Ideas for PvP gearing in the future - Shadowlands maybe?

[Big Thanks]

I stopped playing in Visions of Nzoth (please correct me if something changed in this period)

The current situation:

-You start the season by receiving "useless" gear each week by completing the conquest cap.
This gear remains useless for 9 weeks...until it starts rewarding you 1800 rated gear by simply completing the weekly conquest cap on week 10. (70 days after the season starts - 2months and 9 days)
You will then spend the next 6+ weeks gearing up. (note: several months have passed by now)
Lastly, you enjoy your full set of pvp gear for 2 months before the patch ends.

For this system to make any sense you also have the "coins" (forgot the name) you use IF you do rated arena, to upgrade gear.
Gear from weekly chest is random and only useful if you do rated pvp.

MY IDEA

Instead of making us receive "useless" gear for months...let us buy pvp gear from a vendor.
This gear from the vendor will be as useless/useful as it is NOW for PvE.
But make this pieces "BETTER" for PvP.
How?
Make it increse its level in pvp instances and pvp situations OR give a "PvP stat". Your choice.
This way PvP gearing is NEVER useless.

Then Blizzard can distribute "tokens" as they see fit along the next weeks to improve this gear to 1800 rated item level...as they see fit and accordingly.
Again, this gear is better in PvP instances and situations.

But this way PvP gear would be useful for PvE AND PvE gear useless for PvP?

This is where it gets interesting...
The tokens ALL PvP'ers have to farm to "upgrade" their PvP gear to 1800 rating levels...PvE'ers can farm this same tokens to make their PvE gear "useful in PvP" (as much as 1800 rated gear)

It would be an enchant for PvE gear that the tooltip would read "War-ready"

This way BOTH PvP'ers and PvE'ers have to farm the 1800 rated tokens to do PvP optimally.

The Probelm with this idea:

PvP'ers dont have to do extra extra work to make their gear usefull in PvE.
While PvE'ers have to do extra work to make their gear useful in PvP.
Might make PvE'ers angry even though i see this as the most "fair" mechanic possible because PvP'ers still have to farm the "baseline gear"...as much as PvE'ers farm bosses and dungeons.
But they both need to farm the 1800 rated tokens

[Rucati]

Honestly I kind of feel like the current system would be fine if they make a couple tweaks.

First they need to make the weekly rewards not garbage. They should be heroic raid ilvl from the first week, not normal, and by the end they should be equal to m+15. That would mean each week you get one actually useful competitive item.

Next they need to make gear actually drop from arena matches. I've done literally hundreds of arenas this season and think I've gotten maybe 10 items total across all my characters not counting the guaranteed drop from the first win of the season. It's actually awful and there's really no reason it needs to be such a low drop chance.

I think if they just do both those things it'd make gearing up a lot better from pvp.

As for separate pve/pvp gear that seems largely unnecessary. Right now with the exception of trinkets pve and pvp gear are basically equal, the only difference is to get a full pve set takes about a week of m+ and to get a full pvp set takes about 6 months of 100+ arenas a week. If they just made it faster to get gear from pvp it really wouldn't be an issue I don't think.

[mostvp71]

Just add PvP vendors like they had before

Use WoTLK’s or WoD’s system.

Both were great.

[Pratt]

They don't want you gearing through PvP. The inefficiency is the point.

[Queendom]

Ideas for PvP gearing in the future:
- remove it and leave gearing for PvE

[melzas]

Yeah, we've had many different models of PvP gearing over the years I think we can use that hindsight and pick what worked best.

Which for me was legion aka templates. PvP needs to be about skill not gear. I know this is MMORPG and I hear this argument that time you put in needs to be reflected in characters power, but I feel like this only works in pve.

[Big Thanks]

Yeah, we've had many different models of PvP gearing over the years I think we can use that hindsight and pick what worked best.

Which for me was legion aka templates. PvP needs to be about skill not gear. I know this is MMORPG and I hear this argument that time you put in needs to be reflected in characters power, but I feel like this only works in pve.

Plz dont do this to us...gear should be important in a RPG.

By removing gearing...i lose all "progression" in this game...because my main content is PvP.

[melzas]

Plz dont do this to us...gear should be important in a RPG.

By removing gearing...i lose all "progression" in this game...because my main content is PvP.

Yeah and RPG makes shitty PvP gameplay. Leave RPG elements to pve where it works, PvP should be about skill, not who spends more time farming gear.

[Jazzhands]

Plz dont do this to us...gear should be important in a RPG.

By removing gearing...i lose all "progression" in this game...because my main content is PvP.

Anything PVP related shouldn't have gear. Sorry. The only purpose gears serves in pvp is an entry barrier for new players, and to give plays with gear easy targets and free kills. Any decent PVP game has players on the same level at all times, so that all that matters is skill, which is how PVP should be.

PVP players, of course, hate this though. How dare PVP be competitive.

[Big Thanks]

Anything PVP related shouldn't have gear. Sorry. The only purpose gears serves in pvp is an entry barrier for new players, and to give plays with gear easy targets and free kills. Any decent PVP game has players on the same level at all times, so that all that matters is skill, which is how PVP should be.

PVP players, of course, hate this though. How dare PVP be competitive.

Then i have literally zero things to farm...since day 1 of the expansion...ZERO

Blizzard tried exactly what you said in Legion...they went back on that decision for a reason im now less afraid that would happen...gladly

[Jazzhands]

Then i have literally zero things to farm...since day 1 of the expansion...ZERO

Blizzard tried exactly what you said in Legion...they went back on that decision for a reason im now less afraid that would happen...gladly

Yeah, it was reverted because people disliked it. People dislike when you go from a system that allows noob stomping to one that doesn't. Suddenly a lot of PVPers realized they weren't as good as they thought because they no longer had an advantage through gear, so they stopped. Blizzard cares about participation more than anything, which is fair from a business standpoint, but it doesn't change the fact that any decent PVP based game worth it's salt doesn't have WoW-style gear because it's a bad way to do PVP.

[Big Thanks]

Yeah, it was reverted because people disliked it. People dislike when you go from a system that allows noob stomping to one that doesn't. Suddenly a lot of PVPers realized they weren't as good as they thought because they no longer had an advantage through gear, so they stopped. Blizzard cares about participation more than anything, which is fair from a business standpoint, but it doesn't change the fact that any decent PVP based game worth it's salt doesn't have WoW-style gear because it's a bad way to do PVP.

It all boils down to having fun with:
1) All kinds of customization (warrior with crit, demon hunter with versatility etc, gems, enchants, azerites, corruption, essences)
2) Gear progression (having something to do)

Which are major things imo

The PvP scaling already prevents "stomping" undergeared players....herm...more or less

[Jazzhands]

It all boils down to having fun with:
1) All kinds of customization (warrior with crit, demon hunter with versatility etc, gems, enchants, azerites, corruption, essences)
2) Gear progression (having something to do)

Which are major things imo

The PvP scaling already prevents "stomping" undergeared players....herm...more or less

Customization can be done in a lot of different ways. League and DoTA for instance have items you can add to your character, but they're earned in game and every match so everyone has access to them. WoW could have added a more robust talent system to replace gear as a form of customization.

Wanting something like gear progression is totally fair, the problem with gear specifically comes into play for newer players or players who start playing late. Spending weeks getting stomped on due to lack of gear is no fun, and stops many a people from getting into PVP at all. Why would I continue to PVP if I do a few rounds and just get rocked and can't do anything because I have shit gear? No fun. At least with templates like in Legion I stood a chance and could contribute to some degree, and there was gear scaling to give you an advantage, it just never became so big that you could shit over someone before they can fight back.

[Big Thanks]

Customization can be done in a lot of different ways. League and DoTA for instance have items you can add to your character, but they're earned in game and every match so everyone has access to them. WoW could have added a more robust talent system to replace gear as a form of customization.

Wanting something like gear progression is totally fair, the problem with gear specifically comes into play for newer players or players who start playing late. Spending weeks getting stomped on due to lack of gear is no fun, and stops many a people from getting into PVP at all. Why would I continue to PVP if I do a few rounds and just get rocked and can't do anything because I have shit gear? No fun. At least with templates like in Legion I stood a chance and could contribute to some degree, and there was gear scaling to give you an advantage, it just never became so big that you could shit over someone before they can fight back.

Yeah, the problem with pvp gear is the entry level i agree

But another thing going for "customization in PvP" is the fact there can be "happy accidents"
What do i mean by this?

For example Brewmaster Monk can end up being decent for PvP...
If there was only "templates", you can pretty well be completely sure there will NEVER be a brewmaster monk in PvP...

[Jazzhands]

Yeah, the problem with pvp gear is the entry level i agree

But another thing going for "customization in PvP" is the fact there can be "happy accidents"
What do i mean by this?

For example Brewmaster Monk can end up being decent for PvP...
If there was only "templates", you can pretty well be completely sure there will NEVER be a brewmaster monk in PvP...

Tanks have always been in an odd spot for PVP. Their goal is to make people focus on them and help control the battle... but they can't force people to focus them in any way, unless a talent was added for it recently, and most of their control can be done by other, superior classes. Tanks simply need a rework to work in PVP at all. Sometimes they're decent, yeah, but over all tanks have always been a sore spot in PVP.

[Atherions]

WoD had a decent PVP gear model, except for Ashran having unique items. Legion was the worst time for PVP ever in WoW - Lets never go back to the template bullshit.

[Queendom]

Then i have literally zero things to farm...since day 1 of the expansion...ZERO

How is that related to PvP though?

[Big Thanks]

How is that related to PvP though?

Its relevant for the "game" or the "RPG" feeling of getting upgrades.
IMO gear should matter at least a little bit in all RPG's.

[Erlking]

I say bring back WoD gearing system. Give transmog aesthetic reward for long-term game play.

[Big Thanks]

I say bring back WoD gearing system. Give transmog aesthetic reward for long-term game play.

Did you see the Developer update? PvP vendors are back in Shadowlands so happy