1. #1421
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    No, I will not JUST plop down a component. I will install it properly. And a critical ship component is only critical in the sense that it is required - not that it is required to be in a specific spot. Maybe it needs to be next to another component - then both of them move - if need be. But it should be pretty obvious that gravity wells were installed in place of hangars and crew quarters where there was no major equipment, it's only logical to reduce the amount or refitting required. That's how an engineer would've done it.

    No, the wells are at the sides of the engine. And you have no cross-section of an interdictor - so you are talking out of your ass.
    The wells are to the side of the primary power generator and main engine, they are directly in place of where the port and starboard subsidiary reactors and engines are for the port and starboard thrusters, you can no more decide to move those than you can decide that the wheels on a car would be more effective if they were located on the roof.
    AFAIK no cross section exists for a Interdictor, but given that the Interdictors are listed as having four gravity well generators but we can see eight hemisphere protrusions on the top and bottom of the ships its easy to infer that the system takes up the entire height of the hull at those locations.
    Are you implying Interdictors have no engine? Maybe they replaced that huge engine with a smaller one. Do you even know?
    Ok, so you now have to install a completely new engine system to retrofit an existing Star Destroyer with an interdictor system. What exactly was the point you were trying to make again? That fitting an interdictor system into a existing Star Destroyer would be cheap?

    A droid can easily maneuver an A-wing right into the viewport of the bridge. For a ship to hyperspace through a capital ship - it needs to fly straight at it - i.e. it will be shot down. And I doubt the effect of the hyperjump of a small craft can do any serious damage to the capital ship - unless it's aimed at the bridge, which is very hard to do from afar because the capital ship is not stationary.
    The only reason that A-wing caused damage was because the deflector shields were already taken out, the A-wing was just a big missile at that point. At the speed of light you wouldn't need to hit the bridge to cause damage, anything moving at the speed is going to cause devastation. Good luck shooting down a ship that travelling towards you at light speed, or picking out the small ship at long range that's getting into position to make a lightspeed ramming attack amongst everything else happening on the battlefield.

    Remember the reaction of the Hux and other officers when they realized what Holdo was doing? They wanted to destroy it but since they were focused on the transports they had no time to retarget their fire. But if they could they would've shot down Holdo before she made the jump - the jump does take some time to spool the hyperdrive, she also needed to bypass safety protocols.
    The only reason that they had time was because to react was because she had to do a 180 to line up with them.

    What are you talking about? The range of interdictors must be several thousand miles. If not dozens. Do you even know how it works? It creates a gravity well to mimic a PLANET. Planets are dozens of thousands of miles wide, at the very least.

    Just think about it - what use is of Interdictor that can only cover under 100km considering that each SD is at least a mile long and the need to spread out? 100km is nothing in space. It wouldn't even work with that small of a range. Since there's no actual data in canon on its range - we are gonna refer to common sense. A single interdictor can cover a fleet that can fit into a small moon. 4 interdictors can cover any reasonably sized fleet, spread as wide as need be.
    It mimics a gravity well in a localized area, it doesn't span thousands of miles. Watch Zero Hour, Thrawn's fleet is spread out across maybe 20 kilometers, the loss of an interdictor on one flank allowed Ezra, who was on that flank, to jump to lightspeed because he was out of range of the interdictor on the opposite flank. Also, thanks to Disney canon playing fast and loose with hyperspace in favor of spectacle the gravity wells of planetary bodies aren't even strong enough to prevent hyperspace jumps(See TFA, TRoS, Rogue One).


    But you don't lose interdictor after use. Interdictors are cheaper that way. No one in their right mind will invest in hyperdrive weapons when there are interdictors. Case closed.
    You only lose your ship after an effective use, and as we've seen an effective use causes drastically asymmetrical damages. You are literally arguing against the existence of missiles at this point because you only get a single use out of each one.

    What fear? You have interdictors. IF your enemy has hyperdrive weapons - it's their only weapon - you can use a single tactic to obliterate them. Interdictors, tight fleet, focus fire. That's it. It's the best tactic against hyperdrive weapons - so there's no need for any other tactic. It's in no way a limitation.
    How does weaponizing a hyperdrive preclude you from being able to use other weapons?

  2. #1422
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    DS9
    Posts
    20,297
    Quote Originally Posted by Aurrora View Post
    The wells are to the side of the primary power generator and main engine, they are directly in place of where the port and starboard subsidiary reactors and engines are for the port and starboard thrusters, you can no more decide to move those than you can decide that the wheels on a car would be more effective if they were located on the roof.
    You cannot move thrusters but you can easily move the reactors.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aurrora View Post
    AFAIK no cross section exists for a Interdictor, but given that the Interdictors are listed as having four gravity well generators but we can see eight hemisphere protrusions on the top and bottom of the ships its easy to infer that the system takes up the entire height of the hull at those locations.
    That was never in doubt so I fail to see the reason for you to mention it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aurrora View Post
    Ok, so you now have to install a completely new engine system to retrofit an existing Star Destroyer with an interdictor system. What exactly was the point you were trying to make again? That fitting an interdictor system into a existing Star Destroyer would be cheap?
    If a hyperdrive is cheap then engines are cheap. Right? And the smaller engine is cheaper - and it is still reusable. But that's beside the point. I say they didn't have to replace the main engine. That's all. Since we don't have a cross-section of the interdictor - you have no counter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aurrora View Post
    The only reason that A-wing caused damage was because the deflector shields were already taken out, the A-wing was just a big missile at that point. At the speed of light you wouldn't need to hit the bridge to cause damage, anything moving at the speed is going to cause devastation. Good luck shooting down a ship that travelling towards you at light speed, or picking out the small ship at long range that's getting into position to make a lightspeed ramming attack amongst everything else happening on the battlefield.
    The same deflector shield will protect from hyperspace jump damage as well. The small craft is just a nuisance.
    It's very easy to shoot down a star fighter at which you are already firing with turbo-lasers, and that flies directly at your fire. Hyperspace jump is not instantaneous - and you need to fly straight to aim.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aurrora View Post
    The only reason that they had time was because to react was because she had to do a 180 to line up with them.
    Exactly my point from above. She needed to fly straight at them. And if they were already firing at her ship - it would've been destroyed.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aurrora View Post
    It mimics a gravity well in a localized area, it doesn't span thousands of miles.
    It does. because that localized area must be the size fo a planet to have that interdiction effect this whole technology is all about


    Quote Originally Posted by Aurrora View Post
    Watch Zero Hour, Thrawn's fleet is spread out across maybe 20 kilometers,
    That episode was stupid - if they needed to send just one star-fighter outside of the jamming field - Ezra could've just flown sideways around the planet and away from the Imperial fleet. Also, Ezra managed to make a jump within the active range of the second Interdictor. And we know it's a big range because even though the imperial fleet has been shown to be tightly packed - the distance between the rebel and imperial fleet has been far greater and they still couldn't jump. No one seemed to think about jumping sideways either. Stupid episode is stupid.

    It might as well be that the second interdictor was added for measure and forgotten by the writers.

    So no, that doesn't tell us anything.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aurrora View Post
    You only lose your ship after an effective use, and as we've seen an effective use causes drastically asymmetrical damages. You are literally arguing against the existence of missiles at this point because you only get a single use out of each one.
    But you cannot use it effectively with Interdictors. Also, capital ships are way more expensive than missiles. I'm arguing against stupidity, no one will invest in such a weapon.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aurrora View Post
    How does weaponizing a hyperdrive preclude you from being able to use other weapons?
    Why use other weapons if you can destroy the entire enemy fleet with one hyperdrive weapon? You will have to use other weapons when your enemy has interdictors but if you invested into a hyperdrive weapon - your tactics are weak in that situation. You are not prepared and will be crushed.
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

  3. #1423
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    You're saying that because we understood carbon freezing, a made up technology, to work one way because of one movie (that takes place before this show) that showing it employed in a slightly different form because you personally think it couldn't ever get their in-universe (a judgement based on nothing) is "bad writing."
    That's not in fact what I'm saying, no.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    So you said it was included as fan service. Using something that is canon is not fan service or bad writing. Making an X-wing look like an X-wing is not fan service or bad writing. Making Mandalorian armor look like Mandalorian armor is not fan service or bad writing. Making hibernation carbonite look like hibernation carbonite is not fan service or bad writing.
    It's absolutely fanservice, that's why there's one scene showing it in one episode as a visual reference and it never comes up again. Unlike, to take your example, Mandalorian armour which is obviously going to be used in a show about a Mandalorian.

    Now if this was a show about Ewoks and a guy in Mandalorian armour showed up in one scene and had little plot relevance, then yeah that'd probably be fanservice in that case.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    Most of the time when someone says they are arguing against headcanon, they are arguing with their own.
    No, I'm really not. Go back and read what I said, I objected to specifically what was shown on screen, and for some reason a bunch of people started inventing headcanon to rationalise it. The obvious simple explanation is that it's written into that episode as a reference to stimulate fan nostalgia, like a lot of things in the Mandalorian. That in itself is not a bad thing, I just happen to think it was pretty blatant in this case, and furthermore it's one of a number of such cases which ultimately just serve to make the universe feel smaller.

    I'm not the one with a headcanon here.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  4. #1424
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    But it is not a lore inconsistency. Everything points to hibernation through carbon freezing being a known thing. Your entire argument is claiming that a cardboard box can not look like a cardboard box if it is made by two different companies.
    But then there is the SWTOR story line where you learn that Carbonite poisioning is a thing so how long is this "hibernation" a viable option before you die?

  5. #1425
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    19,699
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    It's absolutely fanservice, that's why there's one scene showing it in one episode as a visual reference and it never comes up again. Unlike, to take your example, Mandalorian armour which is obviously going to be used in a show about a Mandalorian. Now if this was a show about Ewoks and a guy in Mandalorian armour showed up in one scene and had little plot relevance, then yeah that'd probably be fanservice in that case.
    He doesn't take any more bounties because of the plot of the show. Carbonite hibernation doesn't have little relevance to the show since you know he is a bounty hunter. And it is has been established to exist in several different forms of canon. It isn't fan service. It is just part of things in the Star Wars universe. There is no reason to reinvent a wheel.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by schwank05 View Post
    But then there is the SWTOR story line where you learn that Carbonite poisioning is a thing so how long is this "hibernation" a viable option before you die?
    That storyline indicates that poisoning is from imperfections in the freezing process. And not something that happens every time. SWTOR also is not canon.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  6. #1426
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    He doesn't take any more bounties because of the plot of the show. Carbonite hibernation doesn't have little relevance to the show since you know he is a bounty hunter. And it is has been established to exist in several different forms of canon. It isn't fan service. It is just part of things in the Star Wars universe. There is no reason to reinvent a wheel.

    - - - Updated - - -



    That storyline indicates that poisoning is from imperfections in the freezing process. And not something that happens every time. SWTOR also is not canon.
    I get that, but has to be a possibility with the process I assume.

  7. #1427
    Immortal Darththeo's Avatar
    7+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away
    Posts
    7,874
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    I'm not the one with a headcanon here.
    By ignoring what was on screen to make the argument.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  8. #1428
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    ██████
    Posts
    26,351
    Doylists arguments are so boring. Next we're going to argue "how come the Empire just didn't use infinite clones"

    Resident Cosplay Progressive

  9. #1429
    Quote Originally Posted by schwank05 View Post
    But then there is the SWTOR story line where you learn that Carbonite poisioning is a thing so how long is this "hibernation" a viable option before you die?
    i mean, you're in carbonite storage for 5 years before the screw up in your freezing starts to poison you. that's a very long time.

    but like was said, swtor's not canon sadly. the only thing we have in canon is the carbonite sickness blindness.

  10. #1430
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    By ignoring what was on screen to make the argument.
    What the fuck? Where was I ignoring what was on screen? I'm literally talking about what was on screen in the Mandalorian. I'm not the one inventing headcanon.

    You have gotten seriously turned around, friend.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    He doesn't take any more bounties because of the plot of the show. Carbonite hibernation doesn't have little relevance to the show since you know he is a bounty hunter. And it is has been established to exist in several different forms of canon. It isn't fan service. It is just part of things in the Star Wars universe. There is no reason to reinvent a wheel.
    It's 100% fan service. It was fan service when Clone Wars did it too.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  11. #1431
    Titan Gallahadd's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Beyond the 1% barrier.
    Posts
    14,177
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    It's 100% fan service. It was fan service when Clone Wars did it too.
    I was loath to get into this arguement, because it's fucking stupid... But I have to ask:

    How many times does something have to happen in canon, before it stops being fanservice and just becomes lore?

    We have Han's freezing in Empire. Which is then confirmed as a "pre-existing" tech in Clone Wars (albeit, through something of a Retcon) and confirmed to still be in use by The Mandalorian...

    So, at what point, for you, would it STOP being fanservice, and just become tech within Star Wars?
    Check out the blog I write for LEGENDARY Indie Label Flicknife Records:

    Blog Thirty is live! In which we discuss our latest releases, and our great new line of T-shirts.
    https://www.flickniferecords.co.uk/blog/item/30-blog-30

  12. #1432
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    19,699
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    It's 100% fan service. It was fan service when Clone Wars did it too.
    So is having an x-wing look like an x-wing equally fan service? We now have at least 4 separate works that are canon having the same tech. One is written in a book, and used as a desk, so we can't say for certain it is 100% the same. That is no longer fan service.

    Curious why you are not equally as upset over the Din's armor looking like Mandalorian armor? Is it not fan service to have it look the same? Why is it that lightsabers always look like lightsabers? Hyperspace always looks like Hyperspace. Your argument is arbitrarily assigning "fan service" to anything you don't like just so you can hate on it.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  13. #1433
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    ██████
    Posts
    26,351
    Speaking of lightsaber, didn't they tell us there wouldn't be any lightsabers in this series

    Resident Cosplay Progressive

  14. #1434
    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    Speaking of lightsaber, didn't they tell us there wouldn't be any lightsabers in this series
    The Darksaber is a symbol of Mandalorian leadership. The Mandalorian that holds it becomes the next Mandalore. For Moff Gideon to have it, it means that he had to have personally slain the last Mandalore during the purge. He’s not like some edgy new Sith or something dumb like that.
    Cheerful lack of self-preservation

  15. #1435
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    ██████
    Posts
    26,351
    Quote Originally Posted by Nefarious Tea View Post
    The Darksaber is a symbol of Mandalorian leadership. The Mandalorian that holds it becomes the next Mandalore. For Moff Gideon to have it, it means that he had to have personally slain the last Mandalore during the purge. He’s not like some edgy new Sith or something dumb like that.
    I wasn't being serious.

    Resident Cosplay Progressive

  16. #1436
    Quote Originally Posted by Nefarious Tea View Post
    The Darksaber is a symbol of Mandalorian leadership. The Mandalorian that holds it becomes the next Mandalore. For Moff Gideon to have it, it means that he had to have personally slain the last Mandalore during the purge. He’s not like some edgy new Sith or something dumb like that.
    even if he was its not like we havent had the inquisitors already from rebels
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

  17. #1437
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    DS9
    Posts
    20,297
    Quote Originally Posted by Nefarious Tea View Post
    The Darksaber is a symbol of Mandalorian leadership. The Mandalorian that holds it becomes the next Mandalore. For Moff Gideon to have it, it means that he had to have personally slain the last Mandalore during the purge. He’s not like some edgy new Sith or something dumb like that.
    He did not need to personally slay the last Mandalore. Just take the saber from his dead body or ask one of the troopers to fetch it for him.
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

  18. #1438
    Brewmaster
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    B'ham, AL
    Posts
    1,349
    Quote Originally Posted by Nefarious Tea View Post
    The Darksaber is a symbol of Mandalorian leadership. The Mandalorian that holds it becomes the next Mandalore. For Moff Gideon to have it, it means that he had to have personally slain the last Mandalore during the purge. He’s not like some edgy new Sith or something dumb like that.
    We hope.... =D

    (I agree, but just saying; they could... I hope they don't. But they COULD...)
    Koriani - Guardians of Forever - BM Huntard on TB; Kharmic - Worgen Druid - TB
    Koriani - none - Dragon of Secret World
    Karmic - Moirae - SWTOR
    inactive: Frith-Rae - Horizons/Istaria; Koriani in multiple old MMOs. I been around a long time.

  19. #1439
    Quote Originally Posted by Koriani View Post
    We hope.... =D

    (I agree, but just saying; they could... I hope they don't. But they COULD...)
    Don’t do this to me! Don’t take my hope away that there is ONE Star Wars thing disney has made that they won’t botch
    Cheerful lack of self-preservation

  20. #1440
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    ██████
    Posts
    26,351
    Quote Originally Posted by Nefarious Tea View Post
    Don’t do this to me! Don’t take my hope away that there is ONE Star Wars thing disney has made that they won’t botch
    The guy behind the modern Mandalorian canon is also the showrunner. I think we're safe.

    Bob Igor confirms the show will be back in October!

    Resident Cosplay Progressive

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •