Alliance mythic raiding will die out sooner or later

[Socialhealer]

Cross faction PvE can exist without a faction merger, all they need to do is make that the default if you are not in War Mode and problem solved.

We're not even allowed to play with players on our own faction in mythic raiding until 100 kills, so a fucking lot has to change to let both cross faction and cross server mythic raiding.

[Unholyground]

We're not even allowed to play with players on our own faction in mythic raiding until 100 kills, so a fucking lot has to change to let both cross faction and cross server mythic raiding.

I think they should start with LFG before they expand it when it does happen.

[Thetruth1400]

15 Alliance guilds in the top 100.

289 Alliance guilds in the top 1000.

None in the top 10 or killed n'zoth.

Yet no chance for faction merges as said in last blizzcon.

They let the problem go unchecked for too long to the point it compounded on itself after so many years to the point it's pretty much unable to be fixed.

"But there was / is no bias in racials people just totally chose their factions off cosmetic choices!"

The racial traits system needs to be removed from the game or relegated to cosmetic or out of combat abilities only.
- There's a reason that so many top PvP arena players are Humans.
- There's a reason so many top end PvE players are Trolls or Blood Elves.


At this point, the only way to get back to having an even split between the factions at the high end of game play is a choice between literally forcing factions upon people, over adjusting racials so Alliance racial traits become overpowered, or extremely incentivizing (not just trivial incentives like the extra warmode buff) for the Alliance players.

That aside, I don't think they care about the player balance, and will continue to just churn out mediocre expansions as long as people still play their game.

They had the perfect chance to do so in Shadowlands, but they balked. Factions could have been merged after the war and we could have moved into a new era of WoW where we moved to racial tensions and selections like picking a covenant or Aldor / Scryer for our conflicts between each other when it comes to PvP. For PvE, we could have all played together to "fight the big bad" since we essentially team up and do that anyway every single time a big bad crops up.

[dragi]

It's really going to be a huge problem, you can see how big is difference between factions almost every day morning. Look for example in sunday on DF mythic+. Sometimes i have in alliance 4 grps while on horde side was a few times more groups.

Edit Btw. someone mentioned about top pvp list and humans, ofc. it is. but most of them belongs to top pvp players playing in competition where choosing race have mining. For "regular" player this have no meaning.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Removing all the racials isn't really a good idea cause that just removes some flavor esque stuff. Even if Alliance had on par racials... I don't think close to balance would happen. Unless they want to do racials that are PVE only and PVP only I suppose.

[Sharby]

Removing all the racials isn't really a good idea cause that just removes some flavor esque stuff. Even if Alliance had on par racials... I don't think close to balance would happen. Unless they want to do racials that are PVE only and PVP only I suppose.

Except combat racials don't add any flavor at all, compared to say, faster swimming, reduced fall damage, being able to mimic any crafting tool/lockpick, etc.



You should never be penalized for the race you pick, and currently you are because some racial are way too powerful in comparison to the others.



Either everyone should have good combat racials or no one should have any, they could easily put in non-combat flavor if they want.

[TheLucky1]

Except combat racials don't add any flavor at all, compared to say, faster swimming, reduced fall damage, being able to mimic any crafting tool/lockpick, etc.



You should never be penalized for the race you pick, and currently you are because some racial are way too powerful in comparison to the others.



Either everyone should have good combat racials or no one should have any, they could easily put in non-combat flavor if they want.

At this point it is a snowball effect, won't do anything anymore i fear.

[EbaumsTipster]

Mythic raiding, outside of World Firsts, is such a small population that Blizzard simply doesn't care about them. They would be perfectly fine with Alliance not placing at all in the top 100.

[Sharby]

At this point it is a snowball effect, won't do anything anymore i fear.

Well it's not even really a faction thing, because some Alliance racial are really stupid too (Nelf/Mecha), its just the principle of it.



An aesthetic choice as fundamentally important as your avatar's race should never have any bearing on your performance. Even a boost of like 2-4% is too egregious.

[bullseyed]

Removing all the racials isn't really a good idea cause that just removes some flavor esque stuff. Even if Alliance had on par racials... I don't think close to balance would happen. Unless they want to do racials that are PVE only and PVP only I suppose.

Alliance has better racials for M+ as well as PVP.

The primary Horde racial that prompted the swap for many guilds has been reworked already.

The troll racial was good for one fight (Jaina) and it was hotfixed to not provide such an advantage when it was realized, before people race changed.



For my spec, racials provide a 1,100 DPS gap assuming perfectly geared and sims being perfect representations of every boss fight. The top 2 races are alliance, and 2.5 out of the top 5 are Alliance (pandas = 0.5).

There simply isn't a racial problem. The problem is all the good players went Horde a long time ago and there is no reason to switch back. Giving everyone a "one time do over" to swap might make a dent, might not.

[TheLucky1]

Mythic raiding, outside of World Firsts, is such a small population that Blizzard simply doesn't care about them. They would be perfectly fine with Alliance not placing at all in the top 100.

It does trickle down i think since there will always need to be room to "grow" for underlying guilds, question is how big that effect is.
Not big enough yet apparently.

[Kehego]

Alliance has better racials for M+ as well as PVP.

The primary Horde racial that prompted the swap for many guilds has been reworked already.

The troll racial was good for one fight (Jaina) and it was hotfixed to not provide such an advantage when it was realized, before people race changed.



For my spec, racials provide a 1,100 DPS gap assuming perfectly geared and sims being perfect representations of every boss fight. The top 2 races are alliance, and 2.5 out of the top 5 are Alliance (pandas = 0.5).

There simply isn't a racial problem. The problem is all the good players went Horde a long time ago and there is no reason to switch back. Giving everyone a "one time do over" to swap might make a dent, might not.

200% this.
Shadowmeld is even more ridiculous than old arcane torrent

But if all alliance players want to do are gank in 5man groups for AOO and roleplay, what can blizzard do?

[KaPe]

I know I’ve never come across anyone who mains Alliance that wasn’t an absolute piece of shit person in-game or out of game. So the game would be far better off if they all just went away.

I think this says more about you than other people.

[Relapses]

Blizzard has repeatedly mentioned that faction population is nearly dead even across all realms. Why should they merge factions to fix an issue which affects the top .01% of players? (And isn't even that big of a deal since you can faction transfer anyway.) This is the very definition of a non-issue.

[Azerate]

Alliance is doing fine. About 50% of the total populace plays the faction.

Mythic raiding is a fringe activity that doesn't need to have an equal representation among factions. There's literally nothing wrong with all top guilds being horde.

Blizzard has repeatedly mentioned that faction population is nearly dead even across all realms. Why should they merge factions to fix an issue which affects the top .01% of players? (And isn't even that big of a deal since you can faction transfer anyway.) This is the very definition of a non-issue.

Basically this. It's not an issue at all.And also - people bringing this up usually haven't stepped into a mythic raid of the current tier themselves. They just feel it's not pretty when looking at the highscores.

[Sharby]

Blizzard has repeatedly mentioned that faction population is nearly dead even across all realms. Why should they merge factions to fix an issue which affects the top .01% of players? (And isn't even that big of a deal since you can faction transfer anyway.) This is the very definition of a non-issue.

This is so funny to me.


How can you argue against being able to play with the other half of the playerbase without feeling like a bonehead?




The benefits to cross-faction play don't end with hardcore PvE, it positively affects all levels of play.

[Kehego]

This is so funny to me.


How can you argue against being able to play with the other half of the playerbase without feeling like a bonehead?




The benefits to cross-faction play don't end with hardcore PvE, it positively affects all levels of play.

the horde is fine, we gucci

[Sharby]

Alliance is doing fine. About 50% of the total populace plays the faction.

Mythic raiding is a fringe activity that doesn't need to have an equal representation among factions. There's literally nothing wrong with all top guilds being horde.



Basically this. It's not an issue at all.And also - people bringing this up usually haven't stepped into a mythic raid of the current tier themselves. They just feel it's not pretty when looking at the highscores.

Please cite your source on these population numbers if you're going to make such a claim.



Furthermore, yes, there is an issue because it has reaching consequences that can be observed every tier with Alliance participation being so sparse. Naturally players will go to the faction where the top players are, regardless if they ever reach the top itself. This means said problem will only get worse as time goes on. Its the same train of thought that influences people to play on servers that have high populations vs low ones, your chances of meeting people who have similar interests and goals is higher if there is a bigger pool of players to choose from.

The solution isn't to force people to faction swap or give incentives to swap factions, it is and always has been removing the faction barrier from pve to begin with, and so far I haven't observed a single good argument against doing so besides asinine shit.


EDIT: To clarify, I am talking about players who wish to achieve high-end PvE goals. Casual players will not care about said imbalance, but unless you want to spend a lot of time looking it simply is way more practical to roll Horde as a serious PvE'er.

Even still, the solution proposed wouldn't negatively impact casuals nor hardcore players, but solve the problem affecting HC ones.

[Kyphael]

I know I’ve never come across anyone who mains Alliance that wasn’t an absolute piece of shit person in-game or out of game. So the game would be far better off if they all just went away.

I've met assholes on both sides. As far IRL, the people that I've met that play were normal and played both, but eh.

[Marrilaife]

I've met assholes on both sides. As far IRL, the people that I've met that play were normal and played both, but eh.

I don't even know how people reply to this obvious troll bait. It's as if someone said that if someone prefers cheeseburgers over hot dogs they're a horrible person and people tried to make a logical discussion with him about it.