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  1. #541
    Herald of the Titans Baine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LanToaster View Post
    You should so very much fix your own System before you bitch about WoW, if you have this much Problems with the Game and Connection.

    I have had ZERO problems with Visions so far. No Bugs, No Lags, No weirdness.


    Maybe the game is not Designed for Scrubs who cant handle a PC?

    Try HelloKitty Online, maybe that game is not as Complex as WoW, and might be fit for you.
    Or just don't care about the system by purifying the gear.

  2. #542
    Quote Originally Posted by Pennem View Post
    Only thing I don't like about corruption is that there should be ways to corrupt gear yourself (like to roll for corruption). Right now it's just rng from drops and that feels like there's no way to work towards using corruption.

    If say we could use Corrupted mementos to not only cleanse, but corrupt gear that would be interesting.

    Overall though I think it's better than Titanforging but still rng heavy. I miss being able to work towards a strong piece of gear like the justice/valor system had and I think it would make gearing more interesting if systems like obtaining corruption was more under player control.
    Kinda agree

  3. #543
    I am Murloc! FlubberPuddy's Avatar
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    For me I think a piece of gear with simply better stats isn't as interesting anymore. I look forward to trinkets because they contain new effects (like how the wrathion trinket gives slow fall/wings/makes you run faster for a bit - the extra haste is a nice cherry but not the meat).

    Corruption is great in this way with interesting effects of infinite stars/twilight devastation/echoing void/that armor explosion one. I like that. But it should be acquirable in more interesting ways too.

    But a piece of gear from a +9 and that same piece of gear from a +10 with buffed up numbers simply doesn't feel that good at this stage anymore of the game. Our characters are really transcending from when they began in earlier expansions.

    It's time to be able to do more cool stuff through gear we're getting, hope to see more interesting effects in Shadowlands.

  4. #544
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeepBoo View Post
    Why should I have to lose to a situation like that? A guild completely willing to enable his fucking selfish corruption stacking instead of telling him to reign it in so they can actually drop a healer? Nah. The system shouldn't even allow the possibility for that type of gameplay to happen.
    You will always lose to a situation like that because there is always some way to pad a parse that skilled players enable. Every system allows for that type of gameplay because the better skilled everyone is the more they can ignore and out heal or whatever. Some may make the gap larger then others but it will always be there. You should be less focused on comparing yourself to people that are not even in the same bracket as you.

    It shouldn't even matter though because you clearly are not in the same bracket as that person. So comparing your parse to their parse is dumb. Its like a High school Football (North American) player thinking they suck because they don't have the stats of a NFL one.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
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  5. #545
    Quote Originally Posted by Aphrel View Post
    this has got to be the worst comeback ever^^

    Legion legendaries was the byfar most hated feature from the launch of that expansion up until they fixed the damn system in nighthold so that legendaries were actaully farmable on a somewhat acceptable timescale.
    The corruption gear is just as bad as legion legendaries. Infact, they might even be worse.
    And at the end of it, Legion is still viewed rather favorably by players. Still not seeing what the problem is. The prior 2 expansions also had '*forged' gear based on an RNG system, and there wasn't a huge outcry about it.

    Is it that a non raider can effectively become as geared as a raider with the correct focus on the correct content? There's all sorts of player-exclusionary tools out there to ensure that this is a non issue, so I'm not sure why anyone really cares about that.

    Prior to all these expansions, gear was FAR more static, and you were either raiding, or you weren't. And each group of players would very loudly complain that after a certain point in the week, there was "nothing to do"... because there wasn't.

    So which scenario is worse for the player?

  6. #546
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeepBoo View Post
    1) Plenty of guilds take turns giving their star DPS attempts to be as cheesy as possible.
    Then what is the problem? What for your turn to be in the cheese spotlight. You say the act of completing the raid is fun but then make statements that show it isn't just about the fun. And yes. It is always better for a player to change their mindset instead of wanting to force a game to adjust to one specific players mindset. This doesn't even cover how you are stating a conflicting mindset.

    The game isn't garbage design. You just don't have your turn in the spotlight so consider it garbage. After all you said it was about fun and not loot, numbers, or anything else. Or is it not about fun and about specific fleeting fame on a logging website?
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  7. #547
    Quote Originally Posted by zantheus1993 View Post
    My advice is to be comfortable with 97+ parses
    More like blue parses.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Then what is the problem? What for your turn to be in the cheese spotlight. You say the act of completing the raid is fun but then make statements that show it isn't just about the fun.
    The fun for me IS the competition that comes from just doing the raid. Hitting buttons is hitting buttons. Simply being in a raid doesn't change the act of hitting buttons that you do in the overworld. I hate the overworld. The act of just hitting keys over and over again in a relatively static pattern isn't entertaining enough in it's own right. If raids (more specifically, the competition they bring) were suddenly boiled down to just being button clicking sims with no competition, I'd quit. I don't play online games "for funsies" in the way you mean it. I play to own people and kick back, talking shit with my friends.

    And yes. It is always better for a player to change their mindset instead of wanting to force a game to adjust to one specific players mindset. This doesn't even cover how you are stating a conflicting mindset.
    No, you can't have a game that catered to the mindset and then just decide you want to sabotage those aspects suddenly (or slowly).

    The game isn't garbage design. You just don't have your turn in the spotlight so consider it garbage. After all you said it was about fun and not loot, numbers, or anything else. Or is it not about fun and about specific fleeting fame on a logging website?
    No, before "your turn in the spot light" was determined FAR more by your personal skill level as a player (wotlk era, where BIS was ez to get for basically anyone involved with a successful raid). Now, "your turn in the spot light" is relegated to luck and other people supporting you. That is a bad change in game design philosophy.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    You will always lose to a situation like that because there is always some way to pad a parse that skilled players enable. Every system allows for that type of gameplay because the better skilled everyone is the more they can ignore and out heal or whatever. Some may make the gap larger then others but it will always be there. You should be less focused on comparing yourself to people that are not even in the same bracket as you.
    "Give up because you will never be the absolute best, so what does it matter if you lose by an inch or a mile"
    Sounds like bitch quitter talk who was never actually had the luxury of being the best at anything.

    It shouldn't even matter though because you clearly are not in the same bracket as that person. So comparing your parse to their parse is dumb. Its like a High school Football (North American) player thinking they suck because they don't have the stats of a NFL one.
    You have literally dick all to back that up. I've gone nearly every tier before half-way through BFA (specifically, when they introduced benthic) getting orange parses on almost every boss.

    And besides that, you're using a no true scotsman fallacy. "Oh, you're not on his level, so it can't possibly apply to you." Fuck off with that horrible reasoning. Even if I got lucky and got orange parses like that dude, I'd still say the system sucks donkey dick.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Th3Scourge View Post
    well, you're options are:
    3. quit
    Already did that last tier thanks to the previous equally shitty system of benthic gear.
    Doesn't mean I'm not going to come on here and talk shit about blizz's bad design choices. I'm petty. I'll be here until the ship goes down in flames for their fuck-ups.

  8. #548
    Quote Originally Posted by BeepBoo View Post
    Already did that last tier thanks to the previous equally shitty system of benthic gear.
    Doesn't mean I'm not going to come on here and talk shit about blizz's bad design choices. I'm petty. I'll be here until the ship goes down in flames for their fuck-ups.
    Then why you so salty about the non-existent parses you wont be recording in your hiatus?

  9. #549
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    Welcome to opinions, you're saying his opinion is less than yours because he (and I) enjoy a system that you don't like.
    I'm well aware of how opinions work. I'm not saying your opinions that the system is fine are wrong. I'm saying that you can't sit here and tell me mine is wrong because <insert tons of reasons here> while 1) using bad logic and 2) ignoring my points or attempting to discount them.

    The only thing you can do is say "well, I don't care about the parts of the game you do, so it doesn't impact me" and then move on. The dude closest to that in this thread is the one who simply outlined what my options are, which i already did. Doesn't mean that, considering my perspective, the system isn't garbage.

    Difference is, Blizzards is obviously on our side with it because they haven't made any more sweeping corruption changes.
    Good for them. I don't see being on blizz's side as a good thing for any of their games. They're majorly fucking up right now.

    Blizzard wants people to play their games like koreans play their games: for hours on end, grinding the simplest, mindless shit that is EZ to develop while tossing tons of money at cosmetics and simultaneously not caring about things that are hard to develop, such as balance, engaging and challenging content, etc.

    Blizz is the company that released WC3: refunded. Made some fucking actually sincere comment about "hurr durr u no Haz PhoNe!?", etc. They are not a good game developer. They are a good money printer who has shifted their population to the mainstream general human, and the average human in every given context is measurably fucking garbage.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Th3Scourge View Post
    Then why you so salty about the non-existent parses you wont be recording in your hiatus?
    Same reason I went on mitusbishi's forums to bitch about their bastardization of the eclipse, turning a once-awesome sports car into a fucking SUV: I was once heavily emotionally invested in something unique that they offered and then unceremoniously stripped away with no viable replacement around and it left me with a hole that couldn't be filled and made me felt angry, and I enjoy online venting.

  10. #550
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baine View Post
    Or just don't care about the system by purifying the gear.
    I wish that was possible, fact of the matter is that some of the corrupted gear is so strong that the choice itself would be like playing with one hand tied on your back. Don't get me wrong, I understand that you mean to say that you have a choice, but when the difference in dps is 10k+ it's not a choice anymore.

    It's like playing with suboptimal specs. I see many people defend that with "If you don't go for world first then play what you like", that might hold some merid. Then again the fact is that no matter what level you play on, unnecessary wiping on a boss because half the team wants to play what they like not what spec might be a lot better than theirs, isn't fun either.

    I for one would love to see any of the previous systems gone. WF/TF and corruption will never give a long term fulfilment. You might feel strong in the beginning when you have a god roll as one of the first, but some weeks down the line, your just another with that trait/power.

    I'd rather see skill get converted in more dps, instead of farm your ass of for the right gear and spam 3 buttons without looking. Fingers crossed the unpruning will bring back more difficult rotations.

  11. #551
    Quote Originally Posted by BeepBoo View Post
    I'm well aware of how opinions work. I'm not saying your opinions that the system is fine are wrong. I'm saying that you can't sit here and tell me mine is wrong because <insert tons of reasons here> while 1) using bad logic and 2) ignoring my points or attempting to discount them.

    The only thing you can do is say "well, I don't care about the parts of the game you do, so it doesn't impact me" and then move on. The dude closest to that in this thread is the one who simply outlined what my options are, which i already did. Doesn't mean that, considering my perspective, the system isn't garbage.


    Good for them. I don't see being on blizz's side as a good thing for any of their games. They're majorly fucking up right now.

    Blizzard wants people to play their games like koreans play their games: for hours on end, grinding the simplest, mindless shit that is EZ to develop while tossing tons of money at cosmetics and simultaneously not caring about things that are hard to develop, such as balance, engaging and challenging content, etc.

    Blizz is the company that released WC3: refunded. Made some fucking actually sincere comment about "hurr durr u no Haz PhoNe!?", etc. They are not a good game developer. They are a good money printer who has shifted their population to the mainstream general human, and the average human in every given context is measurably fucking garbage.
    WC3 is the only one that's "fucking up right now" imo, 8.3 is great, D3 is actually improving quite at bit, OW is making both good and bad choices so it evens out, Hearthstone is still printing money, HotS is dead though.

  12. #552
    Quote Originally Posted by BeepBoo View Post
    More like blue parses.

    - - - Updated - - -


    The fun for me IS the competition that comes from just doing the raid. Hitting buttons is hitting buttons. Simply being in a raid doesn't change the act of hitting buttons that you do in the overworld. I hate the overworld. The act of just hitting keys over and over again in a relatively static pattern isn't entertaining enough in it's own right. If raids (more specifically, the competition they bring) were suddenly boiled down to just being button clicking sims with no competition, I'd quit. I don't play online games "for funsies" in the way you mean it. I play to own people and kick back, talking shit with my friends.


    No, you can't have a game that catered to the mindset and then just decide you want to sabotage those aspects suddenly (or slowly).



    No, before "your turn in the spot light" was determined FAR more by your personal skill level as a player (wotlk era, where BIS was ez to get for basically anyone involved with a successful raid). Now, "your turn in the spot light" is relegated to luck and other people supporting you. That is a bad change in game design philosophy.

    - - - Updated - - -


    "Give up because you will never be the absolute best, so what does it matter if you lose by an inch or a mile"
    Sounds like bitch quitter talk who was never actually had the luxury of being the best at anything.



    You have literally dick all to back that up. I've gone nearly every tier before half-way through BFA (specifically, when they introduced benthic) getting orange parses on almost every boss.

    And besides that, you're using a no true scotsman fallacy. "Oh, you're not on his level, so it can't possibly apply to you." Fuck off with that horrible reasoning. Even if I got lucky and got orange parses like that dude, I'd still say the system sucks donkey dick.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Already did that last tier thanks to the previous equally shitty system of benthic gear.
    Doesn't mean I'm not going to come on here and talk shit about blizz's bad design choices. I'm petty. I'll be here until the ship goes down in flames for their fuck-ups.

    So what is the dps difference between you and the top guy

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Curaga View Post
    I wish that was possible, fact of the matter is that some of the corrupted gear is so strong that the choice itself would be like playing with one hand tied on your back. Don't get me wrong, I understand that you mean to say that you have a choice, but when the difference in dps is 10k+ it's not a choice anymore.

    It's like playing with suboptimal specs. I see many people defend that with "If you don't go for world first then play what you like", that might hold some merid. Then again the fact is that no matter what level you play on, unnecessary wiping on a boss because half the team wants to play what they like not what spec might be a lot better than theirs, isn't fun either.

    I for one would love to see any of the previous systems gone. WF/TF and corruption will never give a long term fulfilment. You might feel strong in the beginning when you have a god roll as one of the first, but some weeks down the line, your just another with that trait/power.

    I'd rather see skill get converted in more dps, instead of farm your ass of for the right gear and spam 3 buttons without looking. Fingers crossed the unpruning will bring back more difficult rotations.
    So my big question here is do people honestly believe that the players who go into a raid with 97 corruption or not some of the best players in the world progressing on these bosses in the top of the world
    So my big question here is do people honestly believe that the players who go into a raid with 97 corruption are not some of the best players in the world progressing on these bosses in the top of the world


    Can someone explain to me how having three mechanics that you and your healers have to play around is not related to skill

    And I can guarantee you that sub optimal specs do not wipe raids

  13. #553
    Quote Originally Posted by zantheus1993 View Post
    So what is the dps difference between you and the top guy
    Infinite right now, considering I'm not playing at all.

    When I had 99th percentiles, it definitely wasn't something stupid like 30% between me and the top player of my class. Maybe 3% difference between the rank 1 and my 99th.

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/ra...ter&spec=Havoc

    Check that out. Two 100th percentile parses. Nearly 10k difference in DPS. Utter. Garbage.


    Can someone explain to me how having three mechanics that you and your healers have to play around is not related to skill
    You can't avoid the damage as the DPS. So... all the "skill" is on the part of the healers who are now carrying your ass with that 90 corruption... thereby enabling you to abuse the system and have no more skill than someone else, while getting vastly better performance.

    If corruption were something that was completely solo-oriented that didn't necessitate other people being willing to put up with your bullshit, I wouldn't be complaining like I am.

    And I can guarantee you that sub optimal specs do not wipe raids
    Correct. It's the type of person who wants to play those sub-optimal specs that typically causes it. Because usually people who play meta are also the people actually concerned with performance and doing things properly.
    Last edited by BeepBoo; 2020-02-04 at 06:18 AM.

  14. #554
    Quote Originally Posted by BeepBoo View Post
    You can't avoid the damage as the DPS. So... all the "skill" is on the part of the healers who are now carrying your ass with that 90 corruption... thereby enabling you to abuse the system and have no more skill than someone else, while getting vastly better performance.
    What? The damage (up until excessive corruption, beyond what any sane person would have) is entirely avoidable. Step out of the eye, don't get hit by the "thing"

    Even at extremely high corruptions it's on the dps to avoid as much dmg as possible, getting hit by avoidable dmg could kill you

  15. #555
    Quote Originally Posted by BeepBoo View Post
    Infinite right now, considering I'm not playing at all.

    When I had 99th percentiles, it definitely wasn't something stupid like 30% between me and the top player of my class. Maybe 3% difference between the rank 1 and my 99th.

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/ra...ter&spec=Havoc

    Check that out. Two 100th percentile parses. Nearly 10k difference in DPS. Utter. Garbage.



    You can't avoid the damage as the DPS. So... all the "skill" is on the part of the healers who are now carrying your ass with that 90 corruption... thereby enabling you to abuse the system and have no more skill than someone else, while getting vastly better performance.

    If corruption were something that was completely solo-oriented that didn't necessitate other people being willing to put up with your bullshit, I wouldn't be complaining like I am.


    Correct. It's the type of person who wants to play those sub-optimal specs that typically causes it. Because usually people who play meta are also the people actually concerned with performance and doing things properly.
    Technically speaking when I’m on my mage I don’t play fire so I would be the kind of player that’s the cost for the wipes according to you while technically wouldn’t be true because even as frost I do the mechanics correctly because there is no hard DPS check that requires every player to play the best possible spec I am not 100% world top rating minded and that is correct

    Technically speaking when I’m on my mage I don’t play fire so I would be the kind of player that’s the cost for the wipes according to you while technically wouldn’t be true because even as frosts I do the mechanics correctly because there is no hard DPS check that requires every player to play the best possible spec I am not 100% world top rating minded and that is correct


    Onto the whole difference between you and the top guy the reason why I bring that up is because we could use you as a reference however right now you are bitching that the only reason why the guy at the top is because of corruption know the only reason why the guy at the top is at the top is because of skill corruption plus the healers being willing to heal him through that otherwise they would say fuck off and overall you can avoid the damage is a DPS I don’t know if you know this but moving to the left or right or even managing your corruption to a certain level will help you in fact in a few weeks having a single piece with infinite stars will not have you over 40 corruption


    I can tell you right now if there is someone that I have to heal and they do not move out of their shit and start taking a ton of damage I’m not going to worry about healing them I will let them die because unless it is on super farm I do not give a shit about someone trying to parse


    If you are in mythic and you have some players that really want to be rank one which has not mattered since before warlords I think the last time it was really an accomplishment was during mist

  16. #556
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    Even at extremely high corruptions it's on the dps to avoid as much dmg as possible, getting hit by avoidable dmg could kill you
    Again, are you ignoring the parse I linked like.. yesterday of that top warrior taking 2 million dmg vs the other dude who only took 95k?

    "excessive corruption, beyond what any sane person would have" is exactly what we're discussing here. If you CAN go beyond "sane" levels, someone WILL.. and they will be rewarded for it with vastly superior performance.

  17. #557
    Quote Originally Posted by Semune View Post
    Meh... better than titanforging.
    It's worse honestly. Unless you are able to channel gear like limit or have millions in disposable income.

  18. #558
    Quote Originally Posted by BeepBoo View Post
    Again, are you ignoring the parse I linked like.. yesterday of that top warrior taking 2 million dmg vs the other dude who only took 95k?

    "excessive corruption, beyond what any sane person would have" is exactly what we're discussing here. If you CAN go beyond "sane" levels, someone WILL.. and they will be rewarded for it with vastly superior performance.
    Do you know if his healers were complaining? If not, it was a calculated risk. They focus healed him so he could pump out as much as possible, this type of shit has been going on for years

  19. #559
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    Do you know if his healers were complaining? If not, it was a calculated risk. They focus healed him so he could pump out as much as possible, this type of shit has been going on for years
    Again, this is what I'm saying and why I'm saying it's bad. They shouldn't HAVE the possibility of doing crap like this. It ruins the competitive aspect for people like me who don't have the support network necessary. That parse isn't that dude's solo skill. It is his whole fucking raid's parse. But does that matter? Whos name is next to it? How can you even respect the competition with stuff like this?

    "You can't"

    Yeah, duh, which is why I quit and why it is stupid. I'm looking for this game's raid scene to serve as another on my long list of activities I pack my life with in the form of a competition I can ego stroke to. They're systematically demolishing that with this type of crap. Only problem is I've had the pleasure of enjoying it in a more pure form and don't want them to change it. So, I complain.

  20. #560
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeepBoo View Post
    Again, this is what I'm saying and why I'm saying it's bad. They shouldn't HAVE the possibility of doing crap like this. It ruins the competitive aspect for people like me who don't have the support network necessary.
    So the game should change because you can't manage to do what someone else can. Gotcha. It isn't about competing it is about having what others can do so you have the illusion of a competition. If you can't manage to use the tools of the game to compete then that is on you. And not any system. Your argument is basically saying because a LFR player can't compete with a Mythic raider then no one should be able to do more than the LFR raider.

    You keep trying to say you love to compete. You love to have fun. Yet all you are doing is whining that someone else was able to do more then you and you don't have the friends/guild/whatever to do the same. That is silly. Of course if you don't have the same tools you won't be doing the same job. So compete with those who have the same tools. Don't compete with the CEO when you are just the doorman.

    They are not demolishing anything. This "crap" has always existed. There have always been ways to pad the meters. So stop crying that you can't play the game the same way and instead want the game changed. Just play the game that you claim your ego craves. Lol.
    Last edited by rhorle; 2020-02-04 at 06:47 AM.
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