Is it impossible to dislike pandaria constructively without "YOU HATE PANDAS" bs?

[Michael Jackson]

When pandaria was announced and launched, there was a lot of hate from a lot of people because of the pandaren race.
Some of it was because they're pandas and goofy, other was more constructive.

Many years however, it is IMPOSSIBLE to have arguments against pandaria, no matter if they even mention the pandaren or not, without some shitface reply about "yeah just another panda hater thread".

You could literally criticize Seige of Orgrimmar, and at some point someone would come in with a "yeah it's just another thinly veiled thread from a panda hater".

Like do you really not feel embarassed and retarded to dismiss any and all arguments, no matter how well written and expalined, just because you really fucking love pandaren and you're afraid that maybe someone will logically show you that something about THE EXPANSION AS A WHOLE is dumb? And GOD FORBID, that maybe SOMETHING about the pandaren is dumb or poorly written and executed as well?

Like what the fuck is so sacrosaint about this expansion that gets people so embarrasingly defensive about it?
I LOVED WOTLK, yet I'm also one of the first to criticize its weak points, especially its ending.

Yeah, believe it or not, not all of us found Throne of Thunder a fun raid, except maybe one or 2 bosses. Not the lore, not the art, not the mechanics.
OMG YOU DIDN'T LIKE THRONE OF THUNDER, YOU'RE JUST A PANDA HATER! WHAT? TOT WAS ABOUT MOGU AND TROLLS AND A TITAN REFERENCE? YOU FUCKING PANDA HATER OMG!

[Frinata]

Can't believe you'd hate on Pandas like this.


No but really, you're allowed to not like MoP, and it doesn't have to be related to disliking of the Pandaren. It's admitedly hard to talk about the expansion and it's content without talking about them, seeming they're one of 4 major races that hold prominance there as additions and story beats. It's between Pandaren, Mogu, Sha, and Zandalari, with splashes of the Mantid and the faction conflict added in for effect.

The overall message of the expansion is a bit hammy, "Don't hate each other dude" can only be said to you through enough thin veils before it just becomes an anti-war expansion. I can understand why people like it, or dislike it, from many different angles. Disliking it doesn't automaticly mean you hate the Pandaren, and yes, they're Pandarens, not Pandas.

[Laughingjack]

It is impossible to dislike anything in the game without being made into a strawman.

Blizzard though rapidly changing gameplay over the years has cultivated a massively fractured player base of dozens of communities all of who do not really care for one another.

[McNeil]

I never found the pandaren to be ‘childish’, I just don’t find them suiting to give them their own expansion. I always felt that Pandaria felt rather outlandish compared to most other continents we have visited. I’m not a fan of the Asian they go with and how they portray the pandaren and mogu as stereotypical as they can get. MoP has other issues but I was never a fan of its theme.

Maybe pandaren would have been received better if they were just a playable race without centering an expansion around them. I often see people go like ‘we had tauren and worgen so why make a big deal about pandaren?’, yet they never got their own expansion and don’t get as much exposure. It doesn’t help that the only thing we knew about the pandaren before MoP was that they were just an easter egg in WC3, where you can unlock a pandaren hero in the blood elf and rexxar campaign as part of an optional quest.

[Venziir]

When pandaria was announced and launched, there was a lot of hate from a lot of people because of the pandaren race.
Some of it was because they're pandas and goofy, other was more constructive.

Many years however, it is IMPOSSIBLE to have arguments against pandaria, no matter if they even mention the pandaren or not, without some shitface reply about "yeah just another panda hater thread".

You could literally criticize Seige of Orgrimmar, and at some point someone would come in with a "yeah it's just another thinly veiled thread from a panda hater".

Like do you really not feel embarassed and retarded to dismiss any and all arguments, no matter how well written and expalined, just because you really fucking love pandaren and you're afraid that maybe someone will logically show you that something about THE EXPANSION AS A WHOLE is dumb? And GOD FORBID, that maybe SOMETHING about the pandaren is dumb or poorly written and executed as well?

Like what the fuck is so sacrosaint about this expansion that gets people so embarrasingly defensive about it?
I LOVED WOTLK, yet I'm also one of the first to criticize its weak points, especially its ending.

Yeah, believe it or not, not all of us found Throne of Thunder a fun raid, except maybe one or 2 bosses. Not the lore, not the art, not the mechanics.
OMG YOU DIDN'T LIKE THRONE OF THUNDER, YOU'RE JUST A PANDA HATER! WHAT? TOT WAS ABOUT MOGU AND TROLLS AND A TITAN REFERENCE? YOU FUCKING PANDA HATER OMG!

Well this thread is about 8 years late to the party....

[Dastreus]

Why can't it be about hating Pandaren, though? They're awful. So are Vulpera.

[valax]

The only thing I have against pandaria is the straight up copying chinese stuff, they didn't have too as , besides the race being pandas, there was never an implication to be asian inspired. It somehow hurts immersion

[salate]

Timeless Isle was the best thing they added with patch. I Dunno, It was the patch that hooked me with all that music, environment, and stuff. whenever people mention Pandaria I always remember fun I had on Timeless Isle... And Archaeology realm first Damn that was funny as hell.
Well, but thats me, I try to remember only goodie things

[Varodoc]

I don't really have a lot of criticism for MoP as an expansion because I had a lot of fun during it, lots of good memories. However that scenario A Little Patience can go fuck itself. 40 years old man can't be more experienced than 10.000 years old elf who fought in the most apocalyptic conflict in history.

Oh and the ending. Jaina should've 100% gotten the kill, fuck Taran Zhu and his whole "we all suffered from his atrocities" BS.

[Aucald]

You're allowed to dislike anything, really. People will still probably misrepresent your argument or position if it is of benefit to them to do so, but that doesn't really mean much or require that you change your position on the matter. Pandaria was far from perfect, so there's plenty to dislike if you're of a mind to - just as there is also plenty to like if you're of a mind to.

[LordVargK]

there are certainly things to be disliked about MoP. But it's also true, that MoP was the peak of power for many classes. Since then Blizz has the philosophy of "doubling down on weaknesses (and strenghts)", meaning making classes intentionally clunky for the sake of "spec identity".

[Nachturnal]

Why can't it be about hating Pandaren, though? They're awful. So are Vulpera.

Because there's more to an expansion than a race. It's silly to disregard an entire expansion's depth, content and systems just because of a playable race. Just don't play the race.

I don't really have a lot of criticism for MoP as an expansion because I had a lot of fun during it, lots of good memories. However that scenario A Little Patience can go fuck itself. 40 years old man can't be more experienced than 10.000 years old elf who fought in the most apocalyptic conflict in history.

Oh and the ending. Jaina should've 100% gotten the kill, fuck Taran Zhu and his whole "we all suffered from his atrocities" BS.

Same here! It's personally my favorite expansion being that I got so much done and have tons of fond memories. The raids were great and unique, enjoyed the legendary cloak, got into heroic raiding (now called mythic), and I really loved the grand commendation system. I wish they would bring that back. Getting a rep to exalted and then buying an item that would speed up the rep grind on your alts, account-wide, is just good. It was a very alt-friendly expansion. I understand some of the criticism it got, but I really enjoyed the shift from Legion/Undead/Dragons and the addition of Monk as a class.

Also, the introduction of Challenge Mode dungeons, unique class armor sets, how fun most of the classes/specs were in terms of design and all the damage before the squish. Good times for me.

[alturic]

Who cares if you hate pandas though anyway?

- - - Updated - - -

Because there's more to an expansion than a race. It's silly to disregard an entire expansion's depth, content and systems just because of a playable race. Just don't play the race.

Unless the sole reason for hating the expansion is like this poster says, then yea... then again wouldn't hating LK being the same thing? 'You just hate Death Knights!11!'

On-topic: I think MoP was the beginning of the end for me. I don't know what it was, but the expansion overall was just meh.

[sylenna]

other question: how is this relevant? and why do you give a shit about someone who doesn't want to discuss with you correctly?

[Harbour]

>Disliking expansion "because it offers weird, out of place, aesthetic and offers immersion-breaking race, and also all themes had no place in the game previously and barely make sense in the context of the setting" is bullshit.

Every day i learn something new from retards on mmo-champion.

[kail]

I have nothing against pandas specifically, nor an Asian themed game. My issue was that it simply doesn't fit Warcraft. They turned what was originally an easter egg in WC3 and a Holiday mascot in WoW to coincide with Germany's brewfest into actual canon. If they made an expansion that revolved around Winterveil and having to save Santa, I would be just as disappointed.

And while WoW was never a mature game that had its comedy relief sprinkled throughout the game, MoP felt like it was overdone in terms of the leveling compaign.

[TickTickTick]

I never understood the "panda hate" to be honest. How can you hate panda-like race when there already were gnomes and tauren. And now we have Vulpera.

[Varodoc]

I can understand the criticism about the pandaren not deserving an entire expansion, but it should be pretty obvious that the themes and general atmosphere of MoP are not actually that light-hearted and that they fit the Warcraft franchise, no? I mean, the three main storylines of the expansion are:

- Literal world war, which became even more violent after a genocidal warmonger nuked an entire city;
- The Sha, who are the evil spawn of Squid Satan and thrive off of corrupting emotions;
- The return of the mogu empire and their monarch Lei Shen, a ruthless tyrant who enslaved and exterminated entire races.

MoP wasn't that far off from the usual tragedy and darkness of the Warcraft universe. Even that continent itself had a few very dark and war-torn zones.

[daytonbrown]

Timeless Isle was the best thing they added with patch. I Dunno, It was the patch that hooked me with all that music, environment, and stuff. whenever people mention Pandaria I always remember fun I had on Timeless Isle... And Archaeology realm first Damn that was funny as hell.
Well, but thats me, I try to remember only goodie things

I agree, Timeless Isle was fantastic. So much to do. You can go back there now and there are still people running around doing things. The cheerful lighting, perfect relaxing music. Mount parades at Houlon waiting for him to spawn. Lots of rares spread throughout. The more difficult rares and mobs across the bridge.

The only negative is that terrible achievement Gonna Need a Bigger Bag because you could never get that rare crab drop!

[LedZeppelin]

You arent wrong but yes, I also hate pandas