Serious discussion: Is this the end of Blizzard's "We'll release it when its ready?"

[Appelgren]

That's not the point, every game has bugs.

But not every game company is known for saying they "release it when it's ready" when it clearly wasn't ready.

I think people are over-interpreting the use of "ready". No games will ever be perfect on release. "Ready" is when the game generally works as intended.
I cant recall any blizz games lately that has been borderline broken and unplayable on release.

And to clarify before some dumbass will call me blizz fanboy or apologist or whatever ridicolous attribute they can spew.
Im not happy with bugs or problems either but I dont start 5000 threads about it bitching like a kid because of it.

Report the bug and move on. If its too much too handle then vote with your wallet. Stop paying for their stuff.

[kaminaris]

That's not the point, every game has bugs.

But not every game company is known for saying they "release it when it's ready" when it clearly wasn't ready.

And who is going to classify the game as "ready"? That is one of the most amusing argument for hatewagon community. I don't like it so it is not ready!

It doesn't make sense for ongoing projects to be released as polished as possible anyways. Software changes over time, improves. If you cannot accept that then you can always leave, not buy those games/products. Vote with your money but I am pretty sure it will just not work as people want new stuff fast, even if it is bugged.

It makes sense for one-time products like movies, single player games with story. But for remake of old products or ongoing mmo? Really doesn't.

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I think people are over-interpreting the use of "ready". No games will ever be perfect on release. "Ready" is when the game generally works as intended.
I cant recall any blizz games lately that has been borderline broken and unplayable on release.

And to clarify before some dumbass will call me blizz fanboy or apologist or whatever ridicolous attribute they can spew.
Im not happy with bugs or problems either but I dont start 5000 threads about it bitching like a kid because of it.

Report the bug and move on. If its too much too handle then vote with your wallet. Stop paying for their stuff.

Exactly, agree 100%. Don't like it? Dont pay for it but stop trying to push your misery and hate on everyone.

[MoanaLisa]

It is curious that releasing a buggy game is somehow less detrimental than a decent release.

From a business perspective it is nonetheless true.

I dunno how that can be when you can objectively conclude that games in the first state are broadly.... unappreciated.

Unless you have your hands in your eyes and eat whatever Blizzard, or any other company for that matter, feeds you, there is no way this is acceptable.

But sure let's all gather around the fire and sing "i don't care what's in the store if its just cosmetic"

Big commercial games will have bugs. It's inevitable. You can stand on your soapbox and say whatever you want and wait to buy games that are 100% bug free and good luck to you with that.

The calculation now is when have enough bugs been fixed that the product is generally playable for release. Every studio will make that determination for themselves and likely some studios will have a QA metric for a game that's different than other games they produce.

My point was simply that Blizzard has lost the ability to measure properly, or else the game is so large than when raids and dungeons feel OK that's when they go. I don't know their process. I do know what parts of the game they care about most, what they view as "important" and that likely leads to an uneven QA across the whole game.

[Jester Joe]

Because fucking Classic didn't remove features from Vanilla, nor did it implement new character models that sucked, nor did it charge you additional money (outside of the subscription of course) and you are comparing Classic to Warcraft3R for some reason as though they were were the same in quality?

Fuck these forums. There's nothing intellectually valuable here. Just a constant hunger for being right that people take a block of words, willfully ignore most it, and posit forth a response to something/nothing without putting an ounce of critical thinking or any thought.

I'm not sure how you're getting that when you're the one who came at me saying I was wrong without actually showing that I am wrong (you realize there's plenty of reasons why people could be annoyed/complaining right? There isn't one absolute reason).

Nowhere did I specify W3R. The OP mentioning it doesn't mean that's ALL to be talked about. And because I'm disagreeing now it's suddenly "no intellectual value" here because I'm not just mindlessly agreeing?

[bmjclark]

Honestly, i think you're living in a fantasy world if you think this has been the policy since at very least WoW released. Seriously, look at the bugs some of the first patches of WoW fixed, it was not ready to be released at all.

[LionSinMaikeru]

less leveling zones? were did you get that? I think in leveling we got what was announced, class campaigns???? they did not say or announce those were in BFA either, dude, if you are going to shit on something, do it right

There are less leveling zones. How is this a debate? Legion we had 4 zones to level in. In BFA we only have 3 per faction I.E. if you only play one faction, you have 3 zones compared to the previous expansion.

[Grimbold21]

You kidding? That ended after people screamed about BC not releasing in 2006.

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I'd point to two things. One, the "Early Access Effect." Two, the fact American's attention span is about the length of time for them to hit the youtube button and find another trailer to watch.

Releasing a bad game is fine because after 3 years of updates and some intensive modding it'll finally be a good game. But waiting too long to release means everyone forgets your game ever existed in the first place.

No one will forget that you released a crappy game though.

And only store mount buyers and excusers will let such slide

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

No one will forget that you released a crappy game though.

And only store mount buyers and excusers will let such slide

See I don't think that holds true anymore. I actually almost called the first one "The No Man's Sky Effect" but I didn't want to be that mean to Hello Games' miracle reclamation project.

Even if it takes you 3 years to finally deliver a good game, fan sentiment will turn on a dime as soon as they think the game is good.

It's also probably an effect of stuff like "recent reviews" instead of just "total reviews."

[Raone]

While this thread risks falling into a girpefest, I feel after seeing all the problems with WC3:R, and the problems with BfA - It really made me ask a serious question:

Are the days of Blizzard's age-old policy of "We'll release it when we feel it's ready" over?

Looking at all the problems WC3:R had, from every single bug and screen issue - to cinematics demonstrated in the trailer but not used in the game, to really REALLY cheap generic cinematics made for the game (Just saw the Arthas vs Illidan one... that is NOT Blizzard "ready" quality IMO!) and all the side-by-side resolution issues made me ask that question. This is NOT something Blizzard-quality, nor with all its issues is it something that should've been released at this point.

And this is all also on the backs of the reported discussions how Acti-Blizz upper echelons are forcing the devs to release stuff under resourced.

The Old Blizzard I know would've gladly punted WCIII:R to the end of this year than let it go out in the condition it currently is in to polish the bejesus out of it - and the audience, while there would be forum gripes for sure, would've still ultimately accepted it as par for the course for Blizzard-quality - knowing full well that letting something out in this state/condition is worse than postponing it for another several months.

So... is this the end of Blizzard's "We'll release it when it's ready" policy? Will we be seeing an unfinished/unpolished D4 by the end of 2021 (regardless of the Devs saying "it's not currently even Blizzard-soon ready" as the higher-ups might not care) as well as the same with Shadowlands for WoW whenever they release that one?

You do realize TBC was released as a buggy mess right? Like every raid was broken and many bosses were unkillable because of bugs. I mean Kael for example didn't reset agro when he became active and was untauntable, so the first thing he did was run around and killed all your healers the moment you hit p4 and this wasn't fixed for awhile :P They've never "waited till it's ready"

[Grimbold21]

See I don't think that holds true anymore. I actually almost called the first one "The No Man's Sky Effect" but I didn't want to be that mean to Hello Games' miracle reclamation project.

Even if it takes you 3 years to finally deliver a good game, fan sentiment will turn on a dime as soon as they think the game is good.

It's also probably an effect of stuff like "recent reviews" instead of just "total reviews."

Well then honesty people like that are not intelligent.

I went on the hype and nostalgia train and bought Total War Rome 2. Played it a couple of weeks tops and set it aside over how bad it was.

You could say the same for diablo 3. Fueled by nostalgia, bought and played it for a month. In that case philosophy decisions turned me away.

I mean, releasing a bugged game is meant to appease shareholders, pennypushers.
But wouldn't a game make much more money if it's in pristine condition?

[kaminaris]

I mean, releasing a bugged game is meant to appease shareholders, pennypushers.
But wouldn't a game make much more money if it's in pristine condition?

That depends of how fast you can fix things. If you follow RERO software philosophy it is arguably better system than old ways:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Releas..._release_often

Old ways work for one-time projects like movies/games that usually are done once and never again. For WoW RERO is much better.

First of all the gigantic risk of trying to polish your software as much as possible before releasing is having users out of feedback loop ending up a lot more complaints because of - long wait time, missing what users actually wanted.

[Shakana]

This. Sorry, but it's true. They're a victim of their own success, and havent been "games for gaming fanatics by gaming fanatics" for a long time.

I miss good old days, where you barely could be chatting on the internet, because the internet was kind of limited, and the games made you be a loner and all this corporations gaming shit, actually cared about the games they made because entertainment before was hard to get.

Unfortunately, i have no hopes in future gaming corporations and that includes blizz.

[kaminaris]

I miss good old days, where you barely could be chatting on the internet, because the internet was kind of limited, and the games made you be a loner and all this corporations gaming shit, actually cared about the games they made because entertainment before was hard to get.

Unfortunately, i have no hopes in future gaming corporations and that includes blizz.

That is example of rose tinted glasses. It is like saying you miss old days when you were poor because bread with jam tasted so good - only because you usually ate just bread.

And lets stop with logical fallacy like gaming companies used to care before and now they don't.
It is excuse for burning out of the game.

In entertainment business you either make people entertained or go down the drain. There is no way around it.
Good products makes money and no amount of advertisement and scams is going to change that. Look at fallout 76 sales.

[Arln]

Blizzard is yet to release a finished product, so no, those days are not over - they never have been.

[Shakana]

That is example of rose tinted glasses. It is like saying you miss old days when you were poor because bread with jam tasted so good - only because you usually ate just bread.

And lets stop with logical fallacy like gaming companies used to care before and now they don't.
It is excuse for burning out of the game.

In entertainment business you either make people entertained or go down the drain. There is no way around it.
Good products makes money and no amount of advertisement and scams is going to change that. Look at fallout 76 sales.

Because you don't want to see it, doesn't mean i'm wrong. Before games was hard to do, people nowadays and corporations don't care, just money. You're in denial about this, but the more you're in denial the worse.

[kaminaris]

Because you don't want to see it, doesn't mean i'm wrong. Before games was hard to do, people nowadays and corporations don't care, just money. You're in denial about this, but the more you're in denial the worse.

No I am not mindless sheep to be influenced what people say. It is you who is in denial because you seek approval of others.
And I don't. I enjoy much more BfA than previous expansions, I enjoy WC3R. Couldn't care less what people say about it.

[Shakana]

No I am not mindless sheep to be influenced what people say. It is you who is in denial because you seek approval of others.
And I don't. I enjoy much more BfA than previous expansions, I enjoy WC3R. Couldn't care less what people say about it.

I don't seek the approval of anyone, even more the reason why i keep saying what i see and believe and not what you said.
You were the one quoting me, trying to suck out a mood out of me, because you don't think i am right. as everything and everyone does in this forum.

[Kyphael]

Problem is, waiting is not possible anymore. Look at the forums. People allready loose their shit with a possible late year release. Imagine they delay SL into 2021.

All outrage poeple will leave in droves and never come back because of pride. I would gladly wait until summer 2021 for a really good new expansion.

But neither the players nor the shareholders are ok with this.

Good point. The vast majority would rather have a rushed release that isn't as polished as can be than wait six months to an year long for a higher quality game.

[kaminaris]

I don't seek the approval of anyone, even more the reason why i keep saying what i see and believe and not what you said.
You were the one quoting me, trying to suck out a mood out of me, because you don't think i am right. as everything and everyone does in this forum.

Of course you are not right, and that is a fact. Business in entertainment is cruel, and it always worked the same way, you entertain people you get money.
I am pretty sure it was like that at least 2 thousand years ago

Moreover you presented baseless claims that has been disproved multiple times about "good ol' days". AKA rose tinted glasses.
Biggest logical fallacy is thinking that gaming corporations somehow magically changed their ways

Look how that worked with loot boxes for other companies? They LOST money because of stupid ideas trying to "cheat" their way to money.
Customers are not stupid.

[Chickat]

That ended with Cataclysm. Cataclysm was the last expansion that felt polished.

Id argue MoP.