas called the plan the “slap of the century.”

Wow. This gets worse and worse.
1) So, Israel gets Jerusalem, Palestinians get "Jerusalem-adjacent, just outside the fence".
2) The two-state solution in which one side gets "conditional, limited sovereignity" is not two states. It is a man and his pet.
3) Slap of the century directly refutes everything Trump said about doing better than every President ever.

[Shadowferal]

It just looks like Trump tried; Trump's Mideast peace plan skews heavily toward Israel, with few concessions to Palestinians

[Nurasu]

It just looks like Trump tried; Trump's Mideast peace plan skews heavily toward Israel, with few concessions to Palestinians

He didn't even do that, in my opinion. The bulk of the plan is the 4 year settlement freeze while they come up with an actual agreement!! The Palestinians give up every bit of resistance they have and cede the West Bank while Israel hopefully continues to negotiate with them for the next 4 years, but eh, maybe they won't. Oh well.

The plan calls for a four-year freeze in new Israeli settlement construction, during which time details of a comprehensive agreement would be negotiated, according to Trump administration officials who spoke on condition of anonymity ahead of Trump's announcement. However, it was not immediately clear if the freeze could be extended if a final deal is not concluded within the four-year timeframe.

It's an absolute joke. I had low expectations, but this didn't even meet those.

[Breccia]

The bulk of the plan is the 4 year settlement freeze while they come up with an actual agreement!!

Jeez, how did I miss that? The Austin Powers approach? This is a political stunt, to wave a piece of paper in front of the cameras and hold the rest of the plan hostage, just like with China, the Wall, and divorcing Melania.

[Belize]

...and divorcing Melania.

Don't give her any false hopes like that.

[Breccia]

Aaaaaaaaand we're not done.

More and more world leaders are giving their say, but this one stands out:

We will not allow the government of Israel to recognize a Palestinian state in any eventuality

Guess who said that?

"Iran, Hamas, Hezbollah?"

No...okay yes, but also, Israel's Defense Minister Bennett. You know, the guy most interested in the security situation. Even with the provision that the Palestinians had to disarm, he hates it.

One other comment got to me: maybe this isn't about peace anymore. Maybe this is about saying "the dispute has gone on long enough, the US declares Israel the winner, and let's move on with our lives". Which is a comment that almost made sense, except the whole thing is religious in origin. Imagine going to, I dunno, the RNC and saying "Look, you're just going to have to accept that there are gay people and abortions. It's time for you to move on and focus on smaller government and personal responsibility." Try to imagine how that'd go over.

[Edge-]

It just looks like Trump tried; Trump's Mideast peace plan skews heavily toward Israel, with few concessions to Palestinians

Considering this plan was created without Palestinian involvement, and they messaged their disapproval early. This is totally not surprising.

[Gaidax]

Who cares about that plan.

As Israeli myself, people have 0 illusions about this plan here - it's not something that Palestinians will ever accept, so for all I care - they just made some photos and spoke big words all about nothing there in Washington.

No...okay yes, but also, Israel's Defense Minister Bennett. You know, the guy most interested in the security situation. Even with the provision that the Palestinians had to disarm, he hates it.

This literally does not matter, tbh, at least Bennet has balls to say what he thinks about it as opposed to Netanyahu and bunch of others who know full well they don't even need to voice their displeasure with various parts there, because Palestinians will do all the work of sinking it for them anyway.

You think Netanyahu and Gantz really want this plan? Ha ha, funny. Like... maaaaaaybe Gantz, but Netanyahu with his religious zealot allies? Yeah, nope. He will hail it to no end, just to please his pal in WH and to have an opportunity to say "well, I tried, but the other side just screwed it all", safely knowing that this "plan" is dead on arrival anyway.

All in all, Palestinians are about to lose big time - them rejecting it outright is a big mistake and it will cost them, but I don't really give a diddly squat there anyway. This shit will keep going for hundreds of years anyway.

[Edge-]

https://www.npr.org/2020/01/28/80053...rter-from-trip

Trump, a piece of shit as always, praised Pompeo for his temper tantrum and threw some shade at Mary Louise Kelly for acting like a professional.

Unsurprisingly, this didn't go over well in a room full of her colleagues. But it did, apparently, get some applause from aides in attendance.

[noidentity]

https://www.npr.org/2020/01/28/80053...rter-from-trip

Trump, a piece of shit as always, praised Pompeo for his temper tantrum and threw some shade at Mary Louise Kelly for acting like a professional.

Unsurprisingly, this didn't go over well in a room full of her colleagues. But it did, apparently, get some applause from aides in attendance.

The snowy of flakes.

[Wyrt]

Considering this plan was created without Palestinian involvement, and they messaged their disapproval early. This is totally not surprising.

Any peace plan that doesn't include all parties is doomed to fail from the start.

[Breccia]

Any peace plan that doesn't include all parties is doomed to fail from the start.

Jerusalem is not for sale, our rights are not for sale and are not for bargain and your deal, the conspiracy will not pass.

--Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas

My concern, however, is that Netanyahu, also desperate to deflect from the crimes he's being indicted for, shrugs and says "Well we tried, LEEROOOOOOOI SCHMUCKINS" and zergs the West Bank.

With Trump's blessing.

Because I have the increasing feeling Trump still wants that war, and the US curb-stomping Palestine would actually be one he could win by November, while shedding crocodile tears of "Well they had their chance, I gave them the bigliest deal ever, I weep for those children whose lives I objectively ended only without dog cages this time", flies a MISSION ACCOMPLISHED banner and is greeted in rally after rally by thunderous applause by his best supporters and their white hoods.
@Skroe might disagree about attacking Iran, but I haven't heard his opinion on this yet. If Israel just up and attacks Palestinian settlements filled with unarmed civilians, what will Trump do?