Do Animal Souls Go To The Shadowlands?

[Selastan]

If so, does that mean mean Nesingwary has his own little corner of animal hell?

[Morae]

What about mr. bigglesworth!

I ... accidentally killed the cat! Out of curiosity! Will it be there waiting for me? Will it rain terrible vengeance upon me for ending its life in such meaningless manner?

[Amnaught]

I mean, there are animals in the shadowlands, so, we can only assume that those play a similar role to animals that kyrians (etc) play to the living races. Dead animal souls waiting to be reborn.

[Kyphael]

If Saberon have souls that go there, all animals better. Saberon were initially mindless beasts no different than those you'd find in the jungle, the only difference was they walked upright. I've never understood human arrogance to think that humans have souls and animals don't. We're all living beings. The concept of reincarnation is much more logical. You fuck up, you come back as the thing you made suffer.

[Kokolums]

I've never understood human arrogance to think that humans have souls and animals don't. We're all living beings.

The distinction between animals and sentient life is a good debate. Here are some ways people draw the distinction. These are all considered to be "in general" so even if you find some examples that dispute these, it is generally considered that OVERALL, they apply for the sake of the argument.

1. Animals are not self aware. (this makes humans above animals)
2. Animals are not intelligent enough to recognize themselves in a mirror. (this makes humans above animals)
3. Animals lie. (this classifies ALL life forms on Earth as animals, none have advanced far enough to become truly sentient)
4. Animals are totally ruled by their emotions, while humans are able to override the base animal instincts to an amazing degree with their large complex brains and this makes them sentient.
5. Animals don't have opposable thumbs. This is an interesting argument because it says we could never have been able to develop like we did without incredible hand dexterity.

[Drusin]

If humans have souls animals have souls since humans are animals.



Why would intelligence or sentience play any role on something like a soul?

[Kyphael]

The distinction between animals and sentient life is a good debate. Here are some ways people draw the distinction. These are all considered to be "in general" so even if you find some examples that dispute these, it is generally considered that OVERALL, they apply for the sake of the argument.

1. Animals are not self aware. (this makes humans above animals)
2. Animals are not intelligent enough to recognize themselves in a mirror. (this makes humans above animals)
3. Animals lie. (this classifies ALL life forms on Earth as animals, none have advanced far enough to become truly sentient)
4. Animals are totally ruled by their emotions, while humans are able to override the base animal instincts to an amazing degree with their large complex brains and this makes them sentient.
5. Animals don't have opposable thumbs. This is an interesting argument because it says we could never have been able to develop like we did without incredible hand dexterity.

1. True, but is self-awareness indicative of a soul?
2. So a human being born mentally deficient, unable to recognize themselves in the mirror does not have a soul because they cannot recognize themselves in a mirror. Natives in the Amazon probably would't be able to recognize themselves in a mirror.
3. A bit confused about this. Animals lie or humans lie? Either way, dolphins and apes have shown communication skills incomprehensible to human understanding. Fifty thousand years ago, we were no smarter than many apes and dolphins.
4. Animals can override their emotions. They experience fear, sorrow, and separation anxiety. They protect their young, family, and territory with their lives, and will turn and run away out of fear to preserve their life if faced with a deadly predicament. Dogs have shown incredible aptitude and saved their owners from certain death, be it fire or other medical emergencies by running out to get help. Elephants mourn the death of their own fallen. Sure, some animals like wolverines can't override their emotions, and will fight to the death, but not all animals are created equal, and many species are more intelligent than others, making the criteria of what level of intelligence indicates self-awareness and thereby having a soul even more complicated.
5. Chimpanzees, gorillas, orangutans and old world monkeys all have opposable thumbs. They can be taught rudimentary tasks like pressing buttons or recognizing shapes and other critical thinking exercises.

It's no doubt humans are above animals in every way imaginable, but animals are not as dumb as we think, they're just lower down on the evolutionary chain. 50 thousand years ago, we were on the same level. We're just evolutionary freaks. One theory says our brains grew bigger than those of our primate cousins when early humans cooked their food, which made meat and veggies more digestible and nutrients more available to the body. After all, humans have shown the ingenuity of doing things without having any hands.

[Kokolums]

1. True, but is self-awareness indicative of a soul?
2. So a human being born mentally deficient, unable to recognize themselves in the mirror does not have a soul because they cannot recognize themselves in a mirror. Natives in the Amazon probably would't be able to recognize themselves in a mirror.
3. A bit confused about this. Animals lie or humans lie? Either way, dolphins and apes have shown communication skills incomprehensible to human understanding. Fifty thousand years ago, we were no smarter than many apes and dolphins.
4. Animals can override their emotions. They experience fear, sorrow, and separation anxiety. They protect their young, family, and territory with their lives, and will turn and run away out of fear to preserve their life if faced with a deadly predicament. Dogs have shown incredible aptitude and saved their owners from certain death, be it fire or other medical emergencies by running out to get help. Elephants mourn the death of their own fallen. Sure, some animals like wolverines can't override their emotions, and will fight to the death, but not all animals are created equal, and many species are more intelligent than others, making the criteria of what level of intelligence indicates self-awareness and thereby having a soul even more complicated.
5. Chimpanzees, gorillas, orangutans and old world monkeys all have opposable thumbs. They can be taught rudimentary tasks like pressing buttons or recognizing shapes and other critical thinking exercises.

It's no doubt humans are above animals in every way imaginable, but animals are not as dumb as we think, they're just lower down on the evolutionary chain. 50 thousand years ago, we were on the same level. We're just evolutionary freaks. One theory says our brains grew bigger than those of our primate cousins when early humans cooked their food, which made meat and veggies more digestible and nutrients more available to the body. After all, humans have shown the ingenuity of doing things without having any hands.

You didn't read my post. I'll repost it again for you.

"These are all considered to be "in general" so even if you find some examples that dispute these, it is generally considered that OVERALL, they apply for the sake of the argument."

[Omedon]

This thread went Star Trek the Next Generation in a real hurry haha!

[matrix123mko]

If humans have souls animals have souls since humans are animals.



Why would intelligence or sentience play any role on something like a soul?

Because soul is often associated with thinking. It is considered to be "meta brain" that thinks above your instincts.

Unless we go Christian way. Then soul is an opposite of sentience. It is just an instinct to go to God no matter the cost.

[MrLachyG]

If so, does that mean mean Nesingwary has his own little corner of animal hell?

yeah probably. he better stay out of the Ardenweald if he knows what's good for him

[Wyrt]

I would assume so.

If titans have souls, malfunctioning robots have souls, aliens have souls, and native sentient species have souls then there's no reason at all to think animals don't have souls.

[PuppetShowJustice]

I hope when we get to The Maw that it's absolutely flooded with all the turtles that didn't make it to the water.

[Kajitheninja]

Everything that dies goes to the shadowlands. Everything is filled with anima and when something dies its anima is brought to the shadowlands and is spread back into the beings there. the more powerful the being the more anima so even the tiniest creatures have some anima to contribute in death

[Stormwolf64]

Must be terribly crowded if everything goes there. Azeroth/earth is balanced as we have death, but the afterlife?...

[Lupinemancer]

Considering that the Shadowlands are said to be infinite, with countless realms that serves as different afterlives, it's possible there is one that is exclusive to Animals, like in Budhism where there are six or seven afterlives, and humans go to one realm and animals go to another upon death.

[Stormwolf64]

Considering that the Shadowlands are sid to be infinite, with countless realms that serves as different afterlives, it's possible there is one that is exclusive to Animals, like in Budhism where there are six or seven afterlives and humans go to one realm and animals go to another upon death.

Then i guess we get an expansion without animals

[Schattenlied]

Must be terribly crowded if everything goes there. Azeroth/earth is balanced as we have death, but the afterlife?...

Well, speaking for at least one realm of the Shadowlands, Ardenweald, souls that go there are generally broken down into their anima and used to regenerate the more powerful beings (like Cenarius) that go there to commence their reincarnation process. You essentially become soul food (hah) if you get sent there, unless you're one of the reincarnates...

So, they won't have an overpopulation problem at least.

[Lupinemancer]

Then i guess we get an expansion without animals

That depends on if we actually go to one of these realms, assuming it exists, during the expansion. It's possible that later patches could add more zones and if it is indeed the case, we could see one such realm.
But it's all just a guess, I don't know.

[Chonar]

These are questions Blizzard is not qualified to answer as long as the existence of souls is not scientifically proven in our reality.
But if we're talking about the fantasy realm of the Azerothian universe, sure why not! But only a bunch of them.
Not basilisks.
Especially not basilisks.