Could something be done to make people tank?

[Phurox]

I love tanking, but I will never tank anything again in Wow.

Call me lazy, but ever since Blizzard decided that every boss has to have some crazy mechanics, there's just too big of a job to actually read about them all before I go into a dungeon. As a dps I can just spam my dps and do a little footwork to not fuck up, but as a tank you need to know so much to each single boss and there's alot of them.

From Classic to WotLK tanking were pretty simple, don't stand in shit, hold aggro, make sure you don't die.

Now you need to know 100 different mechanics, and if the group dies, so does your self confidence, because the whole group will pick on you.

Said from someone who miss tanking, but would never do it in its current state.

[Aeula]

Reduce responsibility.

That’s why people don’t tank, not because it’s hard, but because a single fuckup is enough to wipe and get them kicked.

Not that this would be good for people who actually like tanking, but this is basically the core of it.

[Penegal]

I love tanking, but I will never tank anything again in Wow.

Call me lazy, but ever since Blizzard decided that every boss has to have some crazy mechanics, there's just too big of a job to actually read about them all before I go into a dungeon. As a dps I can just spam my dps and do a little footwork to not fuck up, but as a tank you need to know so much to each single boss and there's alot of them.

From Classic to WotLK tanking were pretty simple, don't stand in shit, hold aggro, make sure you don't die.

Now you need to know 100 different mechanics, and if the group dies, so does your self confidence, because the whole group will pick on you.

Said from someone who miss tanking, but would never do it in its current state.

Excuse me, what? All that tanks need to do right now is learn how to survive. In raids you literally need to taunt on 2-3 stacks from the other tank and maybe drag an add here and there. In m+ you literally need to have an idea how to get to the % needed without over pulling and wasting time with trash. It's not very hard. Considering how most people that complain about it they won't be doing super high m+ keys nor will they do bleeding edge raiding for the details needed to master to matter.

[chiddie]

Just delete timed content and tanks will pop out again like flowers in spring.

M+ idea is amazing but until they’re time gated there will be always tank shortage, especially on pugs.

I am a DK tank who pugs everything. It’s fun but timer is really a stress. It forces you to watch tons of videos to learn the fastest paths and mistakes (not necessary my mistakes) are heavily punished.

There has to be another way to gate top gear in M+ behind other stuff than time.

[cface]

Just delete timed content and tanks will pop out again like flowers in spring.

M+ idea is amazing but until they’re time gated there will be always tank shortage, especially on pugs.

I am a DK tank who pugs everything. It’s fun but timer is really a stress. It forces you to watch tons of videos to learn the fastest paths and mistakes (not necessary my mistakes) are heavily punished.

There has to be another way to gate top gear in M+ behind other stuff than time.

I think the timer is suppose to act like the dps check. I'd rather bake that into bosses or the 4th affix, cause right now it feels like it's all on the tank to pull the most clever pulls to maximize aoe for the dps.
The responsibility that the tank has now is so massive, as you have to live on the edge on pulling as much as you can survive, as well as deal with fuckups that comes with missing cc/interrupts. If you know how to do it on a +5, everything changes as you come into the 7 keys with a new deal of extremely annoying affixes.

[Moonsorrow]

Excuse me, what? All that tanks need to do right now is learn how to survive. In raids you literally need to taunt on 2-3 stacks from the other tank and maybe drag an add here and there. In m+ you literally need to have an idea how to get to the % needed without over pulling and wasting time with trash. It's not very hard. Considering how most people that complain about it they won't be doing super high m+ keys nor will they do bleeding edge raiding for the details needed to master to matter.

But in M+ this is exactly the problem. People expect the tank to know the route and the percentages and the skips on day 1.
DpS just "follow the lead"! That's why I usually only tank for friends and raid members. I like tanking but complete pugs are not fun at all. Especially in low keys where people join with their alts and expect everything to just die like it does with their main and no-one bothers with mechanics anymore but is suprised if the key is no success...

[DatToffer]

Just don't be assholes in dungeon.

[chiddie]

I think the timer is suppose to act like the dps check. I'd rather bake that into bosses or the 4th affix, cause right now it feels like it's all on the tank to pull the most clever pulls to maximize aoe for the dps.
The responsibility that the tank has now is so massive, as you have to live on the edge on pulling as much as you can survive, as well as deal with fuckups that comes with missing cc/interrupts. If you know how to do it on a +5, everything changes as you come into the 7 keys with a new deal of extremely annoying affixes.

Yes I know because I basically don’t do anything past +9 (I just don’t want to learn AGAIN other paths to optimize for another annoying affix).

I like the thrill of “living on the edge” trying to survive and make others survive and progress but with timers everything is just “we have to pew pew as fast as possible, please just go and aggro things”.

I’m even blamed if I wait for healers to rec (healers then wisp me to thank me but indeed). Not counting dps that think they have to lead the path, but this is a different matter.

From my point of view, without timers it would all be better.

[potis]

Another 15 pages of "ex-tanks", whatever god can actually make you people to actually be called tanks, complaining about "ToO mANy MeChanix" and the usual bullshit about some sort of non-existant "Go go" mentality.

Stop pugging, stop playing at such low skill levels, stick with the game for more than a month and the hardest thing of all, MAYBE TRY TO STORE 5 INFORMATION IN YOUR BRAIN.

24 pages of people complaining about stuff in a M+5 where nothing happens, when there are people timing +20s after the scaling, and +25s , 2 weeks ago, where any extra auto-attack swing can wipe you.

And again, you dont want to learn the game? You dont want to stick with a guild or at least a group of people with the same mentality as you to play the game?

You dont get to complain then.

[Penegal]

But in M+ this is exactly the problem. People expect the tank to know the route and the percentages and the skips on day 1.
DpS just "follow the lead"! That's why I usually only tank for friends and raid members. I like tanking but complete pugs are not fun at all. Especially in low keys where people join with their alts and expect everything to just die like it does with their main and no-one bothers with mechanics anymore but is suprised if the key is no success...

Download Method Dungeon Tools - you can check routes and make your own. It takes 2 minutes looking at one to get the general idea. You really don't need to know much. I literally tanked to get my score up so people will invite me as a melee dps later on and I'll tell you, it's not very complicated. Right now it might be a tiny bit harder because you need a +15 and people could barely do 10s in pugs.

- - - Updated - - -

Another 15 pages of "ex-tanks", whatever god can actually make you people to actually be called tanks, complaining about "ToO mANy MeChanix" and the usual bullshit about some sort of non-existant "Go go" mentality.

Stop pugging, stop playing at such low skill levels, stick with the game for more than a month and the hardest thing of all, MAYBE TRY TO STORE 5 INFORMATION IN YOUR BRAIN.

24 pages of people complaining about stuff in a M+5 where nothing happens, when there are people timing +20s after the scaling, and +25s , 2 weeks ago, where any extra auto-attack swing can wipe you.

And again, you dont want to learn the game? You dont want to stick with a guild or at least a group of people with the same mentality as you to play the game?

You dont get to complain then.

Yeah, recently I've been reading threads a bit more than usual and I've been "WTF?" most of the time. People are literally complaining that you have to play the game to get something out of it lol

"Why do I have to play this game to get X?"
"Why do I have to learn Y to do Z?"
"Why are there so many mechanics? It was more fun when you had to just stand there!"

I literally can't even.

[chiddie]

Another 15 pages of "ex-tanks", whatever god can actually make you people to actually be called tanks, complaining about "ToO mANy MeChanix" and the usual bullshit about some sort of non-existant "Go go" mentality.

Stop pugging, stop playing at such low skill levels, stick with the game for more than a month and the hardest thing of all, MAYBE TRY TO STORE 5 INFORMATION IN YOUR BRAIN.

24 pages of people complaining about stuff in a M+5 where nothing happens, when there are people timing +20s after the scaling, and +25s , 2 weeks ago, where any extra auto-attack swing can wipe you.

And again, you dont want to learn the game? You dont want to stick with a guild or at least a group of people with the same mentality as you to play the game?

You dont get to complain then.

Start playing 6-7 hours per week when lucky, with no guild, then come back here to tell us how bad we are and how M+ are just fine.

[gobio]

What is the problem?

Those ex-tanks already listen to you they quit the role. most I read is that they missed the role, they wish for something else, I don't see them demanding it though.

We all miss something in WOW, we all wish WOW could be something. I am not demanding blizzard to listen to me though, that is why I am skipping BFA for now. No hard feeling!

but the topic itself is "doing something to MAKE people tank", well...

[Cazz17]

A lot of posts are saying about "one fuck up and its your fault and your group blames you" etc etc. A good tank won't fuck up, and they should be able to explain what caused the group to wipe. If people are still "tank you sux LOL" then that just shows the people you are playing with. Have some confidence in your gameplay and you'll be fine.

[Penegal]

Start playing 6-7 hours per week when lucky, with no guild, then come back here to tell us how bad we are and how M+ are just fine.

MMOs are not games where you need to be kept up with everyone who plays more than you. If you can't handle playing that little per week maybe the game isn't for you mate? You might not be bad but you're just stuck with the bad people that have the same or similar to your schedule. Pugs have always been hell.

[SirCowdog]

Reduce responsibility.

That’s why people don’t tank, not because it’s hard, but because a single fuckup is enough to wipe and get them kicked.

Not that this would be good for people who actually like tanking, but this is basically the core of it.

It's not so much that tank responsibility needs to be reduced, but more that the responsibilities each member of the group carries needs to be equalized.

Time after time we see people pointing out that DPS can basically just spam their attacks. And even when there is a responsibility to handle, there are three people that can do it instead of just one.

Blizzard badly needs to address this or the situation will continue to degrade.

[chiddie]

MMOs are not games where you need to be kept up with everyone who plays more than you. If you can't handle playing that little per week maybe the game isn't for you mate? You might not be bad but you're just stuck with the bad people that have the same or similar to your schedule. Pugs have always been hell.

Pugs are hell because of timers. It’s as simple as that.

- - - Updated - - -

MMOs are not games where you need to be kept up with everyone who plays more than you. If you can't handle playing that little per week maybe the game isn't for you mate? You might not be bad but you're just stuck with the bad people that have the same or similar to your schedule. Pugs have always been hell.

Pugs are hell because of timers. It’s as simple as that.

[Penegal]

Pugs are hell because of timers. It’s as simple as that.

- - - Updated - - -


Pugs are hell because of timers. It’s as simple as that.

No, pugs are hell because most of the time people have no clue what they're doing. The other day I joined a pre-made group that was looking for keys, thinking how bad can it be, they're 4 people so it shouldn't be very hard, right? Those guys could barely pull any DPS at all at the end of the dungeon both DPS had under 25k overall. One was an Assassination Rogue - 452, the other Unholy DK - 445. Tank was 558 and died to boss a few times, healer could barely heal. They were eating axes, quakes. I've had people deplete my key 4-6 times almost consecutively. Simply because either the tank overestimates themselves or someone ninja pulls. The timers were far and away the least of my worries.

So, no, it's not as simple as that.

[Koloss]

My main is a pure DD class, but i would definately tank with it if it had a tank specs. So for this part i would say add more tank specs to new classes. There was some experiment with Dark Apothesis form in MoP, but it didn't make you a legit tank even if you could tank random HCs.

The other thing is that i tanked much on my alts in Legion. For this part: make character progression less grindy to have time for tank alts. (i also haver personal causes to have less time on alts i don't want to blame it all on the game)

[chiddie]

No, pugs are hell because most of the time people have no clue what they're doing. The other day I joined a pre-made group that was looking for keys, thinking how bad can it be, they're 4 people so it shouldn't be very hard, right? Those guys could barely pull any DPS at all at the end of the dungeon both DPS had under 25k overall. One was an Assassination Rogue - 452, the other Unholy DK - 445. Tank was 558 and died to boss a few times, healer could barely heal. They were eating axes, quakes. I've had people deplete my key 4-6 times almost consecutively. Simply because either the tank overestimates themselves or someone ninja pulls. The timers were far and away the least of my worries.

So, no, it's not as simple as that.

Bad pulls and or quick pulls happen because of timers. Without them, speed would not be an issue.

It’s easier to fall if you run than if you walk.

[Penegal]

Bad pulls and or quick pulls happen because of timers. Without them, speed would not be an issue.

It’s easier to fall if you run than if you walk.

Yeah, okay. For sure it's only due to timers. Not going to mention people speed running dungeons in WorLK, Cata, MoP, WoD. They only did so in Legion and BfA. Face it, no one wants to waste 1 hour in a dungeon because they want a "chill" run. For me a chill run means a smooth run. Not me not using half of my abilities because someone wants to pull mobs one by one so they can watch their Netflix shows while eating popcorn and not being concerned with the game. People were rushing long before timers. If you want to eliminate timers, you're free to do so - host a run that says "Finishing without concern for the timer" See how many people will join and how well that run will go. If you don't want timers, do regular mythics or Raids. If you want to progress, complete the challenge the game has presented you with.

Note: When talking I do not mean you alone. This can be said to anyone with a similar mentality.