Highborne customizations for the Night Elves (NOT High Elves)

[Ringthane]

So, since we never saw Undead NPCs without exposed bones, Blizzard could and should never add such an option either, right?

Just an aside, but I believe in Japan or China, Undead have no bones showing because of religious reasons or something. So that option is already there.

[Koryn123]

For my characters, I always just gave them the palest skin option and white hair to make them how I always pictured Highborne to look.

[Beloren]

I swear, after all of their bluster about separating old customization options and new ones out, night elves still can't shave their beard without losing their eyebrows, then this is all one big meme.

You can always tell when blizzard don't care about certain groups, when some of the most glaring things are forgotten. Tauren and Gnome fans can well relate. I think gnomes also have the no eyebrows thing. We shall see.





@Mace, @ravenmoon I don't think they disagree with you guys, at least not originally from past posts, it's just that you two kinda overdo it, because you harp on about it so much, you make people feel that's all the night elves are about. I get that you are challenging peoples pre-conceptions that tend to forget, and informing them correctly (as you see it) - but it comes off a bit arrogant, as if you know everything when you don't.

I think this is what they're reacting too. I think Tharivor and Alanar have never really denied the night elves' heritage or that the highborne play a role.. i think his main issue was how you harped on so much about it Mace, anyone would think the highborne are the main thrust of the night elves, when they are not. It's the Priesthood and druids which are the most visible.

Yes you're a Night elf expert, and yes you are probably right that the arcane and Highborne play equally as large a role as the other 2 - but you have to understand these guys don't like night elves like you do (very few do), they haven't spent time reading the books making endless posts, and analysing the race through multiple media and content. They log on, play the game, and what they see is what they interpret. In starting area is trees, forests, druidism, not much arcane and cities. So it's natural this seems much larger in the night elves to them..

All that stuff you keep mentioning, most people don't know it and don't care. You need to understand that before you get so angry about them not seeing it your way. I think they'd appreciate your contribution and might be more willing to listen if you didn't try to shove it in their face, or write essays on it, just a one liner, drawing attention to the bits that aren't seen by most or show up later.

Believe me, i know, i use to think Night elves were little more than monkeys - but a few years on the forum, I saw people saying all these other things, and I went and picked up the books myself, tried an alliance toon, and actually paid attention, and I saw it too. but most other don't and won't - at least until Blizzard show the night elves and Highborne moving into a city as grand as Suramar and a large chunk of their quests walk the player through. A short cut everyone would understand is if the Farondis came to life and rejoined the Night elves, and the Moonguard in Suramar were shown to align with the Darnassian night elves and join them in combat - everyone has done those quests, they know these are highborne, and night elves, they know they're powerful

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Yes, but the good news is, it is as you say in game, not as he says. Night elves do have highborne, they do play a visible role, the pre-sundering aspect of the night elves is still with them, so is the magic and its powerful.

It doesn't have the visible showing that was displayed in the nighborne, they just need a great city and all that would take is for the night elves to take Suramar or share it, or have a new capital looking like Zin'Azshari or something. they already have imba magic users in-game you see Farondis and The Moonguard as quite powerful, and while we never saw the Shen'dralar actually in action, it's the same vein, ..it's there. Any body can say whatever they like really. But bottom line is we do have highborne, and blizzard do show them both on alliance and ofc on horde via the Nightborne.

It's already in game see, so what's all the fuss.. all they now need to do is show the Farondis joining them alive along with the Moonguard - everyone has done those quests, the Moonguard and Farondis were powerful shown as magic users - them joining the Darnassians is enough and people will know ah, this is what Highborne are like.

Fix up Nar'thalas or re build it like Zin'Azshari and everyone would realise this is a part of the night elves we play. It's there, but it's not visible or properly connected to the night elves you play. At least that's what I think.

[Mace]

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The problem is you see everything here in terms of faction. Just because Nightborne ended up on the Horde doesn't mean now Darnassian Night Elves have to become Nightborne so that you can play your preferred themes in blue. I have both Alliance and Horde characters, including Night Elves and Blood Elves- its not impossible.

Okay, maybe I have over-reacted to you. But what this is about is not having all night elves clone the Nightborne, no, some of the night elves are like the Nightborne, the Nightborne are modelled after them - kinda like the void elves are modelled after the blood elves, but closer. What you are considering is Nightborne is all Night elven too. It's not all of the night elves, but its ALL night elven too. The only part of the Nightborne that is not Kaldorei is the Nightwell and their experience under the shield.

• But the high class city night elf
• The city of Suramar
• The great arcane mastery
• the beauty and aesthetic of the city/zone

It's all Night elven too. Having that aspect on the Night Elves is where it is fully home. It's not all the night elves, they are a core race, a big race, but it is a part of them and should be visible

• What is Nightborne alone are
• The arcane runes
• The actual model - skinnier, up-turned ear tips
• The experience of starving and ingesting arcane (which is what changes their appearance slightly)

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For my characters, I always just gave them the palest skin option and white hair to make them how I always pictured Highborne to look.

That's what blizzard want you to be able to do. This is what Danuser was saying. They want the player to be able to experience as wide a possible of range of things their race is in lore. And if that's what they want their character to be, that is who it is.

He was talking in reference to the Wildhammer when asked if you take the tattoos, does that mean you're a wildhammer?, but the starting experience is specific for a Bronzebeard.

Danuser said they made a decision to give you access to all the other flavours of the race (that is in the lore - which is why he was consulted by the art team), regardless of what the starting experience was, because they practically couldn't do a starting experience for every group they wanted you to be able to play, it would be too much. So you get to decide what type of dwarf (and by extension Night elf you want to be) - and by implication they would provide the other customisations.


So, I am thinking that Night elf highborne can be that pale skinned, or blueish purple like Azshara, or that darker purple tone we saw amongst the new options. And if you're a highborne, that's who you are, regardless of what the starting experience says.

But they are providing a universal starting experience., so only older character can access the original starting experience. Brand new players have only the first.

[ravenmoon]

Okay, maybe I have over-reacted to you. But what this is about is not having all night elves clone the Nightborne, no, some of the night elves are like the Nightborne, the Nightborne are modelled after them - kinda like the void elves are modelled after the blood elves, but closer. What you are considering is Nightborne is all Night elven too. It's not all of the night elves, but its ALL night elven too. The only part of the Nightborne that is not Kaldorei is the Nightwell and their experience under the shield.

• But the high class city night elf
• The city of Suramar
• The great arcane mastery
• the beauty and aesthetic of the city/zone

It's all Night elven too. Having that aspect on the Night Elves is where it is fully home. It's not all the night elves, they are a core race, a big race, but it is a part of them and should be visible

• What is Nightborne alone are
• The arcane runes
• The actual model - skinnier, up-turned ear tips
• The experience of starving and ingesting arcane (which is what changes their appearance slightly)

The way I view night elves is kinda like druids.. Druids have these 4 sides to them, so do night elves.

• Arcane which is the first because that's where they are made from and is their most precious thing, and also the one they can get most easily addicted to, then:
• Nature love, hence the druidsm and trees.
• Then Elune which kinda is in everything both arcane and nature, the priesthood discerns Elune from studying the well, they view its Arcane waters sacred, they cast arcane spells mostly for damage, and void ones if pain mistresses and black moon alongside arcane ones, light ones for most of the healing stuff, and ofc she is associated with nature having loved Marlone who is the nature maestro and his son Cenarius. so the priesthood touches both aspects.
• Then the last is Fel, it is t the smallest in number, but size has never meant insifginifacnt, they're not even officially part of the Darnassians yet, but not only are the yplayable but they are such a large part fo the lore, Illidan was as much a part of WotA as Malfurion, Tyrande and Azshara, and features heavily in WC3, TBC and has his own books and we know lots of night elf followers too. but DHs don't play a main role in the starting area, so people forget about them. Same with the highborne - you need to read the other materiasls. It's kind like the druid and its 4 main roles

[Mace]

The way I view night elves is kinda like druids.. Druids have these 4 sides to them, so do night elves.

• Arcane which is the first because that's where they are made from and is their most precious thing, and also the one they can get most easily addicted to, then:
• Nature love, hence the druidsm and trees.
• Then Elune which kinda is in everything both arcane and nature, the priesthood discerns Elune from studying the well, they view its Arcane waters sacred, they cast arcane spells mostly for damage, and void ones if pain mistresses and black moon alongside arcane ones, light ones for most of the healing stuff, and ofc she is associated with nature having loved Marlone who is the nature maestro and his son Cenarius. so the priesthood touches both aspects.
• Then the last is Fel, it is t the smallest in number, but size has never meant insifginifacnt, they're not even officially part of the Darnassians yet, but not only are the yplayable but they are such a large part fo the lore, Illidan was as much a part of WotA as Malfurion, Tyrande and Azshara, and features heavily in WC3, TBC and has his own books and we know lots of night elf followers too. but DHs don't play a main role in the starting area, so people forget about them. Same with the highborne - you need to read the other materiasls. It's kind like the druid and its 4 main roles

Then why on earth would anyone think the Highborne stuff isn't night elven?

[ravenmoon]

Then why on earth would anyone think the Highborne stuff isn't night elven?

Because what I've said could be viewed as an interpreatation, unless blizzard out rightly says somethings, or overwhelmingly shows them, people can pretend like it's not so.

or maybe it's more they don't want it to be with the Night elves, becuase the blood elves have similar things (i.e. the high magic, cities and stuff) so they'd rather the night elves just have forests and a more primitive look - because they're old, and ancient means primitive, so it fits nicely in the head.

[Mace]

Because what I've said could be viewed as an interpreatation, unless blizzard out rightly says somethings, or overwhelmingly shows them, people can pretend like it's not so.

or maybe it's more they don't want it to be with the Night elves, becuase the blood elves have similar things (i.e. the high magic, cities and stuff) so they'd rather the night elves just have forests and a more primitive look - because they're old, and ancient means primitive, so it fits nicely in the head.

That's just pure head canon. You have to look at the information you're given, not what your prejudices, biases or emotions want it to be.

No one questions for a second when they see those ruins in Darkshore, Desolace, in Azsuna, in Suramar that they're night elven. But the idea of a night elves having a non-ruined city and wielding arcane magic (which is shown btw) all of a sudden is a problem or my headcanon?

[ravenmoon]

That's just pure head canon. You have to look at the information you're given, not what your prejudices, biases or emotions want it to be.

No one questions for a second when they see those ruins in Darkshore, Desolace, in Azsuna, in Suramar that they're night elven. But the idea of a night elves having a non-ruined city and wielding arcane magic (which is shown btw) all of a sudden is a problem or my headcanon?

It's because the arcane magic wielding and the cities were in the past, and so they're all ruins now. Therefore it's not part of hte night elves. And because Night elves don't have any current cities or arcane wielders , its easy to think it's not a part of htem anymore.

[Mace]

It's because the arcane magic wielding and the cities were in the past, and so they're all ruins now. Therefore it's not part of hte night elves. And because Night elves don't have any current cities or arcane wielders , its easy to think it's not a part of htem anymore.

And that does not make sense at all. Just because your city or buildinigs are in ruins doesn't make them not yours or not a part of you. Even if you left civilization living like that a long time ago, it is still your civilization. Suramar is how you do things, it's still night elven.

Also, they do have current city (at least till BFA) and they do have arcane wielders, - the lore shows us there are night elves like the Shen'dralar Highborne, the Moonguard and the Nightborne that never stopped wielding the arcane.

One of these groups is with the playable race, many things they had stopped doing they've started doing again, because they can.

Stopping to wield arcane was not some zen redefinition or some magical transformation into nature only elves. That's not their story. Stopping to use the arcane was for one reason only. STOP THE LEGION FROM RETURNING. And because they had to, they couldn't rebuild cities like before or live blike before.

But they humbly and willingsly accepted the changed, relied on nature to support them so they could effectively carry out this task of PREVENTING THE LGION FROM EVER RETURNING.


Once the Legion returns, that is no longer necessary. We see them.
1. Move out of isolation
2. Start building cities
3. STart using the arcane again, and being okay about others (like humans/draenei/gnomes etc)
4. Accept their highborne caste back, the large group who never stopped using.

They don't change from Kaldorei to Treedorei - because the Long Vigil is an era defined by a purpose, it doesn't fundamentally change the Kaldorei - made from the arcane, fgreatly gifted dark elves, into a new type of elf. No. the new type of elf is the high elf, and later the Nightborne (a new type of Night elf as you love to correct).

The Kaldorei remains the same, just that because of the long years away from it there are not as many Darnassians well precited in it like before, but blizzard shows us that it was popular enough - judging by the scores of studennts, and new mages in Azshara and Desolace, and the volume of NElf npcs that show up as mages now.

[ravenmoon]

And that does not make sense at all. Just because your city or buildinigs are in ruins doesn't make them not yours or not a part of you. Even if you left civilization living like that a long time ago, it is still your civilization. Suramar is how you do things, it's still night elven.

Also, they do have current city (at least till BFA) and they do have arcane wielders, - the lore shows us there are night elves like the Shen'dralar Highborne, the Moonguard and the Nightborne that never stopped wielding the arcane.

One of these groups is with the playable race, many things they had stopped doing they've started doing again, because they can.

Stopping to wield arcane was not some zen redefinition or some magical transformation into nature only elves. That's not their story. Stopping to use the arcane was for one reason only. STOP THE LEGION FROM RETURNING. And because they had to, they couldn't rebuild cities like before or live blike before.

But they humbly and willingsly accepted the changed, relied on nature to support them so they could effectively carry out this task of PREVENTING THE LGION FROM EVER RETURNING.


Once the Legion returns, that is no longer necessary. We see them.
1. Move out of isolation
2. Start building cities
3. STart using the arcane again, and being okay about others (like humans/draenei/gnomes etc)
4. Accept their highborne caste back, the large group who never stopped using.

They don't change from Kaldorei to Treedorei - because the Long Vigil is an era defined by a purpose, it doesn't fundamentally change the Kaldorei - made from the arcane, fgreatly gifted dark elves, into a new type of elf. No. the new type of elf is the high elf, and later the Nightborne (a new type of Night elf as you love to correct).

The Kaldorei remains the same, just that because of the long years away from it there are not as many Darnassians well precited in it like before, but blizzard shows us that it was popular enough - judging by the scores of studennts, and new mages in Azshara and Desolace, and the volume of NElf npcs that show up as mages now.

My feelings are that people get very funny when it comes to elves, I think its a competition thing really. I'm on team red and I am better than you kinda thing.

It is odd though, Blood elves have the enchanted forest and magical city, rangers and magicians alike, with priests etc, but Night elves somehow should only have druids and forests, with savage female priests with worgen like jaws waiting to rip the throats out of their opponents.. laughable, when it gets to that stage, that's not even an elf anymore. BUt yes, some people want night elves to be that.

The thing is that is not what these elves are. they're not just tree folk or savage elves. they're dark elves, some of them love cities and arcane magic, others love forests and nature magic, generally many love both in the pre-sundering era, although the stigma the arcane has took a long itme to start wearing off. I think by the end of Wolfheart, Maiev is the only Night elf known to be hating arcane users and oppose the Highborne..and she is revealed to hate ALL magic users regardless of race or history.

[Beloren]

And that does not make sense at all. Just because your city or buildinigs are in ruins doesn't make them not yours or not a part of you. Even if you left civilization living like that a long time ago, it is still your civilization. Suramar is how you do things, it's still night elven.

Also, they do have current city (at least till BFA) and they do have arcane wielders, - the lore shows us there are night elves like the Shen'dralar Highborne, the Moonguard and the Nightborne that never stopped wielding the arcane.

One of these groups is with the playable race, many things they had stopped doing they've started doing again, because they can.

Stopping to wield arcane was not some zen redefinition or some magical transformation into nature only elves. That's not their story. Stopping to use the arcane was for one reason only. STOP THE LEGION FROM RETURNING. And because they had to, they couldn't rebuild cities like before or live blike before.

But they humbly and willingsly accepted the changed, relied on nature to support them so they could effectively carry out this task of PREVENTING THE LGION FROM EVER RETURNING.


Once the Legion returns, that is no longer necessary. We see them.
1. Move out of isolation
2. Start building cities
3. STart using the arcane again, and being okay about others (like humans/draenei/gnomes etc)
4. Accept their highborne caste back, the large group who never stopped using.

They don't change from Kaldorei to Treedorei - because the Long Vigil is an era defined by a purpose, it doesn't fundamentally change the Kaldorei - made from the arcane, fgreatly gifted dark elves, into a new type of elf. No. the new type of elf is the high elf, and later the Nightborne (a new type of Night elf as you love to correct).

The Kaldorei remains the same, just that because of the long years away from it there are not as many Darnassians well precited in it like before, but blizzard shows us that it was popular enough - judging by the scores of studennts, and new mages in Azshara and Desolace, and the volume of NElf npcs that show up as mages now.

Well because you have access to both, the idea is presumably, if you want that aspect of the night elves, you play the nightborne.

[Mace]

Well because you have access to both, the idea is presumably, if you want that aspect of the night elves, you play the nightborne.

That's b/s. You have acces to both Highmountain and Tauren, so you think the reason Highmoutnain is there is so that those who want the shamanistic/druidic side of the Tauren, most now play Highmoutain because they're new and are around

That can't be the reason, it makes no logical sense and has no support, you want to tell me, they invented Suramar, 20 years ago, all the Night elf lore, and their origin from the arcane, their arcane aptitude, the purple skin and silver eyes that signify the arcane power, incredible cities and apittude for arcane and nature magic, make it a dual theme of the race which is actually what is unique about them (not that they're tradirtional dark elves or forest elves, but they have this duality - not a mixture , but like two contrasting themes side by side that can both work in tandem or in opposition depending on the disposition of the people involted and the story theme.

This is one of the most novel and clever things in Warcraft, and one of the only truly unique innovations, and you mean to tell me that it was all done so night elves could become generic forest or tree elves?

Or all so that they can build Suramar and create the Nightborne to replace that aspect of the Night elves? It doesn't make sense and doesn't follow the logic and pattern of other sub-races. Not one sub-race is somehow a replacement for the main race in anything they do. Highmountain, Mag'har, Lightforged, Void elf, not one of them are replacements for main races, they're just flavour additions having a different look and alternate story to give you a different group of your fave race you can like. Suramar isn't created so that the horde can have night elves and their Arcane legacy. It was created to show more of Night elven history and lore, and give an alternate sub-race, later on they took that sub-race to the horde for very different reasons. It doesn't change that it shows a lot about a side of the night elves that is still a part of Night elves that are Highborne like the Shen'dralar and their recruits, or the Moonguard or the Farondis ghosts.

[DesoPL]

Got one question.



Does it count for highborne? Skin tint i mean.

[matrix123mko]

Got one question.



Does it count for highborne? Skin tint i mean.

Sylvanas gave night elves a nice tan. They better be thankful.

[ravenmoon]

Sylvanas gave night elves a nice tan. They better be thankful.

I hadn't thought it might be Sylvanas dark ranger colour - i auto assumed it was the Azshara skin tone without the make up. Hmm. interesting.

[Moonrage]

I hadn't thought it might be Sylvanas dark ranger colour - i auto assumed it was the Azshara skin tone without the make up. Hmm. interesting.

This isn’t a Dark Ranger color. Dark Rangers are very pale, almost white.

[matrix123mko]

I hadn't thought it might be Sylvanas dark ranger colour - i auto assumed it was the Azshara skin tone without the make up. Hmm. interesting.

It is too dark for Azshara for sure. Also, I didn't want to allude to dark rangers. I wanted to joke about night elves being overcooked in Teldrassil BBQ.

[Astranea]

For my characters, I always just gave them the palest skin option and white hair to make them how I always pictured Highborne to look.

That is indeed how most of the old Highborne NPCs were made by Blizzard as well. Not all of them... but most.

[Rozz]

I was certain that the dark ashen color was in reference to dark trolls, the polar opposite of Highborne options. That being said, I love it!