Woltk has no right to the claim of being the best expansion while

[IceMan1763]

Argent dawn tournament made me quit. Grind was awful.

It gave no relevant gear... why not just skip it?

[Deferionus]

Woltk has no right to the claim of being the best expansion while we have people complain about every little thing in newer expensions:

1. woltk leveling was repetetive

2. flying was locked at the beginning

3. dunegeons/ raids were mostly faceroll, if you did not artificaly increased the difficulty

4. most mounts were reskins

5. no world content

6. extrem time gating

7. more and more

Your flaw is comparing WOTLK content to modern expansions as opposed to comparing it to the expansion before it and other MMORPGs that were out at the time. Every WoW expac improved questing upon the prior expac. Flying was less gated than it is now with you just leveling to max and buying the unlock.

The problems WOTLK had was the first raid tier being too easy. The only challenging fight was Sarth 3 drakes. 5 mans were a step down from Burning Crusade, and this issue would not be fixed until Mythic was released in Legion. And finally, ToC patch in general was bull shit.

Leveling was great the time. It had an iconic end boss with great lore. It felt like a true ending to the story that began in WC3. Lich King and Yogg Saron are still two of my favorite fights. Putricide and XT were memorable bosses. WOTLK did a lot right.

[anveena]

And yet it's still far better than the trash they've put out for like a decade.

[Gasparde]

2010 game has no right to be considered good because people complain about said 2010 content 10 years later in a 2020 game. Solid arguing.
Tetris has no right to be popular, after all people criticize WQs for being repetitive.

WotLk, much like Classic, much like TBC, was great for it's time. If it was released nowadays it wouldn't be nearly as successful, but that doesn't fucking matter when you're talking about a 10 year old game.

[Garretdejiko]

What would you do if Wrath of the Lich King was your dad?

OT: WotLK was WoW's gameplay peak. 3.1 was amazing, Ulduar is still regarded as the best Raid. ToC was bullshit, I'll admit it. The went right back up with ICC. Plateaued untill FL and then, downhill.

[lockybalboa]

Wotlk is shite compared to BFA and WoD

[Kumorii]

It gave no relevant gear... why not just skip it?

Honestly can't remember. I just remember that's when I quit. Reason was because of the grinds and got sick of dailies. Think I have a compulsion to do dailies which is on me, but it was especially bad.

I know people will say BFA is more grindy, but I honestly don't feel so much pressure to grind so I was happy when I came back in Legion. Could also be because of the near decade long break.

[Rendark]

And yes it was the best. Weird....

[Memnok]

Wrath Babies like them some wotlk, I did like how my rogue played in wotlk but BC, Mop and Legion was the most fun for me, MoP would be way higher on most peoples list but too many people can't get over pandas, if you would replace pandas with some other race like trolls the xpac would have been 1 or 2 on most lists. Wotlk got so many subs cause the xpac leading into it was so good.

Vanilla was not an xpac, I see it on too many best xpac lists!

[FelPlague]

You obviously didn´t play the game, why do you comment?

And no, WotLK was good. Only problem with it was making raiding easier, and that is only to certain degree...

yes i did play in wotlk.

wotlk made the game easier for everyone, which is something some call a minus
the classes were super imbalanced
yes it introduced store mounts
ToC, ruby sanctum, the eye, obsidian sanctum
naxramas and onyxias lair, both literally just old raids
removed corrupted ashbringer, old nax gear, and also including aetiesh.
had a year long drought.


so yes, i did play in wotlk, did you?

[Rusken]

Wrath was one of the worst expansions, if you look at it objectively.

Death Knights were released in a horrendously overpowered state to garner attention. People in the Beta were warning that they were too strong when you could leave the intro zone and solo elite quests in HFP 5 levels higher than you. They then proceeded to dominate almost every aspect of the game for the whole expansion.

First raid was re-hashed content and incredibly easy. Widely panned as one of the worst raids released.

Introduced LFG tool which is regarded as the community-killer of the game.

Massively dumbed down all 5-man content to cater for the lack of thought capability of people using LFG tool.

Making the LFG tool mandatory to maximise character progression through daily heroics, CTA bags etc.

Heirlooms and LFG tool also completely destroyed the leveling experience, get your full set and dungeon spam from 15-80 with no thought or concern for the outside world or quests.

ICC being time gated for more than a month before guilds could run the whole raid in one go.

ICC content drought for a whole year with a shitty one-boss filler raid that no one did.

Wrath's only redemption comes from Ulduar being a great raid with interesting mechanics. I think a lot of people defend it as being so great because it was either the first expansion they played or everything after it was so bad that they remember it fondly (or they played a ret pally and enjoyed finally being viable). Most people who played Vanilla and BC would agree that one of them is the best version of the game.

[Biomega]

The big problem with this thread (and others like it) is that it feeds into people's prevalent misconceptions that conflate "favorite expansion" with "best expansion". Many people really LIKED WotLK because it had an iconic villain, it represented a large step up from previous ways of playing the game, it had the first new class, and so on - it was the height of WoW's popularity, pretty much, and everything that came with that feeling plays into people's nostalgia.

OBJECTIVELY, as people have pointed out above, WotLK had a plethora of flaws and introduced some features and design principles that continue to be regarded as controversial at best and problematic at worst (like LFR). The term "Wrath baby" comes to mind as a defining paradigm of that era, representing a fundamental shift in Blizzard's subsequent design philosophies. The difficulty tuning of WotLK, which made dungeons into spammy zergfests with little to no strategy involved, directly fed into the failure of Catacylsm's difficult heroics, and Blizzard's recognition of "we thought players would rise to a challenge, turns out they don't want to" which continues to influence the game to this day.

WotLK also had some of the worst raids in the history of the game - along with, paradoxically, some of the best. For all the glory of Ulduar and epicness of ICC, let us not forget that practically EVERY OTHER RAID in that expansion was absolutely terrible, including Trial of the Crusader and Ruby Sanctum which are largely regarded as THE worst raids ever made (and both Naxxramas 2.0 and Malygos are not far behind on that list).

[Wyrt]

Wrath was the expansion when you could unlock flying the earliest at level 77. Didn't even need to hit max to do it.

"But you could fly in BC at level 60!" No, no you could not. The level for base flying was not lowered until after BC.

[Echocho]

WotLK was by far the best, and the numbers support thiss.

Not growing by a single subscriber over the course of the expansion? Yup, great success

[Bane-Thunder-God]

Wrath is definitely the best expansion.

Followed by Legion.

[Zantera]

Wrath is close to the bottom for me and some of the reasons are:

-Raiding felt ezmode compared to TBC and it wasn't until the second half of the xpac we got some harder fights and even then it wasn't that challenging
-The raids themselves felt uninspired and dull, Ulduar was amazing and ICC was OK but Trial was terrible, Naxx was a joke and the mini dragon raids were lackluster
-Dungeons were the easiest they've ever been
-Not much to do outside raids as PVE'er (Argent Tournament got stale fast and doing a super easy 5-man dungeon for daily HC was really meh)

If you PVP'd in WotLK you probably had a great time though, as a PVE'er it was frustrating after TBC because TBC IMO had harder raids and dungeons but also more variety in them. (Aesthetics, music, design etc)

[sam86]

great bait 10/10

why did ur post get reported... u are 100% correct
i mean 'no world content', wtf was AT then? a dungeon patch?

[Pony Soldier]

Imma let you finish but WOTLK WAS THE BEST EXPANSION OF ALL TIME!

[Aigilas]

why did ur post get reported... u are 100% correct
i mean 'no world content', wtf was AT then? a dungeon patch?

because it was not "constructive" enough for the mods, that was the reason they gave.

didnt know that was a thing till now, live and learn as they say

[Kyphael]

Wrath is definitely the best expansion.

Followed by Legion.

They're my undisputed top 2 as well. Third best is a little harder to decide. Mists seems to be the clear choice, but I just didn't enjoy it from personal preference, the theme felt so detached from what I expected out of WoW at the time, so I didn't enjoy it in retrospect or appreciate its ingenuity and execution as much as I would today. Cataclysm was a disappointment in retrospect even though back then I enjoyed it. It's funny hot perspective changes with time. Only with Wrath and Legion it hasn't changed. I enjoyed them during their time and still think they were awesome today.