Doom Eternal

[Gorsameth]

Playing it on nightmare now and im gonna say - this game would be much, much better if they added a backpack pickup that gives you 50% all ammo before bigger arenas/hidden encounters. Its just annoying when you start them from losing position.

try to get used to leaving a zombie alive so its the last thing around in an arena and you can chainsaw it to stock up for the next fight.

[infinitemeridian]

I started over on UV and am almost done with it I believe (At the torture level). This game is...amazing. I can't believe how much better I am at it then before, and I don't play shooters ever. The progression is amazing, secrets are fun, and the combat is fluid and complex. The story is actually interesting, and the music is perfect. Graphics are great as well, and the game runs better than any game I've ever played.

Yeah the platforming isn't the greatest, especially the swimming, but I don't think it detracts from the game and it makes sense they would want to add sections to show off the added mobility.

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Playing it on nightmare now and im gonna say - this game would be much, much better if they added a backpack pickup that gives you 50% all ammo before bigger arenas/hidden encounters. Its just annoying when you start them from losing position.

They almost always have fodder enemies show up before you go into an encounter. I've never had this issue on UV at least, and there are plenty of ammo pickups scattered throughout the levels as well. I feel like people underestimate how much you can get just from the pickups and you don't have to rely 100% on the chainsaw.

[Arrashi]

They almost always have fodder enemies show up before you go into an encounter. I've never had this issue on UV at least, and there are plenty of ammo pickups scattered throughout the levels as well. I feel like people underestimate how much you can get just from the pickups and you don't have to rely 100% on the chainsaw.

I didn't had that issue on UV either, but on nightmare you basically always need to exploit weaknesses of enemies and you can run short on specific ammo, especially on some hidden encounters, or few less optimal arenas.

In general on nightmare the game gives me the same feeling that blood on extra crispy did, where you really need to "count cards".

[nocturnus]

Just finished Doom 3 BFG with the ultimate hd mod; I honesly can't understand why so many people dislike this game. I know Doom 2016 and Eternal we're never supposed to be eerie, but now I feel like they completely lack any atmosphere whatsoever. It's theme park-like environment, pink, green and yellow icons flying all over the place and never a moment when you actually feel any suspance; the demons might as well have been koopa troopas and goombas.

I don't know, discontinuing Doom 3's style just feels like a missed opportunity, especially considering Eternal rocks one of the best looking and best optimised engines I've ever seen.

[Popastique]

Just finished Doom 3 BFG with the ultimate hd mod; I honesly can't understand why so many people dislike this game.

Nostalgia aside, Doom 3 tries to be a horror, and at the same time - action game. And that mix doesn't work well in that particular case. You are supposed to feel suspense, but having so many deadly demon-killing weapons kills that suspense. Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal simply killed off that horror side, and replaced it with non-stop action. Most people like it, but not everyone - which is fine.

[Edge-]

Just finished Doom 3 BFG with the ultimate hd mod; I honesly can't understand why so many people dislike this game. I know Doom 2016 and Eternal we're never supposed to be eerie, but now I feel like they completely lack any atmosphere whatsoever. It's theme park-like environment, pink, green and yellow icons flying all over the place and never a moment when you actually feel any suspance; the demons might as well have been koopa troopas and goombas.

I don't know, discontinuing Doom 3's style just feels like a missed opportunity, especially considering Eternal rocks one of the best looking and best optimised engines I've ever seen.

So...it's more like the OG Doom games then : P

I like Doom 3 (OG version with the flashlight as a weapon) and think it's a fantastic example of world building with all the PDA's and does a good job mixing more horror elements with the action. Even if the horror is undercut by the fact that you can shoot everything in the damned face and it'll die. But like...OG doom was bright and had colors everywhere.

I'd love to see them do a horror-themed spinoff though. Keep Doom action focused but make something else to explore the horror aspect of it. Like, be a scientist in the facilities when shit's going down or one of the first responding dudes with completely ineffectual weapons.

[Arrashi]

So...it's more like the OG Doom games then : P

I like Doom 3 (OG version with the flashlight as a weapon) and think it's a fantastic example of world building with all the PDA's and does a good job mixing more horror elements with the action. Even if the horror is undercut by the fact that you can shoot everything in the damned face and it'll die. But like...OG doom was bright and had colors everywhere.

I'd love to see them do a horror-themed spinoff though. Keep Doom action focused but make something else to explore the horror aspect of it. Like, be a scientist in the facilities when shit's going down or one of the first responding dudes with completely ineffectual weapons.

Honestly D64 is horror spinoff. Its amazing what this game achieves with soundtrack, clever lighting, and slight monster redesign.

[nocturnus]

So...it's more like the OG Doom games then : P

I like Doom 3 (OG version with the flashlight as a weapon) and think it's a fantastic example of world building with all the PDA's and does a good job mixing more horror elements with the action. Even if the horror is undercut by the fact that you can shoot everything in the damned face and it'll die. But like...OG doom was bright and had colors everywhere.

I'd love to see them do a horror-themed spinoff though. Keep Doom action focused but make something else to explore the horror aspect of it. Like, be a scientist in the facilities when shit's going down or one of the first responding dudes with completely ineffectual weapons.

I like the fact that you aren't some helpless individual with a weak tool for a weapon; I don't want another survival-horror. Especially because it's so incredibly tough to nail that genre; most are utter shit. Alien Isolation was the only one that did it really well and it had a huge franchise backing it up story-wise.

The first time I played Doom 3 was without the mod and I liked it just as much. Playing Eternal just gave me some nostalgia which is why I went back for a second play through.

Even now, Doom and Doom II feel less like a theme park than the new iterations do. OG Doom had jump scares, doors opening behind you and most importantly, oinking pinkies. 64 was actually scary at times and I consider that an OG Doom as well. I know people feel like 2016 and Eternal were examples of "going back to its roots", but to me they both don't feel anything like the OG games.

They should just make Doom 4 with Eternal's engine but 3's game play and story telling; man, the story unfolding with the PDAs was genius.

[Edge-]

Man, the story unfolding with the PDAs was genius.

To this day I still reference Doom 3 as one of the best games for delivering deep yet optional world builds/narrative. You can completely skip the PDA's if you want (missing out on a few goodies unless you find codes on the internet) and the game works just fine. You can dive in deep an listen to/read them all and learn a helluva lot about the world and the events leading up to you arriving.

Was kinda bummed they weren't in Doom 2016 and apparently aren't in this game either, but came around to it. Without the breaks between combat Doom 3 provided it'd be hard to really listen to them too closely without stopping each time.

[nocturnus]

To this day I still reference Doom 3 as one of the best games for delivering deep yet optional world builds/narrative. You can completely skip the PDA's if you want (missing out on a few goodies unless you find codes on the internet) and the game works just fine. You can dive in deep an listen to/read them all and learn a helluva lot about the world and the events leading up to you arriving.

Was kinda bummed they weren't in Doom 2016 and apparently aren't in this game either, but came around to it. Without the breaks between combat Doom 3 provided it'd be hard to really listen to them too closely without stopping each time.

That's another thing; the modern Dooms have actual artificially implemented 'breaks between combat', if I can use your phrasing. It doesn't ever feel like a cohesive experience, like advancing in a quest, adventure or journey, though I have to admit they tried to address this fault in Eternal. Yet, 2016 and Eternal still feel as though you're in a card board box of arena's connected by corridors. Of course, I do realise that these are completely different games; one is an arcade twitch shooter, the other is a story driven action-horror experience.

[Jastall]

That's another thing; the modern Dooms have actual artificially implemented 'breaks between combat', if I can use your phrasing. It doesn't ever feel like a cohesive experience, like advancing in a quest, adventure or journey, though I have to admit they tried to address this fault in Eternal. Yet, 2016 and Eternal still feel as though you're in a card board box of arena's connected by corridors. Of course, I do realise that these are completely different games; one is an arcade twitch shooter, the other is a story driven action-horror experience.

Don't take this the wrong way, but play Dead Space or Prey if you want that sort of game. There's a good reason Doom threaded that path once and never went back to it again.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

To this day I still reference Doom 3 as one of the best games for delivering deep yet optional world builds/narrative. You can completely skip the PDA's if you want (missing out on a few goodies unless you find codes on the internet) and the game works just fine. You can dive in deep an listen to/read them all and learn a helluva lot about the world and the events leading up to you arriving.

Was kinda bummed they weren't in Doom 2016 and apparently aren't in this game either, but came around to it. Without the breaks between combat Doom 3 provided it'd be hard to really listen to them too closely without stopping each time.

Don't the codex do the same thing the PDA does in your first paragraph? They're all optional and they expand a lot of the game's lore, more so than what is shown non optionally.

[exochaft]

Don't the codex do the same thing the PDA does in your first paragraph? They're all optional and they expand a lot of the game's lore, more so than what is shown non optionally.

They do, the tone is a bit different though. PDA's tended to be your window into the everyday man or scientist/worker that showed their personal world that all connected and expanded the game's world. Codex entries are pretty much like an exposition dump, like a wiki or encyclopedia entry... which is fine, but that's basically ALL of them, and they're dense as hell in some cases (excuse the pun). I think the codex system would've been better if they toned down on lore exposition dumps and had more of a "Hey, you found Timmy's journal describing his time in captivity, overheard the 'mortally challenged' talking about Doomguy and some tidbits that relate to the world and background lore."

Hate sounding like a broken record, but it's another example of one of those systems where they tried way too hard and went overboard in a net negative way. While a person may want some more lore information on what's going on and the history, remembering all the bloody names/locations that are just thrown out there is pretty distracting.

[Gorsameth]

Don't the codex do the same thing the PDA does in your first paragraph? They're all optional and they expand a lot of the game's lore, more so than what is shown non optionally.

The codex is much more info dumps from a largely omniscient story teller.
The PDA's in Doom 3, from what I remember, are more personal and draw you more into the atmosphere.

[nocturnus]

Don't take this the wrong way, but play Dead Space or Prey if you want that sort of game. There's a good reason Doom threaded that path once and never went back to it again.

I loved Dead Space. I never played Prey.

So, what is this "good reason"? Doom 3 was and actually still is, an excellent game.

Don't the codex do the same thing the PDA does in your first paragraph? They're all optional and they expand a lot of the game's lore, more so than what is shown non optionally.

Etarnal's codices are boring info-dumps that barely have any added value to the game or the way you feel about the situation your character is in. The PDAs do an infinitely better job at conveing a story and creating an immersive experience. Eternal's codices are three image comics attempting to narrate 'The name of the Wind' in comparison.

[Jastall]

I loved Dead Space. I never played Prey.

So, what is this "good reason"?

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They have the same function, but the PDAs do an infinitely better job at conveing the story and creating an immersive experience.

It's not the serie's main strength. Doom 3 has its fans for sure, and is not a terrible game by any means, but among all the others (1, 2, 64, 3, 2016, Eternal) is most definitely the odd one out, and by the reckoning of a lot of series's fans I've seen is the weakest or second weakest title as well, mine included.

While the exact amount of tension/horror has varied in between games, all the others privileged action above it. Prey 2017 is a good example of a game that basically do what Doom 3 did, except better if you ask me. You definitely should play it.

TLDR I don't play Doom for an immersive experience. Many others series and games do that better. I play Doom to shoot demons in the face in awesome ways, and at that it is second to none.

[nocturnus]

It's not the serie's main strength. Doom 3 has its fans for sure, and is not a terrible game by any means, but among all the others (1, 2, 64, 3, 2016, Eternal) is most definitely the odd one out, and by the reckoning of a lot of series's fans I've seen is the weakest or second weakest title as well, mine included.

While the exact amount of tension/horror has varied in between games, all the others privileged action above it. Prey 2017 is a good example of a game that basically do what Doom 3 did, except better if you ask me. You definitely should play it.

TLDR I don't play Doom for an immersive experience. Many others series and games do that better. I play Doom to shoot demons in the face in awesome ways, and at that it is second to none.

As valid as your points seem, rationally speaking, I think that the most recent iterations of Doom are the odd ones out; Glory kills? Platforming? Rotating fiery Super Mario chains floating in the air? Confetti consumables flying around after a chainsaw kill? Pole swinging? I mean, nothing about that is even remotely reminiscent of OG Doom. Doom 3 actually had things I recognised; pick-up sound effects, door sound effects, pick-up cues that triggered doors for rooms sheltering enemies right behind you, nigh-claustrophobic corridors, etc.

I don't know man, the new games just don't feel like Doom. Maybe because I played Doom as a kid and actually experienced it as a scary game, rather than an arena theme park-arcade game.

[Jastall]

As valid as your points seem, rationally speaking, I think that the most recent iterations of Doom are the odd ones out; Glory kills? Platforming? Rotating fiery Super Mario chains floating in the air? Confetti consumables flying around after a chainsaw kill? Pole swinging? I mean, nothing about that is even remotely reminiscent of OG Doom. Doom 3 actually had things I recognised; pick-up sound effects, door sound effects, pick-up cues that triggered doors for rooms sheltering enemies right behind you, nigh-claustrophobic corridors, etc.

I don't know man, the new games just don't feel like Doom. Maybe because I played Doom as a kid and actually experienced it as a scary game, rather than an arena theme park-arcade game.

I mean, if you solely focus on the visual trappings, I guess. I'd argue that in terms of gameplay and driving design philosophy, running around with your super shotgun gibbing the forces of hell in various cathartic ways is far more Doom than listening to audio logs, and the general reception of the playerbase seems to trends towards the two most recent games being worthy successors while Doom 3 is oft ignored.

To say nothing of the fact that audio-log heavy immersive sims have been done well fairly frequently in the recent past, while run and gun shooters were a dying breed in the post-Modern Warfare era of cover-based borefests. Doom being a return to form, alongside Wolfenstein to some extent, gave a huge breath of fresh air to a genre that needed it a lot, while atmospheric games still have yet to top Bioshock 1 if you ask me.

I get your points, but I have completely different expectations from the game, is all. Doom 1 and 2 were very cartoony despite the violence, hell the pickups, demons and some gun models in Eternal are almost 1:1 recreations of the classic sprites. The ammo confetti display is a very clear visual cue, and the bright colors are an essential part of the nervous, fast-paced combat; you want to tell what's a medkit, an armor pickup or shotgun shells at a glance. Warframe does something very similar, as one of the few games on the market to be as fast-paced as Doom Eternal.

[nocturnus]

I mean, if you solely focus on the visual trappings, I guess. I'd argue that in terms of gameplay and driving design philosophy, running around with your super shotgun gibbing the forces of hell in various cathartic ways is far more Doom than listening to audio logs, and the general reception of the playerbase seems to trends towards the two most recent games being worthy successors while Doom 3 is oft ignored.

To say nothing of the fact that audio-log heavy immersive sims have been done well fairly frequently in the recent past, while run and gun shooters were a dying breed in the post-Modern Warfare era of cover-based borefests. Doom being a return to form, alongside Wolfenstein to some extent, gave a huge breath of fresh air to a genre that needed it a lot, while atmospheric games still have yet to top Bioshock 1 if you ask me.

I get your points, but I have completely different expectations from the game, is all. Doom 1 and 2 were very cartoony despite the violence, hell the pickups, demons and some gun models in Eternal are almost 1:1 recreations of the classic sprites. The ammo confetti display is a very clear visual cue, and the bright colors are an essential part of the nervous, fast-paced combat; you want to tell what's a medkit, an armor pickup or shotgun shells at a glance. Warframe does something very similar, as one of the few games on the market to be as fast-paced as Doom Eternal.

I agree wholeheartedly on the dire need for actually good action based shooters. I would never argue against either 2016 or Eternal; they have a very solid place in the market and as you eloquently said: we really don't need another cover-based borefest. That said, I would love a sequel (game play-wise) to Doom 3 in addition to the frantic arcade shooters which can be fun in their own right.

Maybe sequels to Hexen and Heretic would satiate that hunger provided that they would be developed in the Eternal engine and with Doom 3's game play in mind. Obviously it isn't a realistic scenario, but a man can hope, right? There aren't that many good first person horror shooters beyond Dead Space, Metro 2033 and Bioshock, the latter disappointing more and more with each sequel they regurgitated.

By the way, I did play Prey! Not long because I didn't like the blandness of it all; goo-monsters, really? Everything in shades of khaki, etc. A shame, considering the fact that sci-fi-horror is one of my favourite genres. Like 'Control', the environments and enemies were uninspired and bland.

[Rennadrel]

The later part of Doom 3 and Resurrection of Evil kinda had a similar pacing to Doom Eternal, however because there's no resource management or enemy management for that matter, what weapon you use doesn't matter as much. As, one is more of a survival horror type game while the other is very much an action shooter.